Walker Wins

[rushmc 23]

Wisconsin wins

Big Labor gets a message

Now on to November.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[airdvr 210]

Barry dropped the ball here. He couldn't risk looking like he was backing a loser, even though Dem bigwigs came out for him in '08.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[1969912 0]

Nice one. I bet some dems are a bit upset about this

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[jgoose71 0]

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Barry dropped the ball here. He couldn't risk looking like he was backing a loser, even though Dem bigwigs came out for him in '08.

Well, he did tweet his support for the Dem candidate. That should be enough for them to throw big money at him in '12....

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[wayneflorida 0]

Rebublican/Tea Party cheated again.
v

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v


v

/s/

[rushmc 23]

This is what really upsets them

And the WI results will start even more

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/06/2-major-california-cities-approve-pension-cuts-for-city-workers/?intcmp=trending

Quote

2 major California cities approve pension cuts for city workers

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Rebublican/Tea Party cheated again.
v

v


v


v


v

/s/

Bastards

Another reason for voter ID laws

(which a judge stopped in WI by the way)

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rehmwa 2]

I think whichever side loses should jot down all the armegeddon statements they claimed will happen and we'll look at the list in a year. For example,

Since Walker won: Collect that list and we'll look at it in a year see if the state collapsed. I'll start with one that was provided to me last week by a very serious young girl:

- 50% of all the school kids will be sitting in the street with no education in one year

add all of yours and we'll stay quiet and come back in a year to test those claims.

(And I heard just as ridiculous statements from the pro-Walker side too).

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

Quote

I think whichever side loses should jot down all the armegeddon statements they claimed will happen and we'll look at the list in a year. For example,

Since Walker won: Collect that list and we'll look at it in a year see if the state collapsed. I'll start with one that was provided to me last week by a very serious young girl:

- 50% of all the school kids will be sitting in the street with no education in one year

add all of yours and we'll stay quiet and come back in a year to test those claims.

(And I heard just as ridiculous statements from the pro-Walker side too).

We can look at WI and see what has happened to date

The state went from a negative budget balance to a surplus

Schools with negative balances went to surplus balances within thier budgets

NO ONE was fired or layed off

Pretty good start dont you think?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[livendive 8]

I thought the recall was a poor attempt anyhow. Walker won the election...deal with it (in the absence of serious ethical breach, criminal activity, etc).

My only complaints about the entire situation were:
a) how political the cuts were in the first place (entirely unions, which usually vote blue, but exempting emergency workers who generally lean red). I think tax increases and spending cuts should at least make appearances of bipartisanship, with the entire populace bearing the burden, not just the other guys. and
b) the infusion of out of state cash to a state election. I'm on Ron Paul's email distribution and support him, but also have the same complaint about him. Something like 2/3rds of the money the GOP spent in Wisconsin came from out of state, and Ron Paul keeps asking me to donate to this or that liberty-minded politician in some other state. Those issues/elections should be decided by the people in those states, and I think those of us *not* in those states should leave them alone and let them decide what's best for them.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[lawrocket 3]

Quote

My only complaints about the entire situation were:
a) how political the cuts were in the first place (entirely unions, which usually vote blue, but exempting emergency workers who generally lean red). I think tax increases and spending cuts should at least make appearances of bipartisanship, with the entire populace bearing the burden, not just the other guys. and

When a state or municipality that has collectively bargained employees makes cuts, it will hit union members. Nobody was surprised when Walker ended high-speed rail. His issue was that his initial election wasn't a mandate to go as far as he did.

Of course, now he has the electoral mandate to do what he did - and keep on doing it! A MASSIVE backfire.

Quote

the infusion of out of state cash to a state election.

Both sides pumped in massive amounts of money because this is a battleground. Plenty of people see a domino effect. Here in California, rest assured that Jerry Brown watched these results closely. This is a state battle with massive national implications. Think of out-of-state money for gay marriage. Wisconsin is a catalyst.

I've been thinking for about 2 minutes what this really means. I have always thought that unions were necessary 100 years ago to balance the power of industry. I have long concluded that the balance of power has shifted so much in favor of unions that something needed to be done. This is a step towards that.

Knee jerk tells me that unions are on a precipice. Wisconsin's idea will spread (and no arguing with the budget numbers in Wisconsin). Unions will therefore need to find some strategy to maintain their relevance. And here's my thought:

Unions are a special interest, always have been, and have exercised disproportionate power (think those legislators weren't compensated for fleeing Wisconsin?) as a special interest. Now their power is on the downturn which corporate influence is on an upswing (and yes, Citizen's United has played a role in that.

