Why we need Voter ID laws

[rushmc 23]

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What part of sniping about dead voters was responsive to my comment about the objections to voter ID law implementation?

And I never said that things had to be easy, I said that the ID should be easy to obtain. That means not requiring multiple trips to a remote office, multiple forms to be filled out, restrictive office hours, etc. Yes, that part should be easy. I have no idea what else you were attempting to communicate, as usual.

Ya I get it

If it aint easy we shouldnt do it

Ya

I know

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

I haven't seen anybody objecting to voters having to identify themselves. That's a right wing talking point. It's the methods of identification that garner objection. If the ID is free and easily obtainable, most people don't have a problem with it.

I've only looked at the Alabama and Georgia provisions. Both provide for free ID. I think most voter ID laws provide for a free ID (only reasonable).

In most cases it is not only about being easy. Many do not want it at all

And if voter ID becomes more strict, I think more of the problem will show up

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[davjohns 1]

Um... I really have to stop researching this. The facts are ruining some arguments. I've found lots of information. This one kind of stood out. Lady was convicted of voting multiple times, under multiple names...some were men's names....

I don't want to claim that isolated incidents require overarching laws. But what I'm finding through very simple research is that this is not really isolated. One artile I read indicated that a 1984 gubernatorial election included as many as 100k fraudulent votes. Another article said estimates of ACORN fraud included 400K of 1.3M submissions (this was registration. Not votes).

http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/29/mississippi-naacp-leader-sent-to-prison-for-10-counts-of-voter-fraud/

The article:


While NAACP President Benjamin Jealous lashed out at new state laws requiring photo ID for voting, an NAACP executive sits in prison, sentenced for carrying out a massive voter fraud scheme.

In a story ignored by the national media, in April a Tunica County, Miss., jury convicted NAACP official Lessadolla Sowers on 10 counts of fraudulently casting absentee ballots. Sowers is identified on an NAACP website as a member of the Tunica County NAACP Executive Committee.

Sowers received a five-year prison term for each of the 10 counts, but Circuit Court Judge Charles Webster permitted Sowers to serve those terms concurrently, according to the Tunica Times, the only media outlet to cover the sentencing.

“This crime cuts against the fabric of our free society,” Judge Webster said.

Sowers was found guilty of voting in the names of Carrie Collins, Walter Howard, Sheena Shelton, Alberta Pickett, Draper Cotton and Eddie Davis. She was also convicted of voting in the names of four dead persons: James L. Young, Dora Price, Dorothy Harris, and David Ross.

In the trial, forensic scientist Bo Scales testified that Sowers’s DNA was found on the inner seals of five envelopes containing absentee ballots.

This wasn’t Sowers’s first run-in with the law. Sowers previously had her probation revoked for disturbing the peace at a junior high school library, the Commercial Appeal of Memphis reported in 1990. During a hearing at that time, Sowers played the race card. She claimed to be the victim of “an attempt by powerful whites to silence” her, the newspaper reported. It didn’t work. She was ordered back to prison to complete the remaining two years of a three-year sentence she received for check forgery.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Um... I really have to stop researching this. The facts are ruining some arguments. I've found lots of information. This one kind of stood out. Lady was convicted of voting multiple times, under multiple names...some were men's names....

I don't want to claim that isolated incidents require overarching laws. But what I'm finding through very simple research is that this is not really isolated. One artile I read indicated that a 1984 gubernatorial election included as many as 100k fraudulent votes. Another article said estimates of ACORN fraud included 400K of 1.3M submissions (this was registration. Not votes).

http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/29/mississippi-naacp-leader-sent-to-prison-for-10-counts-of-voter-fraud/

The article:


While NAACP President Benjamin Jealous lashed out at new state laws requiring photo ID for voting, an NAACP executive sits in prison, sentenced for carrying out a massive voter fraud scheme.

In a story ignored by the national media, in April a Tunica County, Miss., jury convicted NAACP official Lessadolla Sowers on 10 counts of fraudulently casting absentee ballots. Sowers is identified on an NAACP website as a member of the Tunica County NAACP Executive Committee.

Sowers received a five-year prison term for each of the 10 counts, but Circuit Court Judge Charles Webster permitted Sowers to serve those terms concurrently, according to the Tunica Times, the only media outlet to cover the sentencing.

“This crime cuts against the fabric of our free society,” Judge Webster said.

Sowers was found guilty of voting in the names of Carrie Collins, Walter Howard, Sheena Shelton, Alberta Pickett, Draper Cotton and Eddie Davis. She was also convicted of voting in the names of four dead persons: James L. Young, Dora Price, Dorothy Harris, and David Ross.

