"We the people .... " has never been true and never will be...

[Amazon 7]

Hey at least we are not Canadians... and apologizing for being brash

[shropshire 0]

Amazon

Hey at least we are not Canadians... and apologizing for being brash

bwhaaaaaaaaaa

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[D22369 0]

Quote

Maybe we should just shoot them all, right? You have a lot of nerve writing off the sacrifices made by millions of our citizens over the last two hundred plus years to support that bit written on the Statue of Liberty.
You remember that girl sitting in New York harbor, right? She has something to say, and for some weird reason it seems to attract people when they feel at their lowest, their most oppressed.





'Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free...'

Maybe we should either tear it down, or live up to the creed it presents to the world. No use being phony about it. You can't have it both ways.

is there something in the water? where did you get that crap? sure wasn't from anything I wrote.
can you see the problems our country has?
Think about it for a bit - there are many.

nahhh it will be more fun to break it down for you
since I have "a lot of nerve" I'm gonna do just that.

1) perfect union... laughingly incorrect - perhaps once it was but now we have a two party system entrenched who will do anything to stay in power including destroy this country.

2) justice - not really when the rich and famous can get a slap on the wrist for something that you would spend years in prison for - whatever happened to "all men are created equal" - I wonder...

3 domestic tranquility - lets look to the Rodney king riots - lets look at race baiting - hell just a week ago there was an incident where a white guy hit a small black child in his auto - look it up - not to leave out people beating and torturing someone who just happens to be attracted to the same sex - http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/04/03/driver-assaulted-by-crowd-after-hitting-boy-clings-to-life/7285575/ people are using race and sexual orientation as excuses to violence others.

4) Common defense - with our borders working about as good as a sieve do you not think an enemy would exploit this to bring in men and equipment?


quite a few years ago I took an oath to protect this country from enemies foreign and domestic - nowhere in that oath did it say I had to remain blind, and nowhere in it was a clause releasing me from it when I left the service.

Roy

They say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it.

[D22369 0]

Hey at least we are not Canadians... and apologizing for being brash
***

hmmm, never met a brash canook, ... what are they like?

Roy

They say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it.

[PiLFy 3]

shropshire

Once again it was not troll .. your clear lack on understanding of this (and other) conversations - says way more about you.

If you don't like it .... well, that's your problem not mine.

It's no trouble

[PiLFy 3]

Then, why are you taking shots at my country, & not your own? Wanna find trouble in paradise? You've got plenty of your own.

You don't care a fig about America? OK. Then look out your window, & criticize your own backyard.

[jakee 1,596]

Quote

Then, why are you taking shots at my country,

Am I?

Quote

You don't care a fig about America?

No, I said I don't care about the revolution. I know that the whole 'FU King George' thing that you mentioned is the most important event in your history and is a major part of your cultural identity but your mistake is in thinking that the feeling is reciprocated. Losing the colonies is not part of our cultural identity, it's not even part of our collective memory. As a nation we've simply forgotten about it.

It's why you're absolutely wrong when you look at the Declaration as a reason for Shrop's criticism of the Constitution. I don't know what his motive is, I do know that it's not what you think it is.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[PiLFy 3]

Quote

"We the people .... " has never been true and never will be...
...."

"discuss[Tongue]"

Looks like a clear taunt to me. Most People who want to start a serious discourse on something, won't begin w/a "". It was a Troll. Not having the stones to own it, makes it a spineless Troll...

Quote

Then, why are you taking shots at my country,

"Am I?"

Yes, you two are. Inferring that a sacrosanct document isn't worth the paper it's written on, is exactly that. You want to look for fallacies, & stir a political pot? Fine. Stick to your own Country's woes. Britain has plenty of its own troubles. You've no business opining on ours.

Quote

"I know that the whole 'FU King George' thing that you mentioned is the most important event in your history and is a major part of your cultural identity but your mistake is in thinking that the feeling is reciprocated."

Don't tute your horns. It wasn't the most important event in this county's history. It is most definitely a proud part of our shared cultural identity, though, & rightly so. You've moved on, Jakee? Good for you. Then, kindly refrain from sticking your two pence where they don't belong.

[jakee 1,596]

Quote

Looks like a clear taunt to me.

Newsflash bro, he's not me.

Quote

Don't tute your horns.

I don't know what that means.

