Fear and loathing in DC

[turtlespeed 226]

airdvr

***
I don't think their profits are obscene - just very, very, very large. Let's compare:

Federal funding for climate change research in 2013 - $2.5 billion

Profit of just one oil company in 2013 (Exxon) - $36 billion

So yes, when just one company makes over ten times more in profit than we spend on climate change research, then that chart is quite accurate (although the captions are hyperbolic.)

2.5 Billion for research? Why limit it to just research? I'm thinking it's just a bit more than that.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/assets/legislative_reports/fcce-report-to-congress.pdf

2.5 billion, 25 billion, what difference does that make??

Hmmm, that sounds familiar . . .

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[DanG 1]

Sure, so we'll use $25B. Of course, that includes international assistance, and tax credits for the use of cleaner energy, which have nothing to do with bribing scientists to lie about climate change. That's still less than the profit of one oil company (a company that likely receives some of that $25B in tax credits).

Are you still saying that the big money is climate science is on the "alarmist" side?

- Dan G

[Amazon 7]

DanG

Sure, so we'll use $25B. Of course, that includes international assistance, and tax credits for the use of cleaner energy, which have nothing to do with bribing scientists to lie about climate change. That's still less than the profit of one oil company (a company that likely receives some of that $25B in tax credits).

Are you still saying that the big money is climate science is on the "alarmist" side?

Wait for it...... those who work for those who are paying to scuttle climate change research with "unsettled science" claims... will be checking the company newsletters for the correct talking points.

[airdvr 210]

DanG

Sure, so we'll use $25B. Of course, that includes international assistance, and tax credits for the use of cleaner energy, which have nothing to do with bribing scientists to lie about climate change. That's still less than the profit of one oil company (a company that likely receives some of that $25B in tax credits).

Are you still saying that the big money is climate science is on the "alarmist" side?

i say spend it. It's only 25B, a mere drop in the bucket. I just wanted to make sure it was understood that it's not 2.5B we're talking about. Hell, we went 300 billion more in debt yesterday. What difference does it make?

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[billvon 3,110]

>2.5 Billion for research? Why limit it to just research? I'm thinking it's just a bit
>more than that.

Fair enough; we'll expand it to every federal climate related expense, including things like solar incentives.

And likewise we won't limit it to just Exxon; we will go with the profits of all the oil and coal companies. And the companies that rely on those products - the automotive, truck, railroad and aviation industries. And the companies (Halliburton et al) who provide support services for fossil fuel related activities. In other words, all the money out there that is put at risk if the deniers lose.

You want to make THAT comparison? No? I didn't think so.

[rushmc 23]

Oh oh

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/06/10/Why-the-West-Antarctic-Ice-Sheet-is-really-melting-And-no-not-climate-change

Quote

The cause of climate alarmism has suffered yet another devastating setback: new research suggests that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet is not, after all disappearing due to man-made global warming, but because it has a volcano underneath.

For years, the melting of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet (which, by the way, has been happening for around 20,000 years) has been cited by green activists as proof that man-made global warming is dangerous and real and that unless we act now to rein in carbon dioxide emissions we'll soon resemble Waterworld.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Lol, yes a resounding devastating blow!!!

Quote

The geothermal heat contributed significantly to melting of the underside of the glacier, and it might be a key factor in allowing the ice sheet to slide, affecting the ice sheet's stability and its contribution to future sea level rise.

The cause of the variable distribution of heat beneath the glacier is thought to be the movement of magma and associated volcanic activity arising from the rifting of the Earth's crust beneath the West Antarctic Ice Sheet.

That is some clear evidence.

I love how you are always claiming that the science behind Climate Change is not strong. Then this is what you post as a rebuttal? This is what you call science that delivers a devastating blow?

[rehmwa 2]

This'll be disputed immediately. The religions AGW proponents will immediately state that the "movement of magma and associated volcanic activity arising from the rifting of the Earth's crust beneath the West Antarctic Ice Sheet"....

ready for it?



is CAUSED by global warming


Check......and........mate

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/06/29/antarctica-sets-new-record-for-sea-ice-extent/

Quote

The sea ice surrounding Antarctica, which, as I reported in my book, has been steadily increasing throughout the period of satellite measurement that began in 1979, has hit a new all-time record high for areal coverage.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

First the ice extent and now this
kallend's have a bad month

Quote

NOAA Reinstates July 1936 As The Hottest Month On Record

http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/30/noaa-quietly-reinstates-july-1936-as-the-hottest-month-on-record/

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[turtlespeed 226]

rushmc

First the ice extent and now this
kallend's have a bad month

Quote

NOAA Reinstates July 1936 As The Hottest Month On Record

http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/30/noaa-quietly-reinstates-july-1936-as-the-hottest-month-on-record/

Oh - Come ON! You didn't know he called that one too?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[kallend 2,146]

rushmc

First the ice extent and now this
kallend's have a bad month

Quote

NOAA Reinstates July 1936 As The Hottest Month On Record

http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/30/noaa-quietly-reinstates-july-1936-as-the-hottest-month-on-record/

One month doesn't make a climate, and the USA isn't the world. And even Anthony Watts' graph shows an increasing trend line.

You may recall that the US had a very cold winter this year. Yet GLOBALLY the temperature was UP.

So once again the stuff you link doesn't mean what you want it to mean.

But you knew that. You just don't wish to understand it, because....
...
...

It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 2,146]

rushmc

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/06/29/antarctica-sets-new-record-for-sea-ice-extent/

Quote

The sea ice surrounding Antarctica, which, as I reported in my book, has been steadily increasing throughout the period of satellite measurement that began in 1979, has hit a new all-time record high for areal coverage.

"The most common misconception regarding Antarctic sea ice is that sea ice is increasing because it's cooling around Antarctica. The reality is the Southern Ocean surrounding Antarctica has shown strong warming over the same period that sea ice has been increasing. Globally from 1955 to 1995, oceans have been warming at 0.1°C per decade. In contrast, the Southern Ocean (specifically the region where Antarctic sea ice forms) has been warming at 0.17°C per decade. Not only is the Southern Ocean warming, it's warming faster than the global trend. This warming trend is apparent in satellite measurements of temperature trends over Antarctica:"

"Another contributor is changes in ocean circulation. The Southern Ocean consists of a layer of cold water near the surface and a layer of warmer water below. Water from the warmer layer rises up to the surface, melting sea ice. However, as air temperatures warm, the amount of rain and snowfall also increases. This freshens the surface waters, leading to a surface layer less dense than the saltier, warmer water below. The layers become more stratified and mix less. Less heat is transported upwards from the deeper, warmer layer. Hence less sea ice is melted (Zhang 2007).

Antarctic sea ice is complex and counter-intuitive. Despite warming waters, complicated factors unique to the Antarctic region have combined to increase sea ice production. The simplistic interpretation that it's caused by cooling is false."

Source (with data): www.skepticalscience.com/increasing-Antarctic-Southern-sea-ice-intermediate.htm

As usual, you simply don't understand the articles you link.

But then, your salary depends on that.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 3,110]

Sorry deniers, this may sting a bit -

===========
Gov’t Report Cites Climate Change as a Threat to Military Installations’ ‘Readiness’
Jul. 1, 2014

The government has already considered the threat that climate change could pose to the military’s operations, but its latest report reveals “actual impacts” that could be indicative of what installations could face as a result of global warming.

Officials from the Government Accountability Office visited Department of Defense sites and noted examples where the effects of climate change could impact its “readiness” and leave the military vulnerable.

“For example, according to DOD officials, the combination of thawing permafrost, decreasing sea ice, and rising sea levels on the Alaskan coast has increased coastal erosion at several Air Force radar early warning and communication installations,” the GAO noted. “Impacts on DOD’s infrastructure from this erosion have included damaged roads, seawalls and runways. In addition, officials on a Navy installation told GAO that sea level rise and resulting storm surge are the two largest threats to their waterfront infrastructure. For instance, they are concerned about possible storm surge during work on a submarine that will be cut in half while sitting in a dry dock. Officials explained that if salt water floods the submarine’s systems, it could result in severe damage.”
. . .
The report —Climate Change Adaptation: DOD Can Improve Infrastructure Planning and Processes to Better Account for Potential Impacts — said that the DOD has already begun to assess the vulnerability of installations against the potential impact of climate change and what could be one to adapt to these effects. But the GAO wrote the defense department could face limitations in that some of its plans are not fully developed and such projects are rarely proposed as military construction projects.
=====================

[rushmc 23]

billvon

Sorry deniers, this may sting a bit -

===========
Gov’t Report Cites Climate Change as a Threat to Military Installations’ ‘Readiness’
Jul. 1, 2014

The government has already considered the threat that climate change could pose to the military’s operations, but its latest report reveals “actual impacts” that could be indicative of what installations could face as a result of global warming.

Officials from the Government Accountability Office visited Department of Defense sites and noted examples where the effects of climate change could impact its “readiness” and leave the military vulnerable.

“For example, according to DOD officials, the combination of thawing permafrost, decreasing sea ice, and rising sea levels on the Alaskan coast has increased coastal erosion at several Air Force radar early warning and communication installations,” the GAO noted. “Impacts on DOD’s infrastructure from this erosion have included damaged roads, seawalls and runways. In addition, officials on a Navy installation told GAO that sea level rise and resulting storm surge are the two largest threats to their waterfront infrastructure. For instance, they are concerned about possible storm surge during work on a submarine that will be cut in half while sitting in a dry dock. Officials explained that if salt water floods the submarine’s systems, it could result in severe damage.”
. . .
The report —Climate Change Adaptation: DOD Can Improve Infrastructure Planning and Processes to Better Account for Potential Impacts — said that the DOD has already begun to assess the vulnerability of installations against the potential impact of climate change and what could be one to adapt to these effects. But the GAO wrote the defense department could face limitations in that some of its plans are not fully developed and such projects are rarely proposed as military construction projects.
=====================

not really
the gov is creating the manipulated data it uses to support this
No real surprise here

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

I guess there is a reason you do not link your sources

From another place is your partioall posted report

Quote

The GAO acknowledged in its video that any single weather event cannot necessarily be linked to climate change, but it said that these events can give “insight into the potential climate-related vulnerabilities.”

