Look who's getting a pay raise. Biden, members of congress, federal workers.

[LyraM45 0]

Quote

What part of "we are broke" are you having the most trouble with? The coming years are going to be painful for many people. Thinking everything is OK and that someone else should have to suffer ie. The Rich, is not dealing with the reality of our situation.

So, the janitor at my facility, who is probably making less than you if I had to guess, deserves a pay freeze indefinitely because "we are broke?" .5% isn't even enough to meet adjustment for inflation, but it's something. It's not a full adjustment for inflation, but it's nothing either. I think it's a good compromise for the federal worker bee who is just trying to get by like everybody else.


If you're asking me personally if I get "we are broke," I do. I'd be willing to take a pay freeze or pay more taxes for as long as I need to to get us out of this hole. Does that mean every other federal employee has the means to be able to do the same? No. I'm married double income no children, so I have that luxury. Not everybody else who is federally employed does and they don't deserve to take the brunt. What part of that don't you understand?

edit to add: I get your point, and I agree with you for the most part. What I have a problem with is your take that every single federal employee is in some bogus overpaid position that isn't really needed and is just fat that needs to be trimmed; like every federal employee is an overpaid waste of your tax dollars and it's putting us in the mess we're in. The point I'm trying to make is that it's not true for every single federal employee worker bee, but I'm sure there are areas in the federal arena that are pretty fat on the pay and/or staffing with people who may not do much and some positions can afford to be cut with more work among those left. So I agree with you there, just not as a blanket statement for every federal employee.

Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :)

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

Quote

What part of "we are broke" are you having the most trouble with? The coming years are going to be painful for many people. Thinking everything is OK and that someone else should have to suffer ie. The Rich, is not dealing with the reality of our situation.

So, the janitor at my facility, who is probably making less than you if I had to guess, deserves a pay freeze indefinitely because "we are broke?" .5% isn't even enough to meet adjustment for inflation, but it's something. It's not a full adjustment for inflation, but it's nothing either. I think it's a good compromise for the federal worker bee who is just trying to get by like everybody else.


If you're asking me personally if I get "we are broke," I do. I'd be willing to take a pay freeze or pay more taxes for as long as I need to to get us out of this hole. Does that mean every other federal employee has the means to be able to do the same? No. I'm married double income no children, so I have that luxury. Not everybody else who is federally employed does and they don't deserve to take the brunt. What part of that don't you understand?

edit to add: I get your point, and I agree with you for the most part. What I have a problem with is your take that every single federal employee is in some bogus overpaid position that isn't really needed and is just fat that needs to be trimmed; like every federal employee is an overpaid waste of your tax dollars and it's putting us in the mess we're in. The point I'm trying to make is that it's not true for every single federal employee worker bee, but I'm sure there are areas in the federal arena that are pretty fat on the pay and/or staffing with people who may not do much and some positions can afford to be cut with more work among those left. So I agree with you there, just not as a blanket statement for every federal employee.

I never said anything about federal employees being an over paid waste of my tax dollars. Where are you getting that from? I simply said we need to reduce our spending because we are broke. Our politicians have spent us into near bankruptcy by constantly minimizing what tax dollars are spent on. Well, I got news for you. A drop here and a drop there adds up over 40 or so years. The drips and drops have become a tidal wave. The only solution is to reverse the trend, not stay the course. We need negative government spending, not another .5% here and .7% there. Anyone who believes that is OK does not fully comprehend the situation.

[LyraM45 0]

True, you never said word for word that feds were overpaid or a tax waste, but it's the general attitude from people who take a staunch stance that there needs to be massive lay offs and cuts to federal employees and salaries. Usually these people think the fed is fat staffed and/or overpaid all around. Sorry if I put words in your mouth, as you may be the exception of most people with that POV.

The drips and dribbles do add up, but getting a measly .5% increase after a two year freeze IS a cut back. So, we're doing our part, just like other people in private sector who probably haven't seen the same yearly raises, even the ones just for inflation/cost of living. So, if we're already taking a hit, and there's still massive bleeding (hell, there would be massive bleeding still even if we took a freeze for the next 10 years), then obviously the bigger spending issues need to be concentrated on more. Where is most of our money going? Where has it gone? I doubt it's not the .5% fed increase that sucked it up!

Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :)

[kallend 2,148]

Quote

Your trying to blame our lack of budget and inability to fix the deficit problem on the private sector? Thats what I am talking about when I say "who put us in this situation".

