GeorgiaDon 380 #26 April 20, 2014 I don't disagree with what you wrote. However I'm curious about what you would advise a client who won a judgement against someone in court, and the losing party refused to comply with the court order and threatened to shoot anyone who tried to enforce the order. Would you tell your client to just forget about it and move on? Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #27 April 20, 2014 lawrocket******Bottom Line: You lost your case. Now, you're whining about it by starting another Thread... Negative. Bundy is almost certainly going to ultimately lose, but that is also not the point of this thread. It's about the anarchist attitudes. Clive Bundy is like Oliver North. Oliver North was a criminal who should have gone to prison. Problem: the government decided to put on a public kangaroo court, looked arbitrary and wanted to use him to send a message and within a couple of days he was viewed as a hero BECAUSE he stood up to a senate and wouldn't put up with their posturing crap. Here's an idea: the government cuts off the paramilitary SWAT shit for everything. Here's another idea: the government doesn't set up limited First Amendment zones (exception: military bases). Another idea - the government is open and allows filming of whatever it's doing. Big point - the government is second to pull out the guns. ...and must march in a straight line and wear red. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #28 April 20, 2014 Quote...and must march in a straight line and wear red. Precisely. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #29 April 20, 2014 PiLFyQuote...and must march in a straight line and wear red. Precisely. In reading Lawrocket's post, it brought to mind that quote from an old Bill Cosby record; "Why is There Air?" Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #30 April 20, 2014 Did that happen? My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #31 April 20, 2014 RonD1120*********Bottom line, the guy is a tax cheat and is being glorified by people who ought to really hate that sort of thing. Yes, this Bundy affair resulted in a large number of posters here who now have no business complaining about welfare queens for the foreseeable future. Uh that is SOOO not going to happen The posters here who ascribe to all the tenants of the Teanderthal Party are incapable of exhibiting that amount of rationality. There is no rationality in your premise. It is a juxtaposition of concepts. One concept is the fraudulent use of tax dollars by sucking welfare. The other is the refusal to provide tax dollars for fraudulent use. Kelpdiver missed it also. Uh sorry but USE FEES are not taxation... Thousands of Americans all thru the west pay for the right to use public lands. Freeloaders on the other hand.. are just criminals trying to get something for nothing while making a nice tidy profit by stealing from the American people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 380 #32 April 20, 2014 lawrocketDid that happen?Yes. Here is (in part) the order of the court, which you can read at the end of this article. IV. CONCLUSION IT IS HEREBY ORDERED that the United States’ Motion for Summary Judgment (#18)is GRANTED. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that defendant Cliven Bundy’s Motion to Dismiss (#28) is DENIED as moot. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that Bundy is permanently enjoined from trespassing onthe New Trespass Lands. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that the United States is entitled to protect the NewTrespass Lands against this trespass, and all future trespasses by Bundy. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that Bundy shall remove his livestock from the NewTrespass Lands within 45 days of the date hereof, and that the United States is entitled to seize and remove to impound any of Bundy’s cattle that remain in trespass after 45 days of the date hereof. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that the United States is entitled to seize and remove to impound any of Bundy’s cattle for any future trespasses, provided the United States has provided notice to Bundy under the governing regulations of the United States Department of the Interior. DATED this ____ day of July, 2013. Also from the article: "When asked in deposition what reaction the Bundy family would have should an impoundment occur, Cliven said he’d do “whatever it takes” to include physical force to stop such action." Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #33 April 20, 2014 RonD1120 There is no rationality in your premise. It is a juxtaposition of concepts. One concept is the fraudulent use of tax dollars by sucking welfare. The other is the refusal to provide tax dollars for fraudulent use. Kelpdiver missed it also. No, it's exactly the same thing - people wanting freebies. In this case, he's taken over a million dollars worth in the past 20 years, while a welfare queen might only get 200k in that time. He could argue that up till the law change or the court orders, there was uncertainty, but since then he's been sucking on the government teat. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #34 April 20, 2014 kelpdiver*** There is no rationality in your premise. It is a juxtaposition of concepts. One concept is the fraudulent use of tax dollars by sucking welfare. The other is the refusal to provide tax dollars for fraudulent use. Kelpdiver missed it also. No, it's exactly the same thing - people wanting freebies. In this case, he's taken over a million dollars worth in the past 20 years, while a welfare queen might only get 200k in that time. He could argue that up till the law change or the court orders, there was uncertainty, but since then he's been sucking on the government teat. OK, I see your point now. And the same for Amazon.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #35 April 20, 2014 "Uh sorry but USE FEES are not taxation... Thousands of Americans all thru the west pay for the right to use public lands. Freeloaders on the other hand.. are just criminals trying to get something for nothing while making a nice tidy profit by stealing from the American people." The Feds are hiding behind this principle to steal land & livlihoods from area ranchers. If anyone has the right to be angered by Bundy's refusal to pay the user fees. It's all the neighbor ranchers who did pay, & were forced out of business, & off they're own lands because of it. Yet, those Ranchers are all standing tall w/Bundy. That speaks volumes. Certainly more than the lot of Ass Hats around here, squawkin about a principle perverted by known amoral thieves... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