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 3,110]

>the gov is creating the manipulated data it uses to support this

Ah, so now the US military is a liberal organization. (Would explain the right wing's new "some men left behind" approach I guess.)

>"The GAO acknowledged in its video that any single weather event cannot
>necessarily be linked to climate change . . . "

You're right! I guess you're feeling pretty stupid about posting this, then:

"NOAA Reinstates July 1936 As The Hottest Month On Record"

[rushmc 23]

billvon

>the gov is creating the manipulated data it uses to support this

Ah, so now the US military is a liberal organization. (Would explain the right wing's new "some men left behind" approach I guess.)

>"The GAO acknowledged in its video that any single weather event cannot
>necessarily be linked to climate change . . . "

You're right! I guess you're feeling pretty stupid about posting this, then:

"NOAA Reinstates July 1936 As The Hottest Month On Record"

Just demostrates they got caught data messaging




again

So I feel just fine

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[GeorgiaDon 379]

Quote

Just demostrates they got caught data messaging

Isn't that just "texting"?

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Stumpy 284]

billvon

Sorry deniers, this may sting a bit -

===========
Gov’t Report Cites Climate Change as a Threat to Military Installations’ ‘Readiness’
Jul. 1, 2014

The government has already considered the threat that climate change could pose to the military’s operations, but its latest report reveals “actual impacts” that could be indicative of what installations could face as a result of global warming.

Officials from the Government Accountability Office visited Department of Defense sites and noted examples where the effects of climate change could impact its “readiness” and leave the military vulnerable.

“For example, according to DOD officials, the combination of thawing permafrost, decreasing sea ice, and rising sea levels on the Alaskan coast has increased coastal erosion at several Air Force radar early warning and communication installations,” the GAO noted. “Impacts on DOD’s infrastructure from this erosion have included damaged roads, seawalls and runways. In addition, officials on a Navy installation told GAO that sea level rise and resulting storm surge are the two largest threats to their waterfront infrastructure. For instance, they are concerned about possible storm surge during work on a submarine that will be cut in half while sitting in a dry dock. Officials explained that if salt water floods the submarine’s systems, it could result in severe damage.”
. . .
The report —Climate Change Adaptation: DOD Can Improve Infrastructure Planning and Processes to Better Account for Potential Impacts — said that the DOD has already begun to assess the vulnerability of installations against the potential impact of climate change and what could be one to adapt to these effects. But the GAO wrote the defense department could face limitations in that some of its plans are not fully developed and such projects are rarely proposed as military construction projects.
=====================

I saw this story the other day. I think its quite unfair of the dastardly liberal plot that they are actually finding people who are already genuinely affected by climate change and spoiling things with all these facts.

Quote

http://mashable.com/2014/06/30/virginia-officials-accomplish-the-impossible-a-bipartisan-sea-level-rise-discussion/

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[billvon 3,110]

==============
In an area where 46% of the local economy comes from federal defense spending, ensuring the continued viability of the military facilities is an urgent priority, participants said. “We’re here today because of the long-term vitality of the Hampton Roads area,” Kaine said.
==============

Remarkable how even staunch conservatives drop the denier thing when they realize climate change might actually affect _them._

[rushmc 23]

billvon

==============
In an area where 46% of the local economy comes from federal defense spending, ensuring the continued viability of the military facilities is an urgent priority, participants said. “We’re here today because of the long-term vitality of the Hampton Roads area,” Kaine said.
==============

Remarkable how even staunch conservatives drop the denier thing when they realize climate change politics might actually affect _them._

FIFY

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

Are you claiming that sea levels are not rising? It seems like you've gone back to denying the climate is changing at all, as opposed to denying it is influenced by man.

- Dan G

[Amazon 7]

DanG

Are you claiming that sea levels are not rising? It seems like you've gone back to denying the climate is changing at all, as opposed to denying it is influenced by man.

Hey.. how could he possibly see that sea level rise... he lives in Iowa.

Kinda like when I brought up the changes in all the mountain glaciers that are now gone... in the mountains just a few miles from my house. Its mighty hard to see any problem at all from Iowa or the from the locations of other vociferous deniers here in SC in Texas or Okielahoma..

[billvon 3,110]

It was Upton Sinclair who said "It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his job depends on not understanding it." We have seen that example in you. With the news from Virginia we see the corollary - when conservatives realize that their job might _depend_ on understanding something, they seem to suddenly get science.