Coreece 190 #226 April 11, 2012 Quote>>Look at how boobies drive people into fits >These people are a small minority... Offer a topless picture of someone to the Bonfire forum and see whether only a small minority say yes. (And see how enthusiastically they say it!) >My penis is for urination and ejaculation, but some wouldn't wanna see >me do that in public. I agree that some would not want to see that. It depends on the group. If you're on a long hike, and a few guys go off the trail to pee, for many people it's not a big deal. For some it's a big honking screaming deal, which is odd. That's what it's for, and there's no bathroom nearby. But a lot of people have been conditioned by our media that breasts and penises are for sex only, and any appearance of either is a cause for excitement. We seem to stick to general standards that all can find acceptable. We have business professional standards... We have civilized standards for public behavior... We have standards that are for the most part acceptable for the majority of the general audience... No big deal...you're free to get freaky in private, whatever your flavor.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #227 April 11, 2012 >We seem to stick to general standards that all can find acceptable. >We have business professional standards... >We have civilized standards for public behavior... >We have standards that are for the most part acceptable for the majority of the general audience... For your sake - never, ever go to Lost Prairie. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #228 April 11, 2012 Quote>We seem to stick to general standards that all can find acceptable. >We have business professional standards... >We have civilized standards for public behavior... >We have standards that are for the most part acceptable for the majority of the general audience... For your sake - never, ever go to Lost Prairie. I'm sure we can handle it, our kids may be a bit confused, however...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #229 April 11, 2012 >I'm sure we can handle it, our kids may be a bit confused, however... Yep, knowing your audience is key. Overall we have too many people who are rude/offensive for no reason (i.e. don't care what people think) and too many people who take offense for no reason (i.e. don't care about any situation other than their own.) Both sides could do with a little more respect for others, IMO. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #230 April 11, 2012 QuoteDid you even read my post? There is plenty of sex in american cinema...tits, ass, vagina...even bruce willis's penis, you happy now? I've of course a lot of experience with European cinema and I've even more experience with American cinema. Don't make a mistake about that, the American market share in cinema and television on this side of the pond would probably make your jaw drop on the floor. It's far more likely that you know little to nothing about European cinema, and that it's you who can't make a comparison between American and other Western cinema/TV Compared to other Western cinema, here's hardly any sex in American cinema, and in the rare occasion sex is shown, it's usually shown in a fake-looking stylized way. boobs and penises are body-parts, not sex, btw, sex is two or more people having sex. Gratuitous violence on the other hand is common. There's sub genres of American films that seem to exist solely to portray violence. Violence is displayed very graphically and often in a positive light. etc. etc. Don't be to butt-hurt though, I love American flicks. And I'm not the only one, I think 90% of flicks shown in the theatres in NL are USA products. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #231 April 11, 2012 I'm all for keeping sex away from children, but I can't imagine a child will be harmed by the sight of a boob, or any other part of the body for that matter. (except for vaginas of course, vaginas scarred me for life) It doesn't look like children of nudists are damaged by seeing naked people a lot. If anything they're probably more comfortable with their body than others. It's not like we Euros run around flashing our boobs and dicks, or something, in fact we're probably just as boring as Americans when it comes to sex and stuff. But a non-sexual portrayal of boobs or dicks is no big deal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #232 April 11, 2012 QuoteIt's far more likely that you know little to nothing about European cinema, and that it's you who can't make a comparison between American and other Western cinema/TV I'm not trying to... The misconception that we were talking about is that american culture glorifies violence, and demonizes sex. That's not so...the explicitly graphic imagery of both sex and violence are implied when sex and violence reaches a certain level...no big deal. How do we glorify violence when we expel kids for bringing water guns to school? We certainly have a problem with sex and violence in this country. We have sex education to help with the sex problem. I propose gun education to help with the violence problem and dispel the ignorance of hoplophobia.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #233 April 11, 2012 QuoteI'm all for keeping sex away from children, but I can't imagine a child will be harmed by the sight of a boob, or any other part of the body for that matter. (except for vaginas of course, vaginas scarred me for life) It doesn't look like children of nudists are damaged by seeing naked people a lot. If anything they're probably more comfortable with their body than others. It's not like we Euros run around flashing our boobs and dicks, or something, in fact we're probably just as boring as Americans when it comes to sex and stuff. But a non-sexual portrayal of boobs or dicks is no big deal. It's no big deal when dealt with in the proper context and environment when the PARENTS choose.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #234 April 11, 2012 >How do we glorify violence when we expel kids for bringing water guns to school? That's the whole issue. We have problems with sex AND violence. In an ideal world violence is not that big an issue. It doesn't make up most of every movie. It's not seen as a near-universal solution to all fictional problems. The threat of it is not a big deal - and things from pocketknives to water pistols are not all that evil. They're just tools and toys. But we don't live in that world. We live in a world where, in the media, a cop is not a cop unless he has a gun, and is useless without it. We live in a society where people without guns are labeled sheep, gun-o-phobes and victims. Partly as a result of such influences, we have a lot of them and they are used a lot. And partly as a result of THAT, even a water pistol on a kid is a big stinking deal - because it could be mistaken for a real gun, and an elementary schooler with a gun doesn't seem that unreasonable when the media portrays them as the cause of, and solution to, all our problems. Thus we glorify AND demonize violence. We make a big stinking deal about it, and then act all surprised when even schools make a big stinking deal about it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #235 April 11, 2012 Well, darling, now you're twisting my words. American cinema doesn't demonize sex (OTOH the "easy" girl in a horror flick usually dies a violent death moments after being a so called slut) American cinema blushes and stutters when it handles the subject sex. But American cinema (we're not talking about US culture in general here) does glorify violence. Not in every flick, and not all violence is an ode to violence, but violence is often glorified. Mind you that violence, and even glorified violence aren't necessarily a bad thing. For example "Saving Private Ryan" is a very graphic and violent and brilliant movie. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #236 April 11, 2012 Quote The misconception that we were talking about