PD Forcing Residents From Home During Boston Manhunt

[Kennedy 0]

Well, we can all dispense with the idea that all the searches during the lockdown/manhunt/shelter in place were voluntary and consensual. I don't think that a suspect on the loose and a large police perimeter is a reason to invoke "exigent circumstances" over a ten block radius.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LrbsUVSVl8&feature=player_embedded

If I were the homeowner, or even just present during this incident, I'd need a really good explanation to stop me from finding a good lawyer.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[1969912 0]

Screw that. My comment about the cops doing an excellent job was wrong.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[skypuppy 1]

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Well, we can all dispense with the idea that all the searches during the lockdown/manhunt/shelter in place were voluntary and consensual. I don't think that a suspect on the loose and a large police perimeter is a reason to invoke "exigent circumstances" over a ten block radius.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LrbsUVSVl8&feature=player_embedded

If I were the homeowner, or even just present during this incident, I'd need a really good explanation to stop me from finding a good lawyer.

Well, I would be wondering if any property went missing during the searches like happened in new orleans. Or if any pets got shot.

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[ManagingPrime 0]

This is the video I've been waiting for since the search began.

The day of the bombing we had gun legislation before the senate and there was a vocal group that warned the legislation was a per-cursor to "home invasions" like this. The legislation fails, but we still get the "home invasions". I'd throw a few laugh icons on this one if it did not scare the shit out of me.

If a pressure cooker bomb get's a ten block radius, what does a nuke or biological device get?

I've be very interested to know if any homeowners tried to refuse entry, despite the foregone conclusion.

[1969912 0]

Haven't heard about any dags getting shot. The tango was probably hopping backyard fences while the cops were roughing up the people who employ them.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[quade 4]

But, seriously, how else do you do it?

How do you do a sweep of a neighborhood looking for a terrorist?

I'm not excusing it, I'm asking a practical question. How do you sweep a neighborhood looking for a terrorist who is assumed to have bombs and has demonstrated he's willing to blow shit up? You can't just tap nicely on the door and assume if somebody inside says, "nothing to see here. Move along." That there isn't, in fact, something going on inside the house.

Ask any operator who ever swept a neighborhood in the Middle East how they went about it. What will they say?

Again, I'm NOT excusing it, but how the hell else do you do it?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Kennedy 0]

The same way you search for any other murderer and/or bomber. "Over there", it is our guys dealing with the foreign populace and an enemy force (regular or insurgency). There are a lot of bad guys with lots of guns and explosives. In Boston, it was hundreds of LEOs, including multiple SWAT units, dealing with the US populace and one bad guy. One. A few homemade piece of crap IEDs and a few long guns and pistols.

The test of our committment to the constitution is not how we apply it when everything is comfy-cozy. The test is what we do when things are bad an when dealing with people we hate. Are you willing to deal with the negative consequences of personal liberty and constitutionally restricted government?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[quade 4]

Fine. But you have NOT answered the question.

How do you do it?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[normiss 872]

"Can we search your house?"

"Warrant? No? Then, no you cannot. I have secured my household, thanks for offering. Good day officers."

THAT'S how we do it.
What part confuses you?

[quade 4]

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What part confuses you?

The part that ensures the terrorist isn't holding the family hostage and threatening to blow them up.

Tell me again how your method ensured that?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[normiss 872]

So you're ignoring that a citizen did in fact check his property and found the guy.

After all those forced searches....

Mine worked because I checked the premises. My property officer, none ya.


I'm interested in your willingness to vacate your basic rights so willingly.
Sheep?

[quade 4]

You're ignoring the fact that at one point in the week the terrorist had, in fact, carjacked and kidnapped a man while they were still in possession of more explosive devices. It is not, by any means, unheard of for kidnap victims to have to "cover" for their kidnappers when questioned by police.

So again I ask, how to you sweep an area and ensure terrorists aren't holding a family hostage unless you go inside to look?

