The Fort Hood Shooter Can't Dodge the Death Penalty

[weekender 0]

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I'm not going to LET you plead guilty, so we can punish you more? Even though you are guilty...

Is this allowed to happen because it's a military court? Seems kind fucked up to me.

you cannot confess to a crime you did not commit in the military. its common in a civilian court. so the journalist has done a poor job explaining what really is happening or is dishonest.

He is charged with a crime. he must defend that charge. in a military court, you cannot plead guilty to a lesser charge to avoid a conviction on the greater.

i know i didnt word that like a lawyer because i am not. i do know a JAG very well and that is how it was explained to me. Army JAG to be specific.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[Andy9o8 2]

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you cannot confess to a crime you did not commit in the military. its common in a civilian court..

I'm pretty sure (with an open mind) that as a practical matter, you can, and cannot, do that any more or any less in a military court than in a civilian court. In the military, you simply "admit" to your attorney you're guilty, and then say so during your guilty plea colloquy before the judge. I'm only a civilian lawyer, but have done a lot of criminal defense, and I know and have known a lot of JAG lawyers - they assure me that guilty plea bargaining - which includes defendants grudgingly "admitting" to certain charges - occurs all the time in the US military. (DavJohns or Lawrocket, correct me if you disagree.)

Technically, it's a violation of most (maybe all?) states' civilian lawyer's ethics codes to participate in your client pleading guilty to a given charge if he flat-out denies to you that he's guilty of it. And in most states, the guilty plea colloquy includes a question like: "Are you pleading guilty to (X) because you are in fact guilty?" and if you don't say "Yes" to that the judge won't accept the guilty plea.

My educated guess is that a JAG lawyer would tell his client something like "just so you know, if you tell me you're not guilty, or if I'm certain you're not guilty, my duty requires me to inform the judge, and if I do, he'll probably reject your guilty plea."

[weekender 0]

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you cannot confess to a crime you did not commit in the military. its common in a civilian court..

I'm pretty sure (with an open mind) that as a practical matter, you can, and cannot, do that any more or any less in a military court than in a civilian court. In the military, you simply "admit" to your attorney you're guilty, and then say so during your guilty plea colloquy before the judge. I'm only a civilian lawyer, but have done a lot of criminal defense, and I know and have known a lot of JAG lawyers - they assure me that guilty plea bargaining - which includes defendants grudgingly "admitting" to certain charges - occurs all the time in the US military. (DavJohns or Lawrocket, correct me if you disagree.)

Technically, it's a violation of most (maybe all?) states' civilian lawyer's ethics codes to participate in your client pleading guilty to a given charge if he flat-out denies to you that he's guilty of it. And in most states, the guilty plea colloquy includes a question like: "Are you pleading guilty to (X) because you are in fact guilty?" and if you don't say "Yes" to that the judge won't accept the guilty plea.

My educated guess is that a JAG lawyer would tell his client something like "just so you know, if you tell me you're not guilty, or if I'm certain you're not guilty, my duty requires me to inform the judge, and if I do, he'll probably reject your guilty plea."

i'm not lawyer. i understand your point. the person who explained it to me gave me the facts. your giving me your opinion and the real world application of the facts based on your legal experience. I cannot intelligently reply.

this person implied to me that what you described does not happen. with that said, i understand that this person, being a career JAG and judge is motivated by pride. they very well might want me to believe it does not happen as you described. i do not know where the full truth lies. maybe another JAG can comment that is not my sibling.

your post certainly makes sense and could very well be true. i unfortunately cannot add much more to the conversation. nothing intelligent anyway.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[dmcoco84 5]

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you cannot confess to a crime you did not commit in the military. its common in a civilian court..

I'm pretty sure (with an open mind) that as a practical matter, you can, and cannot, do that any more or any less in a military court than in a civilian court. In the military, you simply "admit" to your attorney you're guilty, and then say so during your guilty plea colloquy before the judge. I'm only a civilian lawyer, but have done a lot of criminal defense, and I know and have known a lot of JAG lawyers - they assure me that guilty plea bargaining - which includes defendants grudgingly "admitting" to certain charges - occurs all the time in the US military. (DavJohns or Lawrocket, correct me if you disagree.)

Haven't had a chance to look back, or research further... but didn't the article state that this is only in regard to Capital cases? Assault or sexual assault, you could most definitely plead guilty... as well as plea bargain for reduces military style punishments.

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Technically, it's a violation of most (maybe all?) states' civilian lawyer's ethics codes to participate in your client pleading guilty to a given charge if he flat-out denies to you that he's guilty of it. And in most states, the guilty plea colloquy includes a question like: "Are you pleading guilty to (X) because you are in fact guilty?" and if you don't say "Yes" to that the judge won't accept the guilty plea.

Hmm... Gotta come back to this.

But... http://www.almd.uscourts.gov/rulesproc/docs/guilty_plea_colloquy.pdf

G. Ask defendant: Has anyone attempted in any way to force you to plead guilty (nolo contendere) in this case? Are you pleading guilty of your own free will because you are guilty?