Let me put it this way your house gets back up with shit from your sewer system. The shit is half way up the walls. You have two options fix the problem and remove the shit, or raise the ceiling so you have more room to fill with shit. What do you do?

If we had a booming economy we would not be in such dire straits. The recession was primarily caused by greed of a lot of people, with Wall Street being top of the list. Don't blame air traffic controllers, national lab researchers, the National Weather Service and FBI agents for the economy being lousy.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

Your trying to blame our lack of budget and inability to fix the deficit problem on the private sector? Thats what I am talking about when I say "who put us in this situation".

Let me put it this way your house gets back up with shit from your sewer system. The shit is half way up the walls. You have two options fix the problem and remove the shit, or raise the ceiling so you have more room to fill with shit. What do you do?

If we had a booming economy we would not be in such dire straits. The recession was primarily caused by greed of a lot of people, with Wall Street being top of the list. Don't blame air traffic controllers, national lab researchers, the National Weather Service and FBI agents for the economy being lousy.

No

Cause government employess are already paid higher than non gov counter parts

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[cvfd1399 0]

This post was never directed towards them, you and i both know that air traffic controllers are not the issue, did you even click the link? It showed nothing but pay charts for lawmakers, and that's who this thread was directed towards.......

[BigMikeH77 0]

Quote

Federal employees have been in a freeze for the last 2 years. And we're getting a .5% increase now. Whoopdefreakindo..... I wouldn't get your panties too much in a twist over it.

Still, I'm thankful for the .5%. Don't get me wrong.

I agree. I too am a federal worker - You know, one of the people that apparently make too much money and are mooches on society - and it makes me so upset when folks go on and on about federal workers as though I have naything to do with the mess that our elected representatives have created.

I just so happen to work for a government office that brings IN billions upon billions of dollars every year, second only to the IRS. I don't have a union or a collective bargaining agreement. My insurance premiums have gone up substantially the past few years, too.

In the past 12 months there were THREE occasions where I left outgoing messages on my voicemail and e-mail explaining "Because of the federal government closures, I will be out of the office for an undetermined period" and had no idea wether I would have a job the following Monday.

I just did the calculation on MY pay raise.. It comes out to 0.6%. That's an extra $14 per paycheck after years of frozen pay. Again, every little bit is a good thing but its incredibly small and will certainly be lost to taxes and increased cost of living which FAR outweigh any pay increases that anyone has gotten lately, public or private (unless you're a banker.)

So yeah, federal workers are right there in the boat too. I'd appreciate it if folks would stop and think about that before bashing people who are working hard every day for EVERYONE's best interest.

[Gravitymaster 0]

It's not about what is fair. It's about what the tax-payers can afford. We can no longer afford all the government "resources" we have paid for in the past. Times have changed. Politicians are afraid to do what we all know they must do.

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Your trying to blame our lack of budget and inability to fix the deficit problem on the private sector? Thats what I am talking about when I say "who put us in this situation".

Let me put it this way your house gets back up with shit from your sewer system. The shit is half way up the walls. You have two options fix the problem and remove the shit, or raise the ceiling so you have more room to fill with shit. What do you do?

If we had a booming economy we would not be in such dire straits. The recession was primarily caused by greed of a lot of people, with Wall Street being top of the list. Don't blame air traffic controllers, national lab researchers, the National Weather Service and FBI agents for the economy being lousy.

No

Cause government employess are already paid higher than non gov counter parts

Not so fast; that's not the general rule. In many instances equivalent jobs in the private sector generally pay more than the public sector, especially for professionals.

[JerryBaumchen 1,468]

Hi rush,

Quote

Cause government employess are already paid higher than non gov counter parts

I could not disagree more.

I spent 30 yrs as a federal employee; Mech. Engr.

Every year Congress does a pay study of the private sector and then decides what the feds should get.

Over those 30 yrs I averaged ~85% of my counterparts in the private sector.

You do not know what you are talking about.

JerryBaumchen

[kallend 2,148]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Your trying to blame our lack of budget and inability to fix the deficit problem on the private sector? Thats what I am talking about when I say "who put us in this situation".

Let me put it this way your house gets back up with shit from your sewer system. The shit is half way up the walls. You have two options fix the problem and remove the shit, or raise the ceiling so you have more room to fill with shit. What do you do?