In the trial, forensic scientist Bo Scales testified that Sowers’s DNA was found on the inner seals of five envelopes containing absentee ballots.

This wasn’t Sowers’s first run-in with the law. Sowers previously had her probation revoked for disturbing the peace at a junior high school library, the Commercial Appeal of Memphis reported in 1990. During a hearing at that time, Sowers played the race card. She claimed to be the victim of “an attempt by powerful whites to silence” her, the newspaper reported. It didn’t work. She was ordered back to prison to complete the remaining two years of a three-year sentence she received for check forgery.

We seem to hear often about the right wing talking points

Well, the lefts taling points are

#1 It happens so rarley why worry about it

and

#2 It is too hard

Why does the left care so much?

Well who do you think fellons, illegals, ACORN staff and NAACP supporters support?


Still had a chance to fix it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

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Ya I get it

No, you really, really don't.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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Quote

Ya I get it

No, you really, really don't.

Your're right

I cant unless I am a total emotional wreck that being a full fledged liberal is. (some of them anyway. Wendy, you are excluded from my remarks here)

I just cant feel it

Nice come back by the way

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[davjohns 1]

Quote

Quote

Ya I get it

No, you really, really don't.

The sexual tension between you two is palpable.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

NCAA supporters

That was truly priceless, sportsfan.

[davjohns 1]

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Quote

NCAA supporters

That was truly priceless, sportsfan.

I missed that. Freudian?

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

NCAA supporters

That was truly priceless, sportsfan.

True

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Ya I get it

No, you really, really don't.

The sexual tension between you two is palpable.

He gets what he dished out

Nothing more

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Andy9o8 2]

So you admit you're hot for him. I'm telling your wife.

[DanG 1]

Quote

I cant unless I am a total emotional wreck that being a full fledged liberal is. (some of them anyway. Wendy, you are excluded from my remarks here)

That's priceless. I'm not that liberal at all. I actually align with what Wendy says about 99% of the time. Pro tip: Wendy's not that liberal either. On some issues, I'm probably pretty far to her right. You just can't see it because everyone who disagrees with you must be some hippie, bead wearing, love child. You really need to open your eyes to differing viewpoints.

I'm done responding to you in this thread because it's pointless. Sorry to everyone else for wasting bandwidth wrestling with the proverbial pig.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

I cant unless I am a total emotional wreck that being a full fledged liberal is. (some of them anyway. Wendy, you are excluded from my remarks here)

That's priceless. I'm not that liberal at all. I actually align with what Wendy says about 99% of the time. Pro tip: Wendy's not that liberal either. On some issues, I'm probably pretty far to her right. You just can't see it because everyone who disagrees with you must be some hippie, bead wearing, love child. You really need to open your eyes to differing viewpoints.

I'm done responding to you in this thread because it's pointless. Sorry to everyone else for wasting bandwidth wrestling with the proverbial pig.

Maybe your're not
But you come in (for the second time) telling me to get my "knee jerk" checked


And then you tell me that I dont get it??


So, you reaped what you sewed

We have had some good exchanges

They usually dont start out by telling someone they have a medical issue for what they believe

So, you need to re-read YOUR post and then look in the mirror

Got it?

Oh, and Wendy is a social liberal and if I can remember correctly, she has self identified as much

Her posts show respect which make it easy to converse with her

You? Not so much

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

So you admit you're hot for him. I'm telling your wife.

You really are a lawyer?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Andy9o8 2]

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[to rushmc] I'm done responding to you in this thread because it's pointless.

Now there's a sentence that's at least 3 words too long.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

[to rushmc] I'm done responding to you in this thread because it's pointless.

Now there's a sentence that's at least 3 words too long.

I have to say, if it were not for those like you I would spend little time here. It is those, like you, who help me reaffirm my opinions and beliefs on a daily basis keeping me interested enough to keep coming back

Thank You

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kelpdiver 2]

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No, no one is affected

http://pjmedia.com/jchristianadams/2012/05/16/53000-dead-voters-found-in-florida/

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I have learned that Florida election officials are set to announce that the secretary of state has discovered and purged up to 53,000 dead voters from the voter rolls in Florida

and!

Quote

But surely people aren’t voting in the names of dead voters, the voter fraud deniers argue. Wrong.