For unions to maintain their relevance, they have to now take the lead in DECREASING special interest influence. rules benefiting unions at the expense of corporations and businesses won't work anymore. So, unions should admit to themselves that they are on their way down, and lobby for rules that limit all influence - INCLUDING THEIR OWN.

I hope unions go down and take corporate influence with them. This is my great hope about the long-term effects of this election.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[grimmie 186]

When the unions go down, the economy will be pretty bleak in 30 years.

[lawrocket 3]

I don't want the unions to "go down." Remember when unions existed for workplace safety, etc? Here in Cali, we have federal and state laws that mandate everything that unions negotiated. They are a victim of their own successes.

What about now? My sense is that unions, like any other business, are in the business of making their own money. My issue with them is that they are so highly protected. The Sherman Antitrust Act doesn't apply to them.

And when collective bargaining hits government, the government - unlike a business - is not bargaining with its own money. Unions have SO much power and influence that I believe that they have become the robber barons that they were created to balance out.

I just want to see a more level playing ground. AND - I have a philosophical objection to unions in government employment. Other may disagree, and that's fine.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[wayneflorida 0]

Quote

Quote

My only complaints about the entire situation were:
a) how political the cuts were in the first place (entirely unions, which usually vote blue, but exempting emergency workers who generally lean red). I think tax increases and spending cuts should at least make appearances of bipartisanship, with the entire populace bearing the burden, not just the other guys. and

When a state or municipality that has collectively bargained employees makes cuts, it will hit union members. Nobody was surprised when Walker ended high-speed rail. His issue was that his initial election wasn't a mandate to go as far as he did.

Of course, now he has the electoral mandate to do what he did - and keep on doing it! A MASSIVE backfire.

Quote

the infusion of out of state cash to a state election.

Both sides pumped in massive amounts of money because this is a battleground. Plenty of people see a domino effect. Here in California, rest assured that Jerry Brown watched these results closely. This is a state battle with massive national implications. Think of out-of-state money for gay marriage. Wisconsin is a catalyst.

I've been thinking for about 2 minutes what this really means. I have always thought that unions were necessary 100 years ago to balance the power of industry. I have long concluded that the balance of power has shifted so much in favor of unions that something needed to be done. This is a step towards that.

Knee jerk tells me that unions are on a precipice. Wisconsin's idea will spread (and no arguing with the budget numbers in Wisconsin). Unions will therefore need to find some strategy to maintain their relevance. And here's my thought:

Unions are a special interest, always have been, and have exercised disproportionate power (think those legislators weren't compensated for fleeing Wisconsin?) as a special interest. Now their power is on the downturn which corporate influence is on an upswing (and yes, Citizen's United has played a role in that.

For unions to maintain their relevance, they have to now take the lead in DECREASING special interest influence. rules benefiting unions at the expense of corporations and businesses won't work anymore. So, unions should admit to themselves that they are on their way down, and lobby for rules that limit all influence - INCLUDING THEIR OWN.

I hope unions go down and take corporate influence with them. This is my great hope about the long-term effects of this election.

I believe Walker's battle was against public unions not private industry unions.

[pirana 0]

Quote

b) the infusion of out of state cash to a state election. I'm on Ron Paul's email distribution and support him, but also have the same complaint about him. Something like 2/3rds of the money the GOP spent in Wisconsin came from out of state, and Ron Paul keeps asking me to donate to this or that liberty-minded politician in some other state. Those issues/elections should be decided by the people in those states, and I think those of us *not* in those states should leave them alone and let them decide what's best for them.

Blues,
Dave

Something like 80% of all campaign donations for Senators, Representatives, and Governors come from outside the area the candidates represent. Yeah, campaign financing is totally corrupt - at least as far as the donations representing the constituency.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[pirana 0]

Quote

I thought the recall was a poor attempt anyhow. Walker won the election...deal with it (in the absence of serious ethical breach, criminal activity, etc).

Yeah, pretty bogus process that allows for all this fuss and expense just because a minority didn't like him and didn't win - not the first time and not the second time. I suppose their next step is to do it again.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[pirana 0]

Quote

When the unions go down, the economy will be pretty bleak in 30 years.

The economy is bleak now, and will remain so for at least another generation, probably more. No elected official from either party, no union, and certainly not the public at large is going to change that. The forces in play are way bigger; essentially relegating our politicians (ALL of them) to being bit players on a global stage.

Unfortunately, most of our leadership appear to be either not smart enough to see the bigger and longer term picture and/or are afraid to talk about it. Past President Clinton is the only one who has even come close to being honest about this topic in his dicussions about needing to find new niches in the market. Everybody else is still busy playing find-the-pea, and then blaming the other side when it is discovered the pea has disappeared.

The buying power of the middle class and below will remain flat at best; and hopefully not go into outright freefall. The only significant chunk of people insulated are those with skin in the global game that can make hay from overseas development and it's use of the U.S. as a market for their goods.

The wacko extremist candidates being supported and their game of claims and blame are the best indicator of the weakness of our position.

I've been on this for about 8 years now; maybe in another decade or so some of our leaders will begin to show some honesty and intelligence on the topic of economics.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[Channman 2]

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Quote

Rebublican/Tea Party cheated again.
v

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v


v

/s/

Bastards

Another reason for voter ID laws

(which a judge stopped in WI by the way)

Using the Dem's get out the vote model works See that dude crying on national TV...about how democracy is dead...priceless.

Maybe, just maybe they felt the need to make everybody starts paying their fair share. I know thats what Obama would want.

[JohnRich 4]

Scott Walker has proven his dedication to the Second Amendment by signing into law right-to-carry legislation, castle doctrine legislation, and the Hunting Heritage Act during his short tenure as Wisconsin’s chief executive. Scott Walker also supported statewide preemption of firearm laws and an amendment to the Wisconsin Constitution guaranteeing the individual right to keep and bear arms.

Gun rights win.
Gun-o-phobes lose.

[Channman 2]

Quote

Scott Walker has proven his dedication to the Second Amendment by signing into law right-to-carry legislation, castle doctrine legislation, and the Hunting Heritage Act during his short tenure as Wisconsin’s chief executive. Scott Walker also supported statewide preemption of firearm laws and an amendment to the Wisconsin Constitution guaranteeing the individual right to keep and bear arms.

Gun rights win.
Gun-o-phobes lose.

There is alot about this Gov. you can like, such as standing his ground and not compromissing with his values, much like the Rep. establishment would have liked him to do early on.

Heard much from the tolerant left on asking for civility, or how not to act stupidly...It seems Gov. Walker is receiving a great deal of death threats, primarily on the internet. I haven't heard any cries from the left, media or the POTUS asking for calm and or cooler heads.

Well OK, I'm not surprised... deep down inside they want to see this guy catch a bullet.

[billvon 3,111]

>Big Labor gets a message

So do governors. Go after unions and get ready to deal with a recall election.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

b) the infusion of out of state cash to a state election. I'm on Ron Paul's email distribution and support him, but also have the same complaint about him. Something like 2/3rds of the money the GOP spent in Wisconsin came from out of state, and Ron Paul keeps asking me to donate to this or that liberty-minded politician in some other state. Those issues/elections should be decided by the people in those states, and I think those of us *not* in those states should leave them alone and let them decide what's best for them.

Blues,
Dave

Something like 80% of all campaign donations for Senators, Representatives, and Governors come from outside the area the candidates represent. Yeah, campaign financing is totally corrupt - at least as far as the donations representing the constituency.

and nobody knows how much union money came in because is does not have to be reported. Estimates, based on advertising spend and people that were brought in, equal or excede Walkers reported dollars

But in the end it is a guess

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

>Big Labor gets a message

So do governors. Go after unions and get ready to deal with a recall election.

They did get a message

They can survive a recall if they tell the truth and do what they said when campaigning to get elected

and

Not all states have recall

Iowa is one of them

Surveys done of small business in WI indicate they are ready to hire. They all were waiting on the recall (IE: hoping Walker would win)

And , since you brought it up, recalls in WI are NOT supposed to be based on policy. The WI recall was based on policy. But, a judge let it go forward anyway.

And now they can NOT do another recall until after the next election cycle

But I am glad governors got a message

A power message about how being conservative and taking on the unions is NOT a losing proposition

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

More info on spending which, exposes the lefty lie about the dollars

7 to 1 my ass

Quote

In terms of strict numbers, Walker spent some $30 million; Barrett and the unions spent $25 million. That’s not a 7-to-1 differential. And when you add in unions’ inherent advantage in ground game, you’re talking about a better-than-even split for Barrett.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

Rebublican/Tea Party cheated again.Mad

You have any data to back up that claim?