Quote

You've moved on, Jakee? Good for you. Then, kindly refrain from sticking your two pence where they don't belong.

Do you understand the difference between past and present?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[turtlespeed 226]

shropshire

WTF .. it's not about comparing to other countries .. LOOK INSIDE, what do YOU see?

I see a country that will knock yours down in a fight.

Hell - we saved your ass at least once . . .

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[PiLFy 3]

Quote

Looks like a clear taunt to me.

"Newsflash bro, he's not me."

You said it wasn't a Troll. I provided the original post. Besides, y'all look alike to us .

Quote

Don't tute your horns.

"I don't know what that means."

= Don't self-aggrandize.

Quote

You've moved on, Jakee? Good for you. Then, kindly refrain from sticking your two pence where they don't belong.

"Do you understand the difference between past and present?"

Certainly. You weren't a US Citizen in the past, & you aren't one, now. Keep your political critiques to your own country. If I were to broach the subject of some sensitive political nature concerning Britain, or any other country. I would do so cautiously, & w/an extra helping of respect. Otherwise, my innocent query might be construed as being insulting.

You DO still speak some version of English over there, right? Other than one slang reference, I've typed clearly worded replies. You've no business critically opining on my country.

[PiLFy 3]

turtlespeed

***WTF .. it's not about comparing to other countries .. LOOK INSIDE, what do YOU see?

I see a country that will knock yours down in a fight.

Hell - we saved your ass at least once . . .

We saved their Butts TWICE in the last century, not counting Cold War activities. Friends who travel far more than I tell me that of all the European nations, only Holland still remembers & honors what we did for them. Nice people, the Dutch. I'd love to visit, sometime.

[wmw999 2,589]

You're looking through a "they're attacking me" glass, when instead you should be looking through a beer glass.

If nothing else, why does it matter? If they're trolling, don't respond. If they're not, then read their words, and not what you infer from them.

If you take the DOI and Constitution as sacred, then you fail to consider the as the FF's probably intended. After all, there was a lot of discussion then, too.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[shropshire 0]

wmw999

You're looking through a "they're attacking me" glass, when instead you should be looking through a beer glass.

If nothing else, why does it matter? If they're trolling, don't respond. If they're not, then read their words, and not what you infer from them.

If you take the DOI and Constitution as sacred, then you fail to consider the as the FF's probably intended. After all, there was a lot of discussion then, too.

Wendy P.

Exactly Wendy.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[shropshire 0]

RobertMBlevins

******Because that's where it started, & the Troll is British.

Right....

I think there's something that you and Quade and a few other Americans don't understand about the general British view of American history: we simply don't care. Honestly and truthfully, you would find it incredibly difficult to find a British man on the street who bears any sort of grudge, humorous or serious, over the War of Independance. Heck, most people probably don't even know it was us you were fighting against.

Britain simply has too much history for us to get worked up about every country or colony we've ever fallen out with. America? Don't care. India? Don't care. Spain? Don't care. South Africa? Don't care. The only two countries that any reasonable number of people in Britain 'dislike' for historical reasons are France and Germany. That's it.

When it comes to America, the secret is that we actually quite like it. It's big and brash and loud and that's pretty cool. We dislike a lot of Americans because you're big and brash and loud, but that's another story

I don't think you are a troll. In fact, that's a pretty honest assessment. It's always been amazing to me that Britain and the Colonies separated after a bloody war, and yet Britain ended up our biggest ally afterward. I love Brits, and I think their NHS health care system beats Obamacare by a mile.

Battle of Britain is my favorite war film. Americans whine about 9-11, which was bad of course, but they sometimes forget Brits stood against the Germans for more than two straight months of bombing and beat the pants off the Germans in the end anyway. Later, they beat off the V-1 and V-2 rocket attacks as well. When you look up the word 'tough' in the dictionary you'll probably find a picture-map of Britain there. You gotta love it.
Thanks... but again it's not about comparing countries it's about looking inside. Yes We have problems ... everyone does..

But "We the people ... " did NOT include all of the people of the country THEN and it does not appear to still ... Why? Why are there disenfranchised or under represented people. Do The People have a REAL say in the governing of the country OR are they just irrelevance.. When was the last time that The People had a major effect or influence on anything.

The USA is being used in this example because it has a document that explicitly states "We the People" ... most countries do not.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[shropshire 0]

PiLFy

Most People who want to start a serious discourse on something, won't begin w/a "". It was a Troll. Not having the stones to own it, makes it a spineless Troll...