If we had a booming economy we would not be in such dire straits. The recession was primarily caused by greed of a lot of people, with Wall Street being top of the list. Don't blame air traffic controllers, national lab researchers, the National Weather Service and FBI agents for the economy being lousy.

No

Cause government employess are already paid higher than non gov counter parts

Not so fast; that's not the general rule. In many instances equivalent jobs in the private sector generally pay more than the public sector, especially for professionals.

Don't expect rushmc to bother with facts.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 2,148]

Quote

It's not about what is fair. It's about what the tax-payers can afford. We can no longer afford all the government "resources" we have paid for in the past. Times have changed. Politicians are afraid to do what we all know they must do.

I don't think we can afford Wall Street bankers either. They trash the economy and walk away with huge bonuses.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

Quote

It's not about what is fair. It's about what the tax-payers can afford. We can no longer afford all the government "resources" we have paid for in the past. Times have changed. Politicians are afraid to do what we all know they must do.

I don't think we can afford Wall Street bankers either. They trash the economy and walk away with huge bonuses.

The could never have gotten away with it if it weren't for the scumbag Lawyer/Politicians getting rich off the scumbag Wall Street Bankers.

[rushmc 23]

Not so fast; that's not the general rule. In many instances equivalent jobs in the private sector generally pay more than the public sector, especially for professionals.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Hi rush,

Quote

Cause government employess are already paid higher than non gov counter parts

I could not disagree more.

I spent 30 yrs as a federal employee; Mech. Engr.

Every year Congress does a pay study of the private sector and then decides what the feds should get.

Over those 30 yrs I averaged ~85% of my counterparts in the private sector.

You do not know what you are talking about.

JerryBaumchen

I posted some links to kallend

There were news stories this fall that were showing on average fed gov workers made up to 60% that their private sector counterparts

This of course, does not cover everyone

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Gravitymaster 0]

Don't expect Kallend to bother with facts.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Don't expect Kallend to bother with facts.

then there is this article

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/08/29/federal-state-workers-overpaid/

And of course, there is a mix but, generally speaking....

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,148]

Quote

Quote

Don't expect Kallend to bother with facts.

then there is this article

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/08/29/federal-state-workers-overpaid/

And of course, there is a mix but, generally speaking....

Hey FactMan, seems like this link of yours contradicts your earlier statement:

Quote

There were news stories this fall that were showing on average fed gov workers made up to 60% that their private sector counterparts

Of course, the garbled syntax of that statement makes it hard to understand what you meant.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 2,148]

Quote

Not so fast; that's not the general rule. In many instances equivalent jobs in the private sector generally pay more than the public sector, especially for professionals.

Don't expect rushmc to bother with facts.

[texascrw 1]

Quote

Quote

It's not about what is fair. It's about what the tax-payers can afford. We can no longer afford all the government "resources" we have paid for in the past. Times have changed. Politicians are afraid to do what we all know they must do.

I don't think we can afford Wall Street bankers either. They trash the economy and walk away with huge bonuses.

I don't think we can afford misguided, liberal politicians either. They want to trash our rights and walk away with our guns.

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

Hey FactMan

[rushmc 23]

Wow

I have to admit

I did not know that there were only 4 or 5 different jobs in the Fed gov

Go figure

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[cvfd1399 0]

The public sector might make a few bucks less or more compared to the private sector, but I guarantee you they work a hell of a lot less hours. Our entire public works, fire dept. admin, police admin, clerk of courts, etc shut down at 3:30 most only work a 7-7.5 hour day. The private guys in the same fields are still working at dark, weekends etc.

You can say that an engineer in the private makes 50k and the public makes 40k but by the hour public makes out much better.

[ShcShc11 0]

Quote

http://m.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obama-orders-raise-biden-members-congress-federal-workers_692223.html

Looks like topic creator is jealous of the job-creators.

[JerryBaumchen 1,468]

Hi 1399,

As I mentioned above, I was a Mech. Engr. for the feds for 30 yrs.

All professionals ( as I was ) in the federal gov't. are exempt. That means that you get your salary, no overtime. Now there might be some exceptions, but that is the standard situation.

I know because some of my management tried & tried to get us overtime. Nope, never happened.

You guys should really get some facts before you spout off. Just sayin,

JerryBaumchen

PS) When I retired in 1999 the Administrator of the agency, who oversaw ~3800 employees, was getting about $135K per year. What might you think that position would pay in the private sector?