The future of road transportation

[brenthutch 444]

"Tesla’s New York service manager, Adam Williams, found a towing service in Milford that sent a skilled and very patient driver, Rick Ibsen, to rescue me with a flatbed truck. Not so quick: the car’s electrically actuated parking brake would not release without battery power, and hooking the car’s 12-volt charging post behind the front grille to the tow truck’s portable charger would not release the brake. So he had to drag it onto the flatbed, a painstaking process that took 45 minutes. Fortunately, the cab of the tow truck was toasty"


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/automobiles/stalled-on-the-ev-highway.html?pagewanted=1&ref=automobiles

The future is going to be AWESOME!

[lawrocket 3]

This is being disputed by Tesla. Apparently they have telemetry that disputes this version of events.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[GeorgiaDon 380]

Needless to say, no gas powered vehicle has ever suffered a locked parking brake, or indeed any sort of mechanical failure whatsoever.

Sheesh!

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[brenthutch 444]

It would be more akin to Ford rolling out its new Mustang to an adoring motoring press, showing off its power by flying threw the quarter mile in 25 seconds, and finishing its blast around the track on the back of a flatbed with a broken stereo.

[GeorgiaDon 380]

My great-grandfather had a hay business, back in the 1940s when milk and ice, was still delivered by horse-drawn carts. Year by year, as more and more of his clients traded their horses for trucks, and business declined steadily, my grandfather insisted that these "horseless carriages" were smelly, dangerous, and just a passing fad. He continued to believe that even as he went bankrupt.

For that matter, to the day he died he didn't believe in airplanes. Although he could see them overhead, he insisted they were illusions sent by the devil to tempt him.

Sometimes, slavish devotion to the ways of the past can come to border on insanity (at least in the sense that Quade uses the word).

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Stumpy 284]

I think you nailed it.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[brenthutch 444]

Quote

My great-grandfather had a hay business, back in the 1940s when milk and ice, was still delivered by horse-drawn carts. Year by year, as more and more of his clients traded their horses for trucks, and business declined steadily, my grandfather insisted that these "horseless carriages" were smelly, dangerous, and just a passing fad. He continued to believe that even as he went bankrupt.

For that matter, to the day he died he didn't believe in airplanes. Although he could see them overhead, he insisted they were illusions sent by the devil to tempt him.

Hey, (pun intended) I have some cold fusion stock I could sell you.

Sometimes, slavish devotion to the ways of the past can come to border on insanity (at least in the sense that Quade uses the word).

Don

[wmw999 2,589]

Quote

Hey, (pun intended) I have some cold fusion stock I could sell you.

Cool. I have a bunch of records -- they still work awesome, and have a much livelier sound than CDs. Which do you play when you play music?

Is it really your contention that the internal combustion engine and our current road system is the best technology that can be developed? Or are you waiting for more cup holders?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[brenthutch 444]

No, I am just providing a sanity check. I have nothing against Tesla motors, I wish them the best. But before we go wasting billions of tax dollars on immature technology, we should understand this little thing I call reality. Let the venture capitalists, scientists, and tinkerers work on it for a few more years. When it is ready, then roll it out. Just ask Boeing how those lithium ion battery are working on their Dreamliner

[wmw999 2,589]

One large advantage of gummint involvement a little earlier is that for systems that require delivery of fuel or service, having a single coordinating entity can make for a much more uniform delivery. Otherwise you might end up with a system where each car has its own plug type (as is the case for some now), or each cell phone company has its own signal delivery -- you know how well that works for the customer, after all.

Sometimes the customer is better served by cooperation than by competition; some might end up with lower prices, but then service is a pain in the ass.

In Brazil (as an example of what goverment involvement and coordination can do) there wasn't that kind of coordination for electric service delivery. Some places are 220, some places are 110. Some places have one kind of plug, other have another. While there was less government involvement, it's a pain in the ass if you actually want to move from one part of the country to another.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[brenthutch 444]

Quote

One large advantage of gummint involvement a little earlier is that for systems that require delivery of fuel or service, having a single coordinating entity can make for a much more uniform delivery. Otherwise you might end up with a system where each car has its own plug type (as is the case for some now), or each cell phone company has its own signal delivery -- you know how well that works for the customer, after all.

Sometimes the customer is better served by cooperation than by competition; some might end up with lower prices, but then service is a pain in the ass.

In Brazil (as an example of what goverment involvement and coordination can do) there wasn't that kind of coordination for electric service delivery. Some places are 220, some places are 110. Some places have one kind of plug, other have another. While there was less government involvement, it's a pain in the ass if you actually want to move from one part of the country to another.

Wendy P.

I am not a raving anarchist. Government has a role in regulation, basic research, and infrastructure. Instead of wasting billions on windmills, put the money into basic research to speed the advent of fusion power. As far as different electric standards, I know what you are talking about, I lived in Germany in the early 70, and we had to get transformers and plug adaptors to use our American appliances. PITA but doable.

[brenthutch 444]

Cool. I have a bunch of records -- they still work awesome, and have a much livelier sound than CDs. Which do you play when you play music?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you not see the irony of espousing vinyl over digital, in a conversation about gas vs. electric?

