Irresponsible parents of the week

[normiss 906]

Well, right up to a legal interpretation of the action...

It IS legally defined as battery.

[billvon 3,132]

>It IS legally defined as battery.

And there are places where abortion is defined as murder. "What is legal somewhere" does not equate to "what I think is right."

[normiss 906]

Well in our society, murder is illegal, abortion is legal, and battery is illegal.

Take your pick.

Teaching through violence is fucking retarded.

I'm curious how much it contributes to a violent society.

[billvon 3,132]

>Teaching through violence is fucking retarded.

Agreed. So is abortion as birth control. But I am glad that parents have the final say, even when I disagree with their choices.

[normiss 906]

Up until they commit battery because they are out of tools on how to properly raise children.

[wmw999 2,602]

But it's not defined as abuse unless it leaves a mark that lasts at least an hour (or until the abuse team sees it). At least that was the definition that we used when I investigated child abuse.

So Bill -- have you started beating your kid yet?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andy9o8 3]

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it's not defined as abuse unless it leaves a mark that lasts at least an hour

How about one that lasts a lifetime?

[Kennedy 0]

A visible mark, counselor. Visible.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[normiss 906]

Not entirely true.

[Kennedy 0]

Ok, so what IS true?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[billvon 3,132]

>Up until they commit battery because they are out of tools on how to properly raise children.

Yes, and up until a woman has someone perform an abortion on her without her consent. Then it's a crime.

But most women do not have abortions performed without their consent, even though they might get abortions. And most parents do not commit battery on their kids, even though they hit them.

[billvon 3,132]

>How about one that lasts a lifetime?

Not nearly as bad as killing him before he's born. But we allow for both, even though (IMO) they are very poor choices.

[normiss 906]

Physically striking another person IS battery.
How the hell you compare that to abortion is beyond me.

[Kennedy 0]

Your logic is faulty. Striking someone is not always battery. Ask a boxer or a mma fighter (prearranged). Ask a hockey player. Similarly not all homicides are murder. Soldiers in war, police and/or citizens acting in self defense or defense of others, etc. Or, in your view, abortions.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[normiss 906]

I didn't realize the kids were voluntarily being hit, like your examples.

The only comment I made about abortion is that it's legal.
Battery however, is not.

I'm amazed there are adults defending their battering of children they claim to love.

[Kennedy 0]

Get it through your skull. Not all killing is murder, and not all striking is battery.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[normiss 906]

Lighten up Francis.

Striking a defenseless child IS battery.

I'm still not talking about murder or abortion.
You should pay closer attention.

[billvon 3,132]

>The only comment I made about abortion is that it's legal.

Killing kids is illegal. Abortion is not. There's a difference.

>Battery however, is not.

Battery is illegal. Spanking kids, however, is not. There is a difference.

[sfzombie 3]

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Up until they commit battery because they are out of tools on how to properly raise children.

all i know is that when i grew up, a lot of society had the view that spanking was normal and good. and there were no kids shooting other kids in schools, even though we could take them and keep them in the trunk so we could stop and hunt on the way home. discipline was there, and i don't care if you do call it fear, not respect, it worked. and it's just like a lawyer to sound out so loudly against it, just another example of the kind of society we have denigrated into. and i also know from experience that when i carved my own wooden paddle, i have had a lot less problems with my 10 year old, just the threat of it has been enough to turn him around for over two months now.

you don't like it, don't want to do it, fine. but screw you if you're gonna call me a child abuser.

eta: the last sentence wasn't directed toward you normiss, just a general statement.

http://kitswv.com

[toolbox 0]

>What a load of bullshit.

Couldn't agree more.

[normiss 906]

if you want to instill fear of authority and fear of their own parents in your kids, that's your choice.

I don't believe it delivers the lesson that some parents think it does. I don't agree with it.
Works just as well as the "Don't do that Johnny" moms who never get off their asses to deal with their kids.

To me, a parent is there to nurture, lead, teach, and protect kids.
Physically hitting children accomplishes none of those.

[Skyrad 0]

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Lighten up Francis.

LOL... Great film great scene

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[ibx 2]

I can't believe we agree, but very well said !

[kallend 2,182]

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At any rate, anyone who thinks violence is an acceptable means of disciplining children is complicit with child abusers. Anyone who does it is a child abuser.

What a load of bullshit. I was disciplined many ways as a kid. Grounding, timeouts, not getting something, and when I did something really bad I got my ass whipped.

.

And look how you turned out

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Andy9o8 3]

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>Corporal punishment is the refuge of stupid, unimaginative people.

I view corporal punishment in a similar light to the way I view abortion.

It is, generally, the worst possible option, and is used far more than it should be (IMO). It is Bad with a capital B, and anyone who uses it as anything other than an absolute last resort is an idiot.

But in the end it is up to the parents.

My feeling about that is that corporal punishment in modern Western society has seen the last of its day. The argument that "it worked ok for me growing up" doesn't move me a bit.

By way of comparison: Our generation of adults has declared domestic violence, especially by men against women, intolerable. There was a time when wife-beating was quietly tolerated and ignored. A time before that when it was approved of. A time before that when it was actively encouraged as a means to maintain domestic, and social, order. Today, of course, most of us consider that line of thinking appalling.

Why does domestic violence by men against women occur? Well, the physical reason is utterly obvious: because adult men are usually a lot physically stronger than the women they assault. I am quite certain that had adult human females always been physically as strong and fast as adult males, domestic violence against women would not occur. From a purely physical standpoint, men beat women because they can.

And that's the same reason why adults hit children: because, physically, they can. And that's simply because children are not physically strong enough to defend themselves against adults. That's also why there aren't many 18 year old boys who get battered by their Dads, because when they were 17 they finally hit the old man back, and he went down hard.

Just as domestic violence by men against women has become universally intolerable, so, too, is it time for the hitting of children to be declared intolerable, too. In my book, it already is.

Violence against children is not "up to the parents" any more than violence against a wife is up to the husband.