Keaton
Consider the case of Lafayette Keaton. Keaton not only voted for a dead person in Oregon, he voted for his dead son. Making Keaton’s fraud easier was Oregon’s vote by mail scheme, which has opened up gaping holes in the integrity of elections. The incident in Oregon just scratches the surface of the problem. Massachusetts and Mississippi are but two other examples of the dead rising on election day.

Florida should be applauded for taking the problem seriously, even if Eric Holder’s Justice Department and many state election officials don’t.

Did you read your citation? An editorial about Florida discovering dead people on the rolls and removing them. So far, so good. Of course people will die throughout the year and have to be purged. But then when we get to the part of are the dead voting, the singular example is of a guy in Oregon in PRISON for doing so.

Again, wake us up when we have a problem worth spending a lot of money on. (couldn't this money be used to buy all the NFL owners an extra deck on their publicly purchased stadiums?)

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

No, no one is affected

http://pjmedia.com/jchristianadams/2012/05/16/53000-dead-voters-found-in-florida/

Quote

I have learned that Florida election officials are set to announce that the secretary of state has discovered and purged up to 53,000 dead voters from the voter rolls in Florida

and!

Quote

But surely people aren’t voting in the names of dead voters, the voter fraud deniers argue. Wrong.


Keaton
Consider the case of Lafayette Keaton. Keaton not only voted for a dead person in Oregon, he voted for his dead son. Making Keaton’s fraud easier was Oregon’s vote by mail scheme, which has opened up gaping holes in the integrity of elections. The incident in Oregon just scratches the surface of the problem. Massachusetts and Mississippi are but two other examples of the dead rising on election day.

Florida should be applauded for taking the problem seriously, even if Eric Holder’s Justice Department and many state election officials don’t.

Did you read your citation? An editorial about Florida discovering dead people on the rolls and removing them. So far, so good. Of course people will die throughout the year and have to be purged. But then when we get to the part of are the dead voting, the singular example is of a guy in Oregon in PRISON for doing so.

Again, wake us up when we have a problem worth spending a lot of money on. (couldn't this money be used to buy all the NFL owners an extra deck on their publicly purchased stadiums?)

Post #118 by davjohns says it very well

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Post #118 by davjohns says it very well

Post 109 might have been a better one to pay attention to, though I do not have time to review them all this morning. But your's was a big zero - no substance to it at all.

But to your point - if the integrity of elections is keys, the more significant and proven problems lie with 1) inaccurate mechanical vote readers and 2) proprietary untrustworth Diebold electronic vote recorders. The number of lost votes to these far outweigh the fraud cases which all seem to end in convictions anyway.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

Post #118 by davjohns says it very well

Post 109 might have been a better one to pay attention to, though I do not have time to review them all this morning. But your's was a big zero - no substance to it at all.

But to your point - if the integrity of elections is keys, the more significant and proven problems lie with 1) inaccurate mechanical vote readers and 2) proprietary untrustworth Diebold electronic vote recorders. The number of lost votes to these far outweigh the fraud cases which all seem to end in convictions anyway.

I disagree

http://blog.syracuse.com/opinion/2011/12/troy_vote_fraud_arrests_no_rig.html

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

A simple search indicates it is a bigger issue than many want to believe.

http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/Content/News/Madison-County-officials-arrested-for-voter-fraud.aspx

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Many more

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=+voter+fraud+arrests&oq=+voter+fraud+arrests&aq=f&aqi=&aql=1&gs_l=serp.3...78.3375.3.3875.17.17.0.0.0.8.391.3422.0j6j9j1.18.0.eish.1.0.0.dkbZnXkBDGc&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=812dcb5c367d38b5&biw=1525&bih=821

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[davjohns 1]

Although not the type of fraud we are discussing here, I find this disturbing all the same:

Article:


Felony charges related to election fraud have touched the 2008 race for the highest office in the land.

Prosecutors in South Bend, Ind., filed charges Monday against four St. Joseph County Democratic officials and deputies as part of a multiple-felony case involving the alleged forging of Democratic presidential primary petitions in the 2008 election, which put then-candidates Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton on the Indiana ballot.

The officials are accused of taking part in a scheme to fake signatures and names on the primary petitions needed to run for president. Court papers say the plan was hatched by local Democratic Party officials inside the local party headquarters.

Among those charged is the former long-time chairman of the St. Joseph County Democratic Party, Butch Morgan, who allegedly ordered the forgeries. He was forced to resign when the allegations were first made public last October, even though his lawyer, Shaw Friedman, told Fox News at the time that Morgan did not do anything wrong.

