jclalor 12
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maadmax 0
I went to school.
For one thing, I am a Doctor of Divinity - Diploma and everything.
For another thing, I have taken (and passed) many, many courses in Logic and Stochastic Processes/Probability and Statistics.
For one thing, I am a Doctor of Divinity - Diploma and everything.
For another thing, I have taken (and passed) many, many courses in Logic and Stochastic Processes/Probability and Statistics.
Very impressive! Don't you ever wonder if your initial feelings that led you on such an intense search for God was real, and that where you have ended up was just a wrong turn along the way?
...
winsor 236
QuoteI went to school.
For one thing, I am a Doctor of Divinity - Diploma and everything.
For another thing, I have taken (and passed) many, many courses in Logic and Stochastic Processes/Probability and Statistics.
Very impressive! Don't you ever wonder if your initial feelings that led you on such an intense search for God was real, and that where you have ended up was just a wrong turn along the way?
...
Nope, I thought the concept of a deity was complete nonsense from the git-go. I am not very good at make-believe.
The only real change I have experienced is that I attributed religious conviction to stupidity when I was eight years old, but have since concluded that it is a manifestation of mental illness.
While I disapprove of picking on the kids on the short bus, I can see no harm in pointing out that someone barking at the moon is way fucked up.
Again, mental illness is not a crime so one has the right to be fucked up, but there is no need to exercise such a right.
BSBD,
Winsor
Marinus 0
QuoteDon't you ever wonder if your initial feelings that led you on such an intense search for God was real,
In my case those feelings were real, and I still have those feelings. That doesn't mean God is real, it only means I've those feelings. It leans to pantheism, btw, not that I believe that the universe is really God, I just sort of experience it that way. Probably just active temporal lobes or something. I neither mind nor care.
RonD1120 62
Quote
Not hardly - most people who do their homework thoroughly come to the conclusion that there is nothing to believe.
Belief is the realm of ignorance by its very nature.
BSBD,
Winsor
And, most people who humble themselves at the foot of the cross of Christ and, those who invite Him to come into their heart find reason and experience to confirm His existence.
It is just a matter of choice. If you are smart enough and brave enough why ask for help?
I for one, as well as several others posting here, know we need help.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
winsor 236
QuoteQuote
Not hardly - most people who do their homework thoroughly come to the conclusion that there is nothing to believe.
Belief is the realm of ignorance by its very nature.
BSBD,
Winsor
And, most people who humble themselves at the foot of the cross of Christ and, those who invite Him to come into their heart find reason and experience to confirm His existence.
It is just a matter of choice. If you are smart enough and brave enough why ask for help?
I for one, as well as several others posting here, know we need help.
Sanity in an asylum is not an asset.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is not a king - he is a paraiah.
RonD1120 62
QuoteQuoteQuote
Not hardly - most people who do their homework thoroughly come to the conclusion that there is nothing to believe.
Belief is the realm of ignorance by its very nature.
BSBD,
Winsor
And, most people who humble themselves at the foot of the cross of Christ and, those who invite Him to come into their heart find reason and experience to confirm His existence.
It is just a matter of choice. If you are smart enough and brave enough why ask for help?
I for one, as well as several others posting here, know we need help.
Sanity in an asylum is not an asset.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is not a king - he is a paraiah.
Certainly true in the SC.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
Coreece 190
QuoteI simply judge the tree by its fruit not by what a antique Jew supposedly had in mind for Christianity 2000 years ago. Since that time Christianity has pretty much proven that it's a hate-based violent ideology
That's just what you choose to conclude despite the fact that you already admitted in this thread that of the billions of christians, only a fraction might be the hateful bigots that shove their views down everyone's throat given the chance...again make up your mind.
I get the sense that you only choose to focus on the negatives in order to distance yourself and bolster disbelief. Why not just focus on Christ and forget what everyone else is doing? Maybe because living such a life is extremely difficult and though you see the virtue, it's completely contrary to what comes natural to us.
You already stated that your feelings to believe in God were real and that they're still there, but you just don't care anymore and continue to wallow in your apathy.
Your testimony seems to give credence to Romans 1:
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse."
QuoteThere's a couple of exceptions, (usually those brands of Christianity are seen as heretic by the main-stream, btw)
Well I can agree, but not for the reasons you think.
Of those billions, most are Catholic and there is practically no accord between them and Protestants and the few true believers that actually walk the earth, whoever they are.
“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few."
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
Coreece 190
QuoteQuoteFor one thing, I am a Doctor of Divinity - Diploma and everything.