Sheep? No. I want to be able to do this 100% within what we traditionally understand as our Constitutional rights to be complete fucking assholes and not cooperate with the police who are looking for terrorists who recently killed and maimed innocent people. I just don't know how you can assure that.

Seriously folks, get a grip. You're on the side of assholes here.

Yes, Kennedy, these were in fact, "exigent circumstances" and actually should have, as it turns out, extended at least one more block.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[normiss 872]

Not surprised again - sadly becoming used to people walking away from our rights in the interest of an unknown "safety".
Yet you folks claim those of us with weapons are the paranoid ones.

I don't want, need, nor trust cops to protect me.
Nor am I ever in support of illegal and warrantless searches of my home, my person, and/or my vehicle.
I'm not sorry if you feel I'm an asshole because I support my constitution.

SIUCC.

Seriously folks, get a grip is right. We're losing our rights because of attitudes like yours.

[jakee 1,571]

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How do you do a sweep of a neighborhood looking for a terrorist?

How do you sweep a neighbourhood looking for a murderer? This should be a scenario the police in Boston have a reasonable amount of practice at, and I hope it doesn't usually involve wholesale rights violations.

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Ask any operator who ever swept a neighborhood in the Middle East how they went about it. What will they say?

Thyey'll probably say that how the military behaves in a foreign country they have subjugated by force should not be used as a model for how the police behave in your own country.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,571]

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No. I want to be able to do this 100% within what we traditionally understand as our Constitutional rights to be complete fucking assholes and not cooperate with the police who are looking for terrorists who recently killed and maimed innocent people. I just don't know how you can assure that.

How do you ensure you find him? You can't. So what?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Southern_Man 0]

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Sheep? No. I want to be able to do this 100% within what we traditionally understand as our Constitutional rights to be complete fucking assholes and not cooperate with the police who are looking for terrorists who recently killed and maimed innocent people. I just don't know how you can assure that.

Seriously folks, get a grip. You're on the side of assholes here.

I don't trust cops. I'm not letting them in my house without a warrant. If that makes me an asshole, then so be it.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[Gravitymaster 0]

This is why the founding fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment.

[DanG 1]

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This is why the founding fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment.

Actually it's why they wrote the 4th Amendment. There are other parts to the Constitution than the one sentance about guns, you know.

- Dan G

[Gravitymaster 0]

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This is why the founding fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment.

Actually it's why they wrote the 4th Amendment. There are other parts to the Constitution than the one sentance about guns, you know.

It's still why they wrote the 2nd.

[DanG 1]

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It's still why they wrote the 2nd.

It's why they wrote the whole fucking thing.

- Dan G

[Gravitymaster 0]

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It's still why they wrote the 2nd.

It's why they wrote the whole fucking thing.

I wasn't talking about the whole thing. The "whole thing" without the 2nd is about as effective as shaking your fist and screaming "you can't do that".

[DanG 1]

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I wasn't talking about the whole thing. The "whole thing" without the 2nd is about as effective as shaking your fist and screaming "you can't do that".

Really? So every time someone has an encounter with the government that works out relatively okay, they must have had a gun in their hand? Ridiculous. The rule of law only works if most everyone agrees to it. If the only thing keeping the government in check is the .45 in your nightstand, then we don't have a state of law, we have a state of nature. Also known as anarchy.

- Dan G

[Gravitymaster 0]

You keep shaking your fist if you think that's going to make a difference. See how effective that has been.

[lawrocket 3]

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But, seriously, how else do you do it?

Firebomb the place and hope you get rid of him?

Or, perhaps, if you have a reasonable suspicion that the guy is there get some warrants. Or consent. Yes, the 4th Amendment makes the job of law enforcement a lot harder - as it was supposed to do.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[jakee 1,571]

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It's still why they wrote the 2nd.

It's why they wrote the whole fucking thing.

I wasn't talking about the whole thing. The "whole thing" without the 2nd is about as effective as shaking your fist and screaming "you can't do that".

Yeah. I'm sure that if the guy in the video had opened his front door with a gun in his hand they would have left him alone and moved along to the next unarmed house.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?