regulator 0 #36 April 20, 2014 quade***Bottom Line: You lost your case. Now, you're whining about it by starting another Thread... Negative. Bundy is almost certainly going to ultimately lose, but that is also not the point of this thread. It's about the anarchist attitudes. Quade...take this picture and stick it where the rest of your whiny ass attitude resides. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #37 April 20, 2014 Wow. You're so awesome to stand up for a criminal like that and do it with so much macho bravado. It almost makes this entire thread meaningless.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #38 April 20, 2014 quadeWow. You're so awesome to stand up for a criminal like that and do it with so much macho bravado. It almost makes this entire thread meaningless. I don't know, I think it kind of proves your point."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #39 April 20, 2014 PiLFy"Uh sorry but USE FEES are not taxation... Thousands of Americans all thru the west pay for the right to use public lands. Freeloaders on the other hand.. are just criminals trying to get something for nothing while making a nice tidy profit by stealing from the American people." The Feds are hiding behind this principle to steal land & livlihoods from area ranchers. If anyone has the right to be angered by Bundy's refusal to pay the user fees. It's all the neighbor ranchers who did pay, & were forced out of business, & off they're own lands because of it. Yet, those Ranchers are all standing tall w/Bundy. That speaks volumes. Certainly more than the lot of Ass Hats around here, squawkin about a principle perverted by known amoral thieves... You do know that it was started by Saint Ronald right??? Thousands of ranchers across the country get to pay for the right to TAKE from the public lands and profit from grazing their animals on OUR LAND. Thousands more bid on the RIGHT to log public lands... and on and on. It is not a new concept.. that it seems only the right wing seems incapable of understanding... PAY for what you USE. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #40 April 20, 2014 wolfriverjoe***Wow. You're so awesome to stand up for a criminal like that and do it with so much macho bravado. It almost makes this entire thread meaningless. I don't know, I think it kind of proves your point. How many citizens in the USA get to aim weapons at LEO's and live???? Damn few that's how many... most get to die in a hail of lead anytime they try.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #41 April 20, 2014 wolfriverjoe***Wow. You're so awesome to stand up for a criminal like that and do it with so much macho bravado. It almost makes this entire thread meaningless. I don't know, I think it kind of proves your point. Yep.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #43 April 20, 2014 Amazon ***"Uh sorry but USE FEES are not taxation... Thousands of Americans all thru the west pay for the right to use public lands. Freeloaders on the other hand.. are just criminals trying to get something for nothing while making a nice tidy profit by stealing from the American people." The Feds are hiding behind this principle to steal land & livlihoods from area ranchers. If anyone has the right to be angered by Bundy's refusal to pay the user fees. It's all the neighbor ranchers who did pay, & were forced out of business, & off they're own lands because of it. Yet, those Ranchers are all standing tall w/Bundy. That speaks volumes. Certainly more than the lot of Ass Hats around here, squawkin about a principle perverted by known amoral thieves... You do know that it was started by Saint Ronald right??? Thousands of ranchers across the country get to pay for the right to TAKE from the public lands and profit from grazing their animals on OUR LAND. Thousands more bid on the RIGHT to log public lands... and on and on. It is not a new concept.. that it seems only the right wing seems incapable of understanding... PAY for what you USE. Reagan was no saint to me. I don't believe in those, anyway... Logging is an entirely different industry. Allowing Cattle to graze does virtually no damage to the land, & actually helps those precious Toitles. I understand the concept perfectly. I also understand how the Feds corrupt the concept, like almost everything else they put their paws in, to further their own agendas. The future is going to hold food shortages. The last thing this fouled up Country needs to do, is force the remaining ranches & farms out of business. By your rationale, the US Govt.'s genocide against the Native American Peoples was OK because we gave them some crappy land, subsidies, & let them sell smokes w/o sales tax ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #44 April 20, 2014 PiLFy ******"Uh sorry but USE FEES are not taxation... Thousands of Americans all thru the west pay for the right to use public lands. Freeloaders on the other hand.. are just criminals trying to get something for nothing while making a nice tidy profit by stealing from the American people." The Feds are hiding behind this principle to steal land & livlihoods from area ranchers. If anyone has the right to be angered by Bundy's refusal to pay the user fees. It's all the neighbor ranchers who did pay, & were forced out of business, & off they're own lands because of it. Yet, those Ranchers are all standing tall w/Bundy. That speaks volumes. Certainly more than the lot of Ass Hats around here, squawkin about a principle perverted by known amoral thieves... You do know that it was started by Saint Ronald right??? Thousands of ranchers across the country get to pay for the right to TAKE from the public lands and profit from grazing their animals on OUR LAND. Thousands more bid on the RIGHT to log public lands... and on and on. It is not a new concept.. that it seems only the right wing seems incapable of understanding... PAY for what you USE. Reagan was no saint to me. I don't believe in those, anyway... Logging is an entirely different industry. Allowing Cattle to graze does virtually no damage to the land, & actually helps those precious Toitles. I understand the concept perfectly. I also understand how the Feds corrupt the concept, like almost everything else they put their paws in, to further their own agendas. The future is going to hold food shortages. The last thing this fouled up Country needs to do, is force the remaining ranches & farms out of business. By your rationale, the US Govt.'s genocide against the Native American Peoples was OK because we gave them some crappy land, subsidies, & let them sell smokes w/o sales tax ... Your grasp of history is indeed.... staggering. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #45 April 20, 2014 Not to mention how laws and user fees work.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #46 April 20, 2014 Quote"Your grasp of history is indeed.... staggering." I like reading about history. You've another bone to pick? Speak on it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #47 April 20, 2014 quadeNot to mention how laws and user fees work. Thought You were still cramming that picture somewhere?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #48 April 20, 2014 PiLFy***Not to mention how laws and user fees work. Thought You were still cramming that picture somewhere?? I thought to you this day was sacred and should be spent with your relatives? Why are you even on-line?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #49 April 20, 2014 PiLFy Quote"Your grasp of history is indeed.... staggering." I like reading about history. You've another bone to pick? Speak on it. I think your point is clear.... that you are unwilling to respect the laws of our country or any of the processes that we as a people have fought for. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PiLFy 3 #50 April 20, 2014 Quote "I think your point is clear.... that you are unwilling to respect the laws of our country or any of the processes that we as a people have fought for." Then, You've entirely missed my point. I never figured you for being so dense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
