The best result of home defense

[wmw999 2,589]

Had to include the boobies option
I'm not including any options that involve the intruder stealing, wrecking, hurting the occupants because those are no-brainers.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[ryoder 1,590]

Where is the option for: intruder held at gunpoint until cops arrive?

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[wmw999 2,589]

Didn't think about it.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[quade 4]

You also left off options such as, "no intruder to begin with."

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[wmw999 2,589]

That one was deliberate; I'm postulating an intruder.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[chutem 0]

With no intruder held for police option I went with scared them off. I'd rather not go through the expense of a lawsuit after shooting someones "little angel" in addition to not wanting to kill another human.

[airtwardo 7]

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Where is the option for: intruder held at gunpoint until cops arrive?

Which I have experience with...

Right here in my current home town, about 12 years ago we were living in a different house.
A neighbor from down the block saw us pack up the SUV & leave one Saturday morning. Wife, kids, suitcases...outside light left of at 7am.

What he didn't realize is 'they' were going to the west coast for a 3 day weekend & I was merely dropping them off & heading to the DZ for a day of fun.

Returning around 10pm, I parked in the garage and went out front to see why the outside light wasn't still burning, in the walk way right in front of the door 'someone' had thrown a couple handfuls of vacuum-cleaner fine dirt & the bulb was unscrewed.


I went in through the back door, nothing seemed missing so I went to the bedroom & kinda waited.

Hour later 'someone' is jimmying the office window, he took all our financial stuff from the desk & file and was carrying it to our kitchen table when he noticed the red dot on his chest.

Cops arrived 5 minutes later to find him on the floor prone, being covered by an armed home-owner that had a foot on his neck to keep him from moving.

Filling out the report, I was told by the officer 'this is TEXAS not California, if you shoot an intruder here I just check a box on the form...now I gotta fill all this stuff out'

Another one happened to me in college, 3 friends & I in a rented house...they all went home for Christmas but I stayed.

Woke up one morning to find someone going through a room-mates bedroom, living room already had a pile of 'loot' stacked up to go...

I attempted to hold him and call the police...but he was pretty smart, said if ya haven't shot me yet you won't so I'm leaving. And he did!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[davjohns 1]

I'm from the South. "He needed killin' " is a legitimate defense. I tend to prefer a dead intruder. Hard for him to sue me. Nobody to contradict my story to the police. He can't invade anyone else's home....

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[sfzombie 3]

i would have to agree with you on this one. but i voted boobies cause there was no vote for hole him for the cops. not the thing i would have done, but the best choice by far, should have been in both categories. i had a friend who did it with a baseball bat once, but he hit him several times first. the cops wanted to take him for assault, but there was another witness. i'd have shot him.

http://kitswv.com

[ryoder 1,590]

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I attempted to hold him and call the police...but he was pretty smart, said if ya haven't shot me yet you won't so I'm leaving. And he did!

You should have done what a friend of mine did: Put on an act like you were frothing-at-the-mouth crazy, and itching to pull the trigger, so the perp would think you were stupid enough to do it. It worked for him.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[quade 4]

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I attempted to hold him and call the police...but he was pretty smart, said if ya haven't shot me yet you won't so I'm leaving. And he did!

You should have done what a friend of mine did: Put on an act like you were frothing-at-the-mouth crazy, and itching to pull the trigger, so the perp would think you were stupid enough to do it. It worked for him.

I'd question the wisdom of that.

I think most people would rather go to jail than be shot and killed, so it elevates the situation and gives the perp a better reason to attempt to fight it out. Cornered rat and such.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[ryoder 1,590]

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I attempted to hold him and call the police...but he was pretty smart, said if ya haven't shot me yet you won't so I'm leaving. And he did!

You should have done what a friend of mine did: Put on an act like you were frothing-at-the-mouth crazy, and itching to pull the trigger, so the perp would think you were stupid enough to do it. It worked for him.

I'd question the wisdom of that.

I think most people would rather go to jail than be shot and killed, so it elevates the situation and gives the perp a better reason to attempt to fight it out. Cornered rat and such.

If the guy tries to run, you have no right to shoot.
If the guy lunges toward you, you can shoot.

In the particular situation my friend was in, the perp was not cornered, but on the inside of a building, while my friend was outside the building looking through an open window. If the guy had run, there is no way he could have run around the building fast enough to intercept him, and the window sill was too tall to easily jump through.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[rehmwa 2]

That's a tough one. First impulse is scare him away (seems the gun owner aspect of that is pointless, scare him away with a bat, a screwdriver, or a 7 iron - the tool doesn't matter really), but I'd like all my options - so gun owner, he runs away


BUT

he comes back sometime and now I'm not there and my wife and daughter are.