The St. Joseph County Board of Voter Registration's Democratic board member, Pam Brunette, Board of Voter Registration worker Beverly Shelton and Democratic volunteer and former board worker Dustin Blythe also face charges.

According to affidavits, St. Joseph County Voter Registration Office worker Lucas Burkett told investigators that he was part of the plan that started in January 2008 "to forge signatures on presidential candidate petitions instead of collecting actual signatures from citizens."

The documents state that Burkett told investigators that “he was heavily involved in St. Joseph County political activities with the local Democratic party," and that "he had, in fact, personally forged several such signatures," and had attended meetings at the local Democratic party headquarters, where it was agreed to forge the petitions. Morgan, the County Democratic Chairman, allegedly "instructed Mr. Burkett, Pamela Brunette, Beverly Shelton, and Dustin Blythe to forge ballot petitions for presidential candidates," and that "all of them agreed to follow these instructions" by copying names and signatures from old election petitions.

According to affidavits, Burkett told investigators it was his job to "forge petitions for candidate Barack Obama," Shelton "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate Hillary Clinton" and Blythe "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate John Edwards." When Edwards dropped out of the race at the end of January 2008 and Burkett refused to continue the forgeries, Morgan allegedly ordered Blythe to then forge petitions for Barack Obama.

Indiana State Police investigators identified a total of 22 petitions that appeared to be faked, yet sailed through the Voter Registration Board as legitimate documents. The signature of the board's Republican supervisor, Linda Silcott, which is required for legal certification, appeared to be rubber stamped on the documents. She told investigators that she did not remember signing or authorizing her rubber stamp to be used.

Silcott also told investigators that she recognized the handwriting on the alleged forged Obama petitions as that of Blythe's.

The South Bend Tribune and independent political newsletter Howey Politics Indiana have reported that a handwriting analyst concluded last fall that Blythe's handwriting matched some of the alleged Obama fakes. When Fox News caught up to Blythe as he left the Voter Registration Board last November and asked him if he forged any signatures or faked any petitions, he repeatedly replied, "I don't have anything to say."

The case raises the possibility that the president's campaign and that of Clinton’s, could have been legally challenged in Indiana if the alleged forgeries were discovered during the race.

Under state law, presidential candidates need to qualify with 500 signatures from each of Indiana's nine congressional districts. Indiana elections officials say that in St. Joseph County, which is the 2nd Congressional District, the Obama campaign qualified with 534 signatures; Clinton's camp had 704.

But the signatures, which were certified by the elections board, were never challenged. If the number of legitimate signatures for Obama or Clinton fell below the legal requirement of 500, they could have been bounced from the state ballot. Reports have previously put the number of phony signatures for both candidates at about 150, but state investigators plucked names from the petitions at random and cited only 20 individual alleged forgeries as part of their case. They say their investigation of the petitions continues.

Multiple voters, including Indiana's former Democratic Gov. Joe Kernan, told Fox News that their names and signatures were phonies.

"That's not my signature," Charity Rorie told Fox News as she sat in her kitchen in Mishawaka, Ind.. The mother of four was stunned that her name and signature, and those of her husband, appeared on one of the Obama petitions. She said they "absolutely" were fakes and was troubled that personal details such as their address and birthdays were also included.

"It was shocking," she said. "Why did they do that, and where did they get it from?"

"I did not sign for Barack Obama," Democratic voter Robert Hunter told Fox News as he stared at the Obama petition that included his name and purported signature supporting the candidate. While he observed that the scrawl looked "very close" to his real one, it was not.

"I always put 'Junior' after my name, every time... there's no 'Junior' there," Hunter told us. "I don't like anybody using my name for anything other than myself."

"It's scary," Charity said. "A lot of people have already lost faith in politics and the realm of politics and that solidifies our worries and concerns."

As for Burkett, a 26-year-old lifelong Democrat, "he is the whistle-blower in this," his lawyer, Andrew B. Jones, told Fox News.

"Lucas really is the hero in this situation. He is someone who stood up for good government, and has cooperated with the state police and will continue to do so."

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Although not the type of fraud we are discussing here, I find this disturbing all the same:

Article:


Felony charges related to election fraud have touched the 2008 race for the highest office in the land.

Prosecutors in South Bend, Ind., filed charges Monday against four St. Joseph County Democratic officials and deputies as part of a multiple-felony case involving the alleged forging of Democratic presidential primary petitions in the 2008 election, which put then-candidates Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton on the Indiana ballot.