Very impressive! Don't you ever wonder if your initial feelings that led you on such an intense search for God was real, and that where you have ended up was just a wrong turn along the way?
...
Nope, I thought the concept of a deity was complete nonsense from the git-go.
interesting, that would be like me spending tens of thousands of dollars to get my doctorate in Popobawa or Chupacabra....or is it? Perhaps there's more to it...maybe there is more to your story that you just don't want to admit?
QuoteThe only real change I have experienced is that I attributed religious conviction to stupidity when I was eight years old, but have since concluded that it is a manifestation of mental illness.
What great faith you have...Do you have any scientific medical evidence to prove your claim? Have you observed consistent differences in the neurochemistry between believers and atheists?
It's most likely you just made that up to suppress any natural feelings of desire to know God.
First belief was caused by stupidity, but then you most likely realized that even intellectuals believe, so now it must be mental illness...what's your next excuse?
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
billvon 3,080
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>interesting, that would be like me spending tens of thousands of dollars to get my
>doctorate in Popobawa or Chupacabra....
Something like that. Plenty of people study things they don't think they will use, like Russian or Old English lit. Indeed, I bet some of those people who you tout as experts have taken courses in pagan religions; you might ask the same of them.
>doctorate in Popobawa or Chupacabra....
Something like that. Plenty of people study things they don't think they will use, like Russian or Old English lit. Indeed, I bet some of those people who you tout as experts have taken courses in pagan religions; you might ask the same of them.
Marinus 0
QuoteThat's just what you choose to conclude despite the fact that you already admitted in this thread that of the billions of christians, only a fraction might be the hateful bigots that shove their views down everyone's throat given the chance...again make up your mind.
I look at the whole of it, not the last couple of decades, in which Christianity indeed became much more benign. That's of course good, but not near enough to redeem it, especially since most Christians ignore the bloody history of their religion. In other words, most don't seem to learn from the past.
QuoteWhy not just focus on Christ and forget what everyone else is doing?
Because his ideas of how one should live are at best impractical. Look how he ended up, being peaceful is fine but shouting: "Can I have another. sir" when someone nails your wrist to a tree is a bit too much.
QuoteYou already stated that your feelings to believe in God were real and that they're still there, but you just don't care any more and continue to wallow in your apathy.
I have feelings that I call spiritual for want of a better word, and I've pantheistic-ish tendencies. Note that whether a pantheistic god (or probably Spinoza's God is a more accurate description) exists or not is completely irrelevant for us. Also note I do care about those feelings because they're good, I don't care why they're there. It's rather classic apatheism.
QuoteYour testimony seems to give credence to Romans 1:
There's a lot of possible explanations as to why I feel what I feel, but it seems strange that your God presents himself to me as a completely other diety, which isn't even of the same type. Also feelings are great and stuff, but they're almost by very nature irrational.
QuoteWell I can agree, but not for the reasons you think.
I think I mentioned the exact same reasons but in other words.
Coreece 190
QuoteI look at the whole of it
No you don't...You focus on the negative actions of power hungry political dissidents.
QuoteBecause his ideas of how one should live are at best impractical.
There is certainly some truth to this, which indeed points to the need for grace.
QuoteLook how he ended up, being peaceful is fine but shouting: "Can I have another. sir" when someone nails your wrist to a tree is a bit too much.
There you go with your negativity again...Is that really how he "ended up." If you're gonna accept some scripture on faith why stop short at his crucifixion?
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
Coreece 190
Quote>interesting, that would be like me spending tens of thousands of dollars to get my
>doctorate in Popobawa or Chupacabra....
Something like that. Plenty of people study things they don't think they will use, like Russian or Old English lit. Indeed, I bet some of those people who you tout as experts have taken courses in pagan religions; you might ask the same of them.
There is a huge difference between taking classes and dedicating your self to a doctorates in something you don't believe...I just think there is more to winsor's story. He claims to be a very logical person...I'm just pointing out the inconsistency and asking for clarification.
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
winsor 236
For one thing, I am a Doctor of Divinity - Diploma and everything.
Nope, I thought the concept of a deity was complete nonsense from the git-go.
Not terribly interesting (or time consuming or expensive) - look up the Universal Life Church.
The only real change I have experienced is that I attributed religious conviction to stupidity when I was eight years old, but have since concluded that it is a manifestation of mental illness.
Quote
Very impressive! Don't you ever wonder if your initial feelings that led you on such an intense search for God was real, and that where you have ended up was just a wrong turn along the way?
...
Nope, I thought the concept of a deity was complete nonsense from the git-go.