I want the option for "Stopped him until the police got there and took him in custody". If not, gun owner, dead if he attacks me/family, or runs away if he doesn't"

so "Gun Owner - Takes appropriate actions based on the intruder's actions"


the point is, just being an intruder isn't necessarily the sole reason for being killed. BUT, being the intruder shows a willingness to break the law, and potential for violence is now a serious unknown. So, once he's does become an intruder - all sympathy is gone no matter how it turns out. So I'll vote for the dead intruder and the next option if I could vote fore both, but I don't like how that can be twisted into a strawman by how it's presented. (I know that's not your intention, but you know these things go)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[airtwardo 7]

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I attempted to hold him and call the police...but he was pretty smart, said if ya haven't shot me yet you won't so I'm leaving. And he did!

You should have done what a friend of mine did: Put on an act like you were frothing-at-the-mouth crazy, and itching to pull the trigger, so the perp would think you were stupid enough to do it. It worked for him.

I think he was as shocked to see me as I was him...we were both kinda WTF for a second.

I said "don't move"...he said 'if ya haven't shot me yet'...

I didn't wanna shoot anybody over college kid possessions & he certainly wasn't being threatening or aggressive...he slowly backed out showing me his hands all the time.

I for sure wasn't gonna pursue ~ d00d was considerably bigger than me!

I'd have looked pretty stupid getting my ass kicked then shot with my own gun...all in all it worked out.



~on the other one...I ended up being the asshole of the neighborhood for pressing charges on the guy.

I heard a lot of - he's having emotional problems, he's not normally that way, he didn't mean anything, he just wanted to know who you guys are...give him a break.

...He's gay ~ not that there's anything wrong with that.

But his attorney said in court that I over reacted and caused him physical harm because of his sexual orientation.

DA said correctly I had no idea of his gayness and I had taken appropriate steps to keep both him AND me safe...it 'could have been' a whole lot worse.

SO...the best result IMO for home defense is bad guy either gets arrested or leaves empty handed.

No... I'm not of the mind to blast away at a mere thief...even though here in Texas it's almost expected.

Try to inflict harm on me or my family & I will stop the threat with deadly force or die tryin'

Yeah- I've had some experience with that too. . . some on here that know me personally know the story.

I tend to chuckle to myself when I hear some of the local bad-asses boast their 'home defense strategy' - they ain't got a fuckin' clue what actually goes down & the effects of the aftermath.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[rehmwa 2]

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But his attorney said in court that I over reacted and caused him physical harm because of his sexual orientation.

You did everything exactly perfectly (no harm, prosecuting the criminal, etc etc etc) and, for your reward, you get accused of causing him physical harm.

that's what's wrong with the process - bingo

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[ryoder 1,590]

On this topic, I just saw this: http://www.khou.com/news/local/21-year-old-protects-family-kills-suspect-during-home-invasion-in-NW-Harris-County-192475271.html

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[oldwomanc6 60]

It seems that there are an awful lot of responders, here, who have never encountered a home intruder, and on both sides, say they would do this or that, yet haven't a clue as to how they would REALLY respond, if they came face-to-face with the bad guy INSIDE their personal living space.

lisa
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9

[toolbox 0]

Is the intruder a hot chick or some nasty looking bum?
I'm asking because of the boobie option.
To be serious,I would take the option where the perp runs away empty handed with a shit stain in his pants because he had just taken a look down my gun barrel,but otherwise unharmed.

[toolbox 0]

Good job dude! I've been ripped off twice while away from the pad, and on one occasion lost about $3000 in tools and another $1200 in electronics,and had to fix the busted door and the jam as well.
I have had a carjacker in philly quickly change his mind when he seen that I also had a gun, and it was aimed at him(I had dark tint and could see him coming).
Having someone invade your residence while you are home would be pretty freaky.

[airtwardo 7]

Having someone invade your residence while you are home would be pretty freaky.

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Yeah it gets the ole pump thumping for sure.


I don't know the reason Wendy is running the poll...but it might hopefully give someone food for thought regarding their 'home defense' strategy.

The bravado stance of 'shoot first & ask questions later' may sound good from a Hollywood Cowboy but in reality there is more to it.