[kawisixer01 0]

Apparently you've never lived in climates that gets below freezing regularly with a manual transmission. It was once common in manual transmission vehicles to avoid using your parking brake during freezing times. You could run around for a couple days in rain and above freezing temps, park your car with the parking brake, and come out of work 8 hours later with a temperature now very much below freezing and a parking brake cable filled with now frozen water which wouldn't release it's death grip. I'm sure we should have thrown that whole car design away because of that little flaw though right?

[hcsvader 1]

Not a very skilled tow truck driver if he couldn't figure out how to get a car onto the flatbed with locked up wheels without dragging it...

Have you seen my pants?
it"s a rough life, Livin' the dream
>:)

[wmw999 2,589]

The other side of this story is that we've gotten used to treating cars in a particular way -- maybe if we make something look like a car, it needs to behave like one, too.

Either that, or don't sell it to people who will mistreat it.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[brenthutch 444]

"It was once common in manual transmission vehicles to avoid using your parking brake during freezing times. You could run around for a couple days in rain and above freezing temps, park your car with the parking brake, and come out of work 8 hours later with a temperature now very much below freezing and a parking brake cable filled with now frozen water which wouldn't release it's death grip. "

And now this no longer happens, thank you for making my point.

[wmw999 2,589]

Quote

And now this no longer happens, thank you for making my point.

Yeah, global warming has done away with freezing temps

Wendy P.[email]

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[brenthutch 444]

Quote

Quote

And now this no longer happens, thank you for making my point.

Yeah, global warming has done away with freezing temps

Wendy P.[email]

Yep, the only obstacle to the electric car, was the non-existence of global warming that the electric car was supposed to fix.

[mr2mk1g 10]

Tesla's response.

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most-peculiar-test-drive

If they can back up what they say with the telemetry/gps tracks... this journo might have a few problems in the near future.

[DougH 270]

Some lawyers are going to be thrilled! Booooyaaaa billable hours.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[davjohns 1]

They seem to have buried the reporter with facts. Good thing they have recording devices in the vehicle.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[GeorgiaDon 380]

Quote

Tesla's response.

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most-peculiar-test-drive

If they can back up what they say with the telemetry/gps tracks... this journo might have a few problems in the near future.

Is this journalist Brent's twin brother, by any chance?

I'll be curious to see if there are any adverse consequences to this "journalist" for outright lying, essentially making a story up. I know what should happen if he worked for an employer who actually valued their reputation.

So, brenthutch, what do you think would happen if I continued to drive my gas-powered car when the gas gauge showed empty, driving past gas stations even as warning lights are blinking and alarms are sounding? The Tesla continued for 19 miles after the point where the gauge showed no power remaining. If I continued to drive a car on empty, driving past gas stations on the way, until it finally ran out, would that constitute proof that gas engines are an experimental technology, not ready for prime time? Will you now advocate that we have to go back to horses as the best proven technology? But, what happens if we don't feed the horse? Maybe we all have to walk in brenthutch's world. At least that would be good for global warming, not to mention the obesity epidemic.

Brenthutch, do you think it might be relevant that in an article last year Mr. Broder (the "journalist" who did the "test drive") wrote: "Yet the state of the electric car is dismal, the victim of hyped expectations, technological flops, high costs and a hostile political climate.” Sounds like Mr Broder is a high priest of your live-in-the-past religion, and you swallowed his shit load lock stock and barrel. What does it say about the veracity of your ludditist views that time and again you have to turn to fabricated "evidence" for support?

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[brenthutch 444]

Tesla vs the NYT (that hotbed of conservatism) let us take a look at what a third party has to say. How about Wired.com? Or are they to "live-in-the-past" for you

Tesla positions the Model S as the first “no compromise EV” able (with the Supercharger network) to take the proverbial “Vegas on a moment’s notice” road trip. Yet after pitching the trip idea to Broder in the first place, Tesla’s own staff needed to issue carefully detailed instructions and make follow-up contact along the way to ensure he got to his destination. In doing so, they busted their own road trip myth before Broder ever left the driveway.

If an average driver needs such hand-holding from an automaker to make the trip, it’s the wrong car for the trip.

http://www.wired.com/opinion/2013/02/tesla-vs-new-york-times-when-range-anxiety-leads-to-road-trip-rage/

[Stumpy 284]

Quote

Tesla vs the NYT (that hotbed of conservatism) let us take a look at what a third party has to say. How about Wired.com? Or are they to "live-in-the-past" for you

Tesla positions the Model S as the first “no compromise EV” able (with the Supercharger network) to take the proverbial “Vegas on a moment’s notice” road trip. Yet after pitching the trip idea to Broder in the first place, Tesla’s own staff needed to issue carefully detailed instructions and make follow-up contact along the way to ensure he got to his destination. In doing so, they busted their own road trip myth before Broder ever left the driveway.

If an average driver needs such hand-holding from an automaker to make the trip, it’s the wrong car for the trip.

http://www.wired.com/opinion/2013/02/tesla-vs-new-york-times-when-range-anxiety-leads-to-road-trip-rage/

Broder has been proven a liar. Tesla has buried him - no wonder they need to handhold journalists if the journos in question are this dumb.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[brenthutch 444]

Before they hand held him, they hand picked him. So who is the dumb one?