The Liberal/Progressive War on Science

[kelpdiver 2]

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Let us use up all of this fossil fuel and then we would have no other alternative than to switch to wind, solar, and unicorn farts.

Didn't you watch Mad Max? Doesn't seem like a nice place to live...seems selfish to insist on living like kings and letting our grandchild battle dregs on motorcycles on the highways.

[kelpdiver 2]

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"Why do you have that wine?"
"Because it's the best!"
"Well then drink it."
"Can't do that. Too valuable."

wine, unlike oil, does have a perfect age, after which it will decay. (with the possible exception of port, which may improve forever and at least for a century).

[Remster 30]

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Once it gets to 1:1, it will take a barrel of oil in energy to drill a barrel of oil. All the mental gymnastics in the world will not make that a usable source of energy.

To be fair, at 1:1, it may still make sense to use 1J of energy to get 1J of oil. Oil may have other economic benefits (transportability, etc) that would make it still desirable. But once there, anything lower than 1:1 starts to not make much sense...

Remster

[billvon 3,120]

>To be fair, at 1:1, it may still make sense to use 1J of energy to get 1J of oil.

As a source of raw materials, agreed. But it no longer makes sense as a source of energy.

[brenthutch 444]

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Let us use up all of this fossil fuel and then we would have no other alternative than to switch to wind, solar, and unicorn farts.

Didn't you watch Mad Max? Doesn't seem like a nice place to live...seems selfish to insist on living like kings and letting our grandchild battle dregs on motorcycles on the highways.

Oh I never considered MAD MAX as an intellectual primer. But props to you for thinking outside the box. And BTW in the end the good guys ending up winning. So.. Your point is.....?

[brenthutch 444]

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>To be fair, at 1:1, it may still make sense to use 1J of energy to get 1J of oil.

As a source of raw materials, agreed. But it no longer makes sense as a source of energy.

Then why does solar, wind, ethanol, bio-diesel, et all make sense?

[kelpdiver 2]

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Oh I never considered MAD MAX as an intellectual primer. But props to you for thinking outside the box. And BTW in the end the good guys ending up winning. So.. Your point is.....?

there were no winners there. If you thought that, maybe rewatch the movies, and stay as far away from a position of policy influence as possible. The good of our nation depends upon this.

[billvon 3,120]

>Then why does solar, wind, ethanol, bio-diesel, et all make sense?

Solar EROEI: 7:1
Wind EROEI: 18:1
Corn ethanol EROEI: 1.3:1
Sugar ethanol EROEI: 5:1
Biodiesel EROEI: 1.3:1

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

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Let us use up all of this fossil fuel and then we would have no other alternative than to switch to wind, solar, and unicorn farts.

Didn't you watch Mad Max? Doesn't seem like a nice place to live...seems selfish to insist on living like kings and letting our grandchild battle dregs on motorcycles on the highways.

Oh I never considered MAD MAX as an intellectual primer. But props to you for thinking outside the box. And BTW in the end the good guys ending up winning. So.. Your point is.....?

It wasn't an intellectual primer. It was a bunch of stunt guys who got to make a movie. Aussie parallel to the Hal Needham/Burt Reynolds film "Hooper."

And it didn't have a "happy ending", simply vengance fulfilled.

History has shown that the breakdown of a society leads to chaos and anarchy. Lots of violence and death. Sooner or later one group wins out, and the groups that didn't win usually suffer. The closer the parity between the groups, the longer it takes to establish a dominant one.
And the more suffering and death.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo