kallend 2,147
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Dave:
Would you agree that we have always had penal laws? Of course you would. We have long had situations where if a person does something that is against policy it is considered to be a bad thing.
But how about bringing a penalty if someone doesn't do something? Yes, we've had those, too. Failure to perform jury service or file taxes. Those are issues that are troublesome.
States themselves have requirements to purchase auto insurance. States can do that due to their police powers that the federal government does not have. States have lots of authority that federal government does not have.
But now we're in a situation when the federal government is exercising police powers via taxation. Nobody saw the tax angle (in fact, if it was really a "tax" then the SCOTUS had no business hearing it because the courts have no jurisdiction to hear cases under the Anti-Injunction Act.)
What we have then is a penalty. Dave brought up the point of a penalty without due process.
Under tax law, we all get treated the same could could have some benefits. Had the law been, "we aer raising taxes by $3k per year on everybody, but creating a loophole for those with insurance so that they don't have to pay it" then nobody would be discussing the issues of authority. Of course the feds have the ability to do that.
That's not what this is. The ACA is an act of legislation that declares the failure to perform an act (purchase insurance) to be worthy of a penalty. Without Due Process or punishment without a judicial trial. Kudos to davjohns for picking up on that. The SCOTUS opinion may have opened the door for another challenge.
It's not a tax for which exceptions are made. It's a penalty for an act of omission. How does one fight it? How does one say, "I shouldn't have to pay this?
It's not a tax. It's a penalty against a class of people without judicial review. Take a look at the Constitution to see what Dave and I are getting at.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
Would you agree that we have always had penal laws? Of course you would. We have long had situations where if a person does something that is against policy it is considered to be a bad thing.
But how about bringing a penalty if someone doesn't do something? Yes, we've had those, too. Failure to perform jury service or file taxes. Those are issues that are troublesome.
States themselves have requirements to purchase auto insurance. States can do that due to their police powers that the federal government does not have. States have lots of authority that federal government does not have.
But now we're in a situation when the federal government is exercising police powers via taxation. Nobody saw the tax angle (in fact, if it was really a "tax" then the SCOTUS had no business hearing it because the courts have no jurisdiction to hear cases under the Anti-Injunction Act.)
What we have then is a penalty. Dave brought up the point of a penalty without due process.
Under tax law, we all get treated the same could could have some benefits. Had the law been, "we aer raising taxes by $3k per year on everybody, but creating a loophole for those with insurance so that they don't have to pay it" then nobody would be discussing the issues of authority. Of course the feds have the ability to do that.
That's not what this is. The ACA is an act of legislation that declares the failure to perform an act (purchase insurance) to be worthy of a penalty. Without Due Process or punishment without a judicial trial. Kudos to davjohns for picking up on that. The SCOTUS opinion may have opened the door for another challenge.
It's not a tax for which exceptions are made. It's a penalty for an act of omission. How does one fight it? How does one say, "I shouldn't have to pay this?
It's not a tax. It's a penalty against a class of people without judicial review. Take a look at the Constitution to see what Dave and I are getting at.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
kallend 2,147
QuoteQuoteQuoteWhere does it say the IRS will come after you?
Doesn't have to. Where is it written that the ONLY taxing body in the USA is the IRS?
I pay lots of taxes to the Great State of Illinois and to my county, township, city, school district... without any participation by the IRS.
More non-sequitur babble. Will the IRS come after you for not paying your taxes to the State of illinois? What other collection authority does the IRS have other than collecting taxes and assessing penalties for non-payment of taxes?
That duck is quacking pretty loud!!
So according to you, state and local taxes are not taxes at all. Fascinating, but imbecilic.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
mirage62 0
Quote
The impeachment of a Supreme Court justice takes the same process as impeaching a president......
Hey Bill keep this in mind when next year he rules against something....right now "He took a stand" next year he will a shit bird conservative who doesn't know anything......
And the left will want him impeached.
Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little
kallend 2,147
QuoteQuoteAnd kallend - what are your thoughts on my proposition that the government encourages freeloading? Wouldn't the problem be solved if we simply said, "We're not covering you any more?"
-------------------------------------------------------------
Mitt disagrees with your proposition. And so do I.
“Using tax penalties, as we did, or tax credits, as others have proposed, encourages ‘free riders’ to take responsibility for themselves rather than pass their medical costs on to others,” Mitt Romney, in a 2009 USA Today op-ed....
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
billvon 3,114
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)
>right now "He took a stand" next year he will a shit bird conservative who doesn't
>know anything......
>And the left will want him impeached.
Yes, they will. And I hope they are ignored as well.
>know anything......
>And the left will want him impeached.
Yes, they will. And I hope they are ignored as well.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteWhere does it say the IRS will come after you?
Doesn't have to. Where is it written that the ONLY taxing body in the USA is the IRS?
I pay lots of taxes to the Great State of Illinois and to my county, township, city, school district... without any participation by the IRS.
More non-sequitur babble. Will the IRS come after you for not paying your taxes to the State of illinois? What other collection authority does the IRS have other than collecting taxes and assessing penalties for non-payment of taxes?
That duck is quacking pretty loud!!
So according to you, state and local taxes are not taxes at all. Fascinating, but imbecilic.
Not even close to what I said. Project much?
kallend 2,147
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteWhere does it say the IRS will come after you?
Doesn't have to. Where is it written that the ONLY taxing body in the USA is the IRS?
I pay lots of taxes to the Great State of Illinois and to my county, township, city, school district... without any participation by the IRS.
More non-sequitur babble. Will the IRS come after you for not paying your taxes to the State of illinois? What other collection authority does the IRS have other than collecting taxes and assessing penalties for non-payment of taxes?
That duck is quacking pretty loud!!
So according to you, state and local taxes are not taxes at all. Fascinating, but imbecilic.
Not even close to what I said. Project much?
Back to the beginning, what does the IRS have to do with Romneycare's penalties/taxes?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
mnealtx 0
Quote"Roberts has become the Manchurian Jurist, whispering sweet rhetoric into conservatives' ears while delivering results to the leftish establishment which runs Washington."
Who knew that limiting the Commerce Clause, limiting the "Necessary and Proper" clause and limiting the coercion of the States by Fed.gov was "delivering results to the leftish establishment"?
QuoteSo he's trying to curry favor with liberals, Obama and 'the chattering class' whatever that is. And he wants a legacy. And the media is running him. All of which is about what I expect from the right when someone doesn't follow the party line 100%.
Which, of course, is why the left never said any of the same things over Citizen's United...right?
Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
billvon 3,114
>Who knew that limiting the Commerce Clause, limiting the "Necessary and Proper"
>clause and limiting the coercion of the States by Fed.gov was "delivering results to the
>leftish establishment"?
What they meant, of course, what that "Roberts didn't do what we wanted so he is a traitor."
>Which, of course, is why the left never said any of the same things over Citizen's
>United...right?
?? They said very similar things. They should be ignored as well.
>clause and limiting the coercion of the States by Fed.gov was "delivering results to the
>leftish establishment"?
What they meant, of course, what that "Roberts didn't do what we wanted so he is a traitor."
>Which, of course, is why the left never said any of the same things over Citizen's
>United...right?
?? They said very similar things. They should be ignored as well.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteWhere does it say the IRS will come after you?
Doesn't have to. Where is it written that the ONLY taxing body in the USA is the IRS?
I pay lots of taxes to the Great State of Illinois and to my county, township, city, school district... without any participation by the IRS.
More non-sequitur babble. Will the IRS come after you for not paying your taxes to the State of illinois? What other collection authority does the IRS have other than collecting taxes and assessing penalties for non-payment of taxes?
That duck is quacking pretty loud!!
So according to you, state and local taxes are not taxes at all. Fascinating, but imbecilic.
Not even close to what I said. Project much?
Back to the beginning, what does the IRS have to do with Romneycare's penalties/taxes?
Nothing. That was the whole point.
Bolas 5
Re: impeachment of a justice.
Tried only once unsuccessfully.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Chase
Tried only once unsuccessfully.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Chase
Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.
billvon 3,114
>Tried only once unsuccessfully.
Hmm. He "was impeached for allegedly letting his partisan leanings affect his court decisions." Would be strange indeed to impeach someone for the opposite - but hopefully it won't come to that.
Hmm. He "was impeached for allegedly letting his partisan leanings affect his court decisions." Would be strange indeed to impeach someone for the opposite - but hopefully it won't come to that.
QuoteRe: impeachment of a justice.
Tried only once unsuccessfully.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Chase
If anyone should be impeached, it should be Thomas for his decisions and reasoning (or lack of) behind them
Here's something Romney said:
“Using tax penalties, as we did, or tax credits, as others have proposed, encourages ‘free riders’ to take responsibility for themselves rather than pass their medical costs on to others,” Mitt Romney,in a 2009 USA Today op-ed.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
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