kallend 2,182 #1 January 23, 2013 Plunder the assets of their company then declare bankruptcy when their poor management practices cause the excrement to hit the fan.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BartsDaddy 7 #2 January 23, 2013 Another one of your highly informative posts. I truely hope you give out more information when you teach than when you post. Handguns are only used to fight your way to a good rifle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManagingPrime 0 #3 January 23, 2013 Quote Plunder the assets of their company then declare bankruptcy when their poor management practices cause the excrement to hit the fan. You don't often see business owners, outside of predator funds, engaging in that kind of activity. Members of the executive suite however.... People that put their lifes work or their retirement funds into a company don't often like to see it pillaged. Sorry to be nit picky there, but the title caught my eye and you didn't give much to work with. Link? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #4 January 23, 2013 Oh I get it, this must be a thread about state budgets. Legislatures vote in huge unsustainable pensions and benefits packages. Leave huge loop holes that allow gaming of the system. State workers, and state workers unions, give votes to legislatures. Taxpayers down the road get bent over to pay for these packages that the state can't support."The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #5 January 23, 2013 Professor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManagingPrime 0 #6 January 23, 2013 Quote Professor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths. Good thing we can at least read. Fredric Ellis, a Boston attorney representing several victims, said there is no evidence that the founders “raided” the company’s coffers shortly before it filed for bankruptcy protection. But he said the records show that the company was growing rapidly and generated enormous profits for the owners before it shut down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyBoyd 0 #7 January 23, 2013 QuoteOh I get it, this must be a thread about state budgets. Legislatures vote in huge unsustainable pensions and benefits packages. Leave huge loop holes that allow gaming of the system. State workers, and state workers unions, give votes to legislatures. Taxpayers down the road get bent over to pay for these packages that the state can't support. I work for the State of Illinois. I do not belong to a union. The State takes 7% of every single one of my payckecks, whether I like it or not, and invests it in the state pension fund. For years the State has raided the workers' pension fund and used that money to pay other bills, then failed to return the money to the pension fund. So now, the pension fund is no longer sustainable, and good people who have worked their whole careers for the state stand to lose a good chunk of the pension they earned. And you want to blame this on the workers? You must be out of your mind. No one I know is "gaming the system." The people I work with are good folks, and hard workers who are doing the best job they can, and they just want a fair deal. Personally, if I could opt out of the pension fund I would, but I can't. All I want is a fair return on my investment. Hell, I'd settle for my money back, without interest. This crap about how the state workers are somehow to blame for this has got to stop. Look to the folks in the legislature who took the money and didn't pay it back. Quit blaming the workers. It's not right, and we don't deserve it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #8 January 23, 2013 Quote Quote Professor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths. Good thing we can at least read. Fredric Ellis, a Boston attorney representing several victims, said there is no evidence that the founders “raided” the company’s coffers shortly before it filed for bankruptcy protection. But he said the records show that the company was growing rapidly and generated enormous profits for the owners before it shut down. “They were clearly taking a lot of money out while it was operating,” Ellis said. “They cashed out, no doubt about it.”Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #9 January 23, 2013 Quote It's not right, and we don't deserve it. Just a thought here, ...vote for people that understand math while you still can.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 385 #10 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuote It's not right, and we don't deserve it. Just a thought here, ...vote for people that understand math while you still can.The problem is that "joe sixpack" expects the government to maintain services while cutting taxes, and doesn't give a shit if that can only be done by robbing state workers and turning them into indentured servants. I'm always astonished at how many people are perfectly comfortable with the idea of taking pension payments from workers, absconding with the money, then mocking the workers and blaming them for "allowing" their pension to be stolen. What has happened here is thievery, plain and simple, and in any fair world the perpetrators would be in prison. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManagingPrime 0 #11 January 23, 2013 Quote Quote Quote Professor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths. Good thing we can at least read. Fredric Ellis, a Boston attorney representing several victims, said there is no evidence that the founders “raided” the company’s coffers shortly before it filed for bankruptcy protection. But he said the records show that the company was growing rapidly and generated enormous profits for the owners before it shut down. “They were clearly taking a lot of money out while it was operating,” Ellis said. “They cashed out, no doubt about it.” There is nothing inherently wrong with that. If they knew bk was coming around the corner, "no evidence" of that, it would be a diferent story. As it stands I'm not sure the story is exactly relevant to the professors thesis. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #12 January 23, 2013 QuoteThere is nothing inherently wrong with that. Ethics notwithstanding, of course. QuoteI'm not sure the story is exactly relevant to the professors thesis. "Nice ethical business owners plunder the assets of their company then declare bankruptcy when their poor management practices cause the excrement to hit the fan." I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic when he described the owners as "nice" and "ethical." With that in mind, he summed up the information in the article rather well.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grimmie 186 #13 January 23, 2013 Andy, don't you know those union thug prison guards bankrupted California Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyBoyd 0 #14 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuoteQuote It's not right, and we don't deserve it. Just a thought here, ...vote for people that understand math while you still can.The problem is that "joe sixpack" expects the government to maintain services while cutting taxes, and doesn't give a shit if that can only be done by robbing state workers and turning them into indentured servants. I'm always astonished at how many people are perfectly comfortable with the idea of taking pension payments from workers, absconding with the money, then mocking the workers and blaming them for "allowing" their pension to be stolen. What has happened here is thievery, plain and simple, and in any fair world the perpetrators would be in prison. Don This is right on. Thanks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 3 #15 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuoteOh I get it, this must be a thread about state budgets. Legislatures vote in huge unsustainable pensions and benefits packages. Leave huge loop holes that allow gaming of the system. State workers, and state workers unions, give votes to legislatures. Taxpayers down the road get bent over to pay for these packages that the state can't support. I work for the State of Illinois. I do not belong to a union. The State takes 7% of every single one of my payckecks, whether I like it or not, and invests it in the state pension fund. For years the State has raided the workers' pension fund and used that money to pay other bills, then failed to return the money to the pension fund. So now, the pension fund is no longer sustainable, and good people who have worked their whole careers for the state stand to lose a good chunk of the pension they earned. And you want to blame this on the workers? You must be out of your mind. No one I know is "gaming the system." The people I work with are good folks, and hard workers who are doing the best job they can, and they just want a fair deal. Personally, if I could opt out of the pension fund I would, but I can't. All I want is a fair return on my investment. Hell, I'd settle for my money back, without interest. This crap about how the state workers are somehow to blame for this has got to stop. Look to the folks in the legislature who took the money and didn't pay it back. Quit blaming the workers. It's not right, and we don't deserve it. That's outrageous. You should talk to a lawyer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyBoyd 0 #16 January 23, 2013 I do that all the time. Sometimes I do it when no one else is around. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #17 January 23, 2013 QuoteThe problem is that "joe sixpack" expects the government to maintain services while cutting taxes, and doesn't give a shit if that can only be done by robbing state workers and turning them into indentured servants. The problem isn't Joe Sixpack - Joe Sixpack didn't steal a cent. The legislators, though. There's the problem. Why are you blaming Joe Sixpack versus blaming those who actually are stealing? My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #18 January 23, 2013 QuoteProfessor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths. Sorry, I'll have to remember to accommodate the semi-literate next time.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #19 January 23, 2013 > Look to the folks in the legislature who took the money and didn't pay it back Quit voting for em...then. Hell you have Dead Fish Rahm Emanuel as a perfect example of why voters get what they deserve. But with that said every state in the Union is F'ed Up with a rough total of about 2.8 Trillion in pension liabilities. California #1 at roughly $617 Billion in unpaid pension liabilities. New York is #2 w/ 300 Billion Texas #3 w/ 286 Billion Illinois #4 w/ 271 Billion Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 385 #20 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuoteThe problem is that "joe sixpack" expects the government to maintain services while cutting taxes, and doesn't give a shit if that can only be done by robbing state workers and turning them into indentured servants. The problem isn't Joe Sixpack - Joe Sixpack didn't steal a cent. The legislators, though. There's the problem. Why are you blaming Joe Sixpack versus blaming those who actually are stealing?I agree that the legislators are the actual thieves. Nevertheless, political candidates who run on a platform of "you've got to pay for the services you receive" always lose to candidates who promise that they can cut taxes without cutting services. "Joe Sixpack" either is too stupid to recognize a fiscal impossibility when they see it, or they don't give a shit if someone else is victimized. I rather suspect the latter, especially when I see the vitriol directed against "greedy state workers" who selfishly expect their employer to actually pay them what they contractually agreed to. Politicians have a history of finding one or another target group to use as a whipping boy so they can deflect blame for their fuck-ups. In the past it's been the Jews, or communists, or feminists. Today it's government workers. And "Joe Sixpack" eats it up. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #21 January 23, 2013 QuoteThe problem isn't Joe Sixpack - Joe Sixpack didn't steal a cent. The legislators, though. There's the problem. Why are you blaming Joe Sixpack versus blaming those who actually are stealing? The responsibility ultimately lies with those who placed the legislators in office by voting for them or failing to vote against them.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
regulator 0 #22 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuoteProfessor, I believe you have overestimated some people's ability to use Internet search tools. Owners drew $16m from pharmacy tied to deaths. Sorry, I'll have to remember to accommodate the semi-literate next time. Because youre the kingpin of logical posts. Please excuse me while I die laughing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,132 #23 January 23, 2013 >The problem isn't Joe Sixpack - Joe Sixpack didn't steal a cent. Joe Sixpack wanted low, low mortgage payments and got that ARM he couldn't afford. Joe Sixpack wants the government to bail him out when disaster hits. Joe Sixpack wanted lower taxes but guarantees that his grandma would get all the government benefits she deserved. Joe Sixpack wanted a war in Iraq but didn't want to pay for it. Joe Sixpack voted for the politician who promised lower taxes and higher spending. Joe Sixpack has a 401k, and his only criterion is maximum return on investment; he doesn't really care how they get it. >Why are you blaming Joe Sixpack versus blaming those who actually are stealing? Because he elects and funds the people who steal. Without his direct support they would be nothing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #24 January 23, 2013 Quote Quote Plunder the assets of their company then declare bankruptcy when their poor management practices cause the excrement to hit the fan. You don't often see business owners, outside of predator funds, engaging in that kind of activity. Members of the executive suite however.... People that put their lifes work or their retirement funds into a company don't often like to see it pillaged. Sorry to be nit picky there, but the title caught my eye and you didn't give much to work with. Link? bostonglobe.com/metro/2013/01/22/new-england-compounding-center-paid-owners-more-than-million-last-year/AuUj6S3Kz76GyOkQrM8C7M/story.html... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #25 January 23, 2013 QuoteQuoteLink? bostonglobe.com/metro/2013/01/22/new-england-compounding-center-paid-owners-more-than-million-last-year/AuUj6S3Kz76GyOkQrM8C7M/story.html A kind lurker sent me this link: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/health/with-meningitis-outbreak-a-spotlight-on-family-behind-compounding-pharmacy.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