YAWN..

PiLFy

Yes, you two are. Inferring that a sacrosanct document isn't worth the paper it's written on, is exactly that. You want to look for fallacies, & stir a political pot? Fine. Stick to your own Country's woes. Britain has plenty of its own troubles. You've no business opining on ours.

Oh do grow up.

Quote

Then, kindly refrain from sticking your two pence where they don't belong.

What The actual fuck??? EVERYONE has the right to talk about ANYTHING.... Don't like it? Well throw another "mom, the other boys are picking on me...." hissy fit , I for one couldn't give 2 shits (it's your blood pressure at risk, not mine).

Your analysis and input to this thread is way off the mark, but it really doesn't matter to me. I'm bored of your paranoid, "my country right or wrong" guff now.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[jakee 1,596]

Quote

You said it wasn't a Troll.

When?

Quote

= Don't self-aggrandize.

Does it? So what does "tute" mean?

Quote

If I were to broach the subject of some sensitive political nature concerning Britain, or any other country. I would do so cautiously, & w/an extra helping of respect.

That I would pay to see!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

I think there's something that you and Quade and a few other Americans don't understand about the general British view of American history: we simply don't care.

LOL!!!

My wife is English. We met in Edinburgh. One of my phrases to her is - The Scots hate the English, the Welsh hate the English, and the English don't care. Invariably her reply is - That's right, we don't.

We are all engines of karma

[shropshire 0]

TeHe .. and a lot of us just can not see why some people get so bent out of shape and take it personally if the merest whiff of 'perceived' descent is uttered about them.... I need to buy shares in blood pressure tablets.. I'll make a killing.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[kallend 2,151]

turtlespeed

***WTF .. it's not about comparing to other countries .. LOOK INSIDE, what do YOU see?

I see a country that will knock yours down in a fight.

Hell - we saved your ass at least once . . .

Who burned whose capital in 1814?

And when did the supposed "save" take place? The only serious invasion threats the British faced since 1066 were in 1485, 1805 and 1940. In 1940 the US Ambassador (Joe Kennedy) told Roosevelt NOT to send help, and the US refused to supply high octane aviation fuel for the RAF. The 5 US citizens who actually fought with the RAF in 1940 were subject to arrest in the USA for violating neutrality laws.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

PiLFy

******WTF .. it's not about comparing to other countries .. LOOK INSIDE, what do YOU see?

I see a country that will knock yours down in a fight.

Hell - we saved your ass at least once . . .

We saved their Butts TWICE in the last century, not counting Cold War activities. Friends who travel far more than I tell me that of all the European nations, only Holland still remembers & honors what we did for them. Nice people, the Dutch. I'd love to visit, sometime.

Lol

Just sew a Canadian flag on your backpack before you do.

[champu 1]

wmw999

But power is one of the most powerful substances there is-

More to the point of the thread though, I think "We the people" as individuals wield about as much power as we choose to, and that obviously varies greatly from person to person and over time. As I've lamented here like a broken record recently, I think we're in a phase where most people have been convinced by pundits and politicians to wield that power by voting as many of "their guys" into as many offices as they can and then to stop paying attention.

When people succumb to this brand loyalty towards political parties and forget that their representatives have phone numbers and mailing addresses and public meetings you can go to rather than just a letter next to their name then they choose not to wield any meaningful power at all.

[turtlespeed 226]

SkyDekker

*********WTF .. it's not about comparing to other countries .. LOOK INSIDE, what do YOU see?

I see a country that will knock yours down in a fight.

Hell - we saved your ass at least once . . .

We saved their Butts TWICE in the last century, not counting Cold War activities. Friends who travel far more than I tell me that of all the European nations, only Holland still remembers & honors what we did for them. Nice people, the Dutch. I'd love to visit, sometime.

Lol

Just sew a Canadian flag on your backpack before you do.

Ha - and make them assume we are retarded?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[SkyDekker 1,465]

lol...something like that.

When you ask the Dutch whose help they are thankful for during WWII, you will generally get The Canadians as an answer.

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

When people succumb to this brand loyalty towards political parties and forget that their representatives have phone numbers and mailing addresses and public meetings you can go to rather than just a letter next to their name then they choose not to wield any meaningful power at all.

Well put, +1

We are all engines of karma