As i said above, I don't have ANY desire to kill someone in my home over material goods.

Restitution can be made, I have insurance...a life is much more valuable than anything I ever bought...yes even a dirt-bag thief's life.

However a home invasion IS pretty serious, if someone has that kind of balls it's a short step to violence.

I think any home invader should be treated with the highest expectation of intent to cause you harm, but unless there IS aggression against you...the reaction should be tempered.

Yes it's upsetting on many levels to have your castle invaded - it's scary, it's confusing, it makes you defensive & angry.
The immediate & natural reaction is to lash out, to fight...as with skydiving, one should consider some mental & physical 'training' on how to respond to different scenarios with different actions.

Do you really want to take a life - even IF it's technically justified - unnecessarily?

I would hope not, if the answer is yes ya may need to do a little soul searching...and remember like with jumping, what ya 'train' for is what you'll do under pressure.


THAT being said~


You really do want to get it right, sometimes it absolutely IS necessary because you are given NO option...



FWIW ~ The use of lethal force in defending oneself even with the most obvious of justification both legally & morally - is very traumatic and a tremendous burden.

It's nothing like on TV or the movies...it's FAST, fearful, unorganized, loud and messy. THEN the cops and press show up to make your life a living hell.

There's no commercial break to come back after, to 'miller-time' it with friends making small talk about 'glad you're okay', 'that was a close one', 'ya had no choice', or the bad guy 'getting what he had coming'.

You leave your home with paper bags on your hands, ya get photographed...A LOT, fingerprinted, questioned for hours by different people all asking the same questions. YOU begin to feel like a criminal.

You'll probably be tested for drugs & alcohol. You are put under the microscope big time, if you have skeletons they ARE coming out.

When THAT's over what now...your 'home' is now a crime scene, may not get back in there for days.


You WILL need legal counsel and get it fast if you have one brain cell...of course you're not under arrest or being charged a that time...so it's on your dime.

You'll miss work and when ya do go back you're now 'that guy'.

Personal relationships will change - time, attention & money is being diverted away from what 'was' important prior to the indecent.

That can be tough on friends, family, significant others.

And then of course there is the civil actions that will be brought against you...legal justification has nothing to do with the bad guys auntie Sophie suing you because now she can't get her weekly ride to the pharmacy for her medicine.

You spend your savings & go deep into debt just trying to get on with a 'normal' life...which never really comes because once ya have been through all that - what's 'normal'?

The tee-shirt ya get after goin' through it doesn't boast 'BTDT'...it simply says ~ WTF!

Trust me on this.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[toolbox 0]

Yea I would not want to kill someone over theft either.
Hell,I don't ever want to have to kill anyone for any reason.
You are right though,if someone is in your house uninvited they are apt to be a very dangerous threat to anyone they encounter.
I would only use deadly force if they closed within an unsafe distance to myself or others in the residence,or made threats with a weapon.
It sucks that on top of the bad feelings that any good person might experience after having to kill someone in self defense,that you would have to be put through so much more,while most criminals show no remorse or regret for anything except being caught.

[jgoose71 0]

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Had to include the boobies option
I'm not including any options that involve the intruder stealing, wrecking, hurting the occupants because those are no-brainers.

Wendy P.

You for got the option...

"Blow rape-whistle until help arrives."

.... for certain anti-gun liberals on the forum.

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[wmw999 2,589]

Actually, the reason is a combination of some of the virtual blood spilled lately, along with an earlier post of yours describing the aftermath, along with the thought that personally, I'd much rather scare them out than try to catch if I'm alone -- but if my husband is here too (likely), then the options increase.

And anyway I like polls

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Niki1 2]

One thing I wouldn't do is shoot through a closed batrroom door without getting some kind of response from the person on the other side of the door.

Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done.
Louis D Brandeis

Where are we going and why are we in this basket?

[ryoder 1,590]

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One thing I wouldn't do is shoot through a closed batrroom door without getting some kind of response from the person on the other side of the door.

To me that is proof the person is too fuggin' stupid to operate a gun. Here is another example:

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Investigators said the men often played a game of loading a revolver with one slug, spinning the cylinder and then pointing it at another player before pulling the trigger.

Lt. Austin Simons said the men apparently believed they were safe because they could see the bullet but forgot that the loaded chamber advances when the trigger is pulled.

Ref: http://www.battlecreekenquirer.com/article/20130222/NEWS01/302220016/Man-sentenced-7-years-drinking-game-shooting-death-friend

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.