Quote
interesting, that would be like me spending tens of thousands of dollars to get my doctorate in Popobawa or Chupacabra....or is it? Perhaps there's more to it...maybe there is more to your story that you just don't want to admit?
Not terribly interesting (or time consuming or expensive) - look up the Universal Life Church.
QuoteWhat great faith you have...Do you have any scientific medical evidence to prove your claim? Have you observed consistent differences in the neurochemistry between believers and atheists?
People who have two-way conversations with invisible people are barking mad.
You are free to investigate the grotty details as you see fit.
QuoteIt's most likely you just made that up to suppress any natural feelings of desire to know God.
So far as you could tell. Your batting average is goose eggs from where I sit.
QuoteFirst belief was caused by stupidity, but then you most likely realized that even intellectuals believe, so now it must be mental illness...what's your next excuse?
Belief is a form of stupidity, displayed by emotional cripples and/or the truly stupid.
I do not respect the choice to live one's life on the basis of make-believe, and never did.
BSBD,
Winsor
Coreece 190
Still, what great faith you have. ( or in your own words 'ignorance.") You have no scientific proof to back up your claim.
Is this mental illness genetic...you are Jewish, right?
Is this mental illness genetic...you are Jewish, right?
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
Marinus 0
QuoteNo you don't...You focus on the negative actions of power hungry political dissidents.
Then the "power hungry dissident" was a very common type of Christian in the history of Christianity.
QuoteThere is certainly some truth to this, which indeed points to the need for grace.
Or it points to the fact that Jesus should have been more pragmatic.
QuoteThere you go with your negativity again...Is that really how he "ended up." If you're gonna accept some scripture on faith why stop short at his crucifixion?
It's plausible that Jesus existed. It's plausible that he was a royal pain in the ass of some powerful people. It's plausible that they wanted him out of the way. It's plausible that they made an example out of him by killing him in a particularly nasty and humiliating way. It's not so plausible he reanimated about 36 hours or so after he died.
To me Jesus is like Robin Hood or King Arthur. Probably based on (a)
real person(s), but most of the stories about him are legends or maybe even myths.
billvon 3,080
Your one warning.
winsor 236
QuoteStill, what great faith you have. ( or in your own words 'ignorance.") You have no scientific proof to back up your claim.
And you know precisely what about science?
I simply reserve the right to call bullshit.
The U.S. Government will routinely provide a medical discharge for a serviceman given to discussions with invisible people having unpopular names. If their invisible friend has a popular name, they may get promoted.
Unfortunately, 'Jesus' and 'Harvey' look identical, so conversing with either qualifies one as equally mentally ill. Religion may be a socially acceptable form of psychosis, but nuts is nuts.
QuoteIs this mental illness genetic...you are Jewish, right?
The emotional disorder whereby one is unable to face existance without some kind of cosmic security blanket does appear to be hardwired to some extent.
Woody Allen's beliefs in the movie "Sleeper" amounted to 'Sex and Death,' which translates to 'from whence do we come and to where do we go' -fundamental insecurities upon which religion feeds.
Come to think of it, he's both crazy as hell (forgive the clinical terminology) and jewish, so there may be something to that.
BSBD,
Winsor
Coreece 190
QuoteOr it points to the fact that Jesus should have been more pragmatic.
...and it's this mindset that has led to the bastardization and perversion of the faith.
I can't really think of anything more pragmatic than forcing a mass of people to "believe."
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...
quade 4
Doctor of Divinity.
How grueling that must have been. Must have taken at least a weekend to fill out the forms and write the check! 
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
kallend 2,112
Quote
People who have two-way conversations with invisible people are barking mad.
BSBD,
Winsor
I don't think they are necessarily mad, any more than people who think they see black spots in the attached image are mad. They are just suffering from inability of the human brain to reliably separate fact from illusion.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
winsor 236
QuoteDoctor of Divinity.
How grueling that must have been. Must have taken at least a weekend to fill out the forms and write the check!
Nah, more like half an hour, but it was well worth the time and $20.
kallend 2,112
QuoteQuoteDoctor of Divinity.
How grueling that must have been. Must have taken at least a weekend to fill out the forms and write the check!
Nah, more like half an hour, but it was well worth the time and $20.
$20? Did that include the robes?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The earliest Greek manuscripts contain the most textual variations.
Considering that some of the earliest manuscrpts were not discovered until hundreds of years after Christianity, did these early Christians then not have the right text? What of the writings of Paul that were believed to be his, only to be discovered later to be forgeries?
You would think an all-poweful God could at least get the same ground rules to everyone.
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