The officials are accused of taking part in a scheme to fake signatures and names on the primary petitions needed to run for president. Court papers say the plan was hatched by local Democratic Party officials inside the local party headquarters.

Among those charged is the former long-time chairman of the St. Joseph County Democratic Party, Butch Morgan, who allegedly ordered the forgeries. He was forced to resign when the allegations were first made public last October, even though his lawyer, Shaw Friedman, told Fox News at the time that Morgan did not do anything wrong.

The St. Joseph County Board of Voter Registration's Democratic board member, Pam Brunette, Board of Voter Registration worker Beverly Shelton and Democratic volunteer and former board worker Dustin Blythe also face charges.

According to affidavits, St. Joseph County Voter Registration Office worker Lucas Burkett told investigators that he was part of the plan that started in January 2008 "to forge signatures on presidential candidate petitions instead of collecting actual signatures from citizens."

The documents state that Burkett told investigators that “he was heavily involved in St. Joseph County political activities with the local Democratic party," and that "he had, in fact, personally forged several such signatures," and had attended meetings at the local Democratic party headquarters, where it was agreed to forge the petitions. Morgan, the County Democratic Chairman, allegedly "instructed Mr. Burkett, Pamela Brunette, Beverly Shelton, and Dustin Blythe to forge ballot petitions for presidential candidates," and that "all of them agreed to follow these instructions" by copying names and signatures from old election petitions.

According to affidavits, Burkett told investigators it was his job to "forge petitions for candidate Barack Obama," Shelton "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate Hillary Clinton" and Blythe "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate John Edwards." When Edwards dropped out of the race at the end of January 2008 and Burkett refused to continue the forgeries, Morgan allegedly ordered Blythe to then forge petitions for Barack Obama.

Indiana State Police investigators identified a total of 22 petitions that appeared to be faked, yet sailed through the Voter Registration Board as legitimate documents. The signature of the board's Republican supervisor, Linda Silcott, which is required for legal certification, appeared to be rubber stamped on the documents. She told investigators that she did not remember signing or authorizing her rubber stamp to be used.

Silcott also told investigators that she recognized the handwriting on the alleged forged Obama petitions as that of Blythe's.

The South Bend Tribune and independent political newsletter Howey Politics Indiana have reported that a handwriting analyst concluded last fall that Blythe's handwriting matched some of the alleged Obama fakes. When Fox News caught up to Blythe as he left the Voter Registration Board last November and asked him if he forged any signatures or faked any petitions, he repeatedly replied, "I don't have anything to say."

The case raises the possibility that the president's campaign and that of Clinton’s, could have been legally challenged in Indiana if the alleged forgeries were discovered during the race.

Under state law, presidential candidates need to qualify with 500 signatures from each of Indiana's nine congressional districts. Indiana elections officials say that in St. Joseph County, which is the 2nd Congressional District, the Obama campaign qualified with 534 signatures; Clinton's camp had 704.

But the signatures, which were certified by the elections board, were never challenged. If the number of legitimate signatures for Obama or Clinton fell below the legal requirement of 500, they could have been bounced from the state ballot. Reports have previously put the number of phony signatures for both candidates at about 150, but state investigators plucked names from the petitions at random and cited only 20 individual alleged forgeries as part of their case. They say their investigation of the petitions continues.

Multiple voters, including Indiana's former Democratic Gov. Joe Kernan, told Fox News that their names and signatures were phonies.

"That's not my signature," Charity Rorie told Fox News as she sat in her kitchen in Mishawaka, Ind.. The mother of four was stunned that her name and signature, and those of her husband, appeared on one of the Obama petitions. She said they "absolutely" were fakes and was troubled that personal details such as their address and birthdays were also included.

"It was shocking," she said. "Why did they do that, and where did they get it from?"

"I did not sign for Barack Obama," Democratic voter Robert Hunter told Fox News as he stared at the Obama petition that included his name and purported signature supporting the candidate. While he observed that the scrawl looked "very close" to his real one, it was not.

"I always put 'Junior' after my name, every time... there's no 'Junior' there," Hunter told us. "I don't like anybody using my name for anything other than myself."

"It's scary," Charity said. "A lot of people have already lost faith in politics and the realm of politics and that solidifies our worries and concerns."

As for Burkett, a 26-year-old lifelong Democrat, "he is the whistle-blower in this," his lawyer, Andrew B. Jones, told Fox News.

"Lucas really is the hero in this situation. He is someone who stood up for good government, and has cooperated with the state police and will continue to do so."

Yes

This is a completely different angle to this mess which many want to believe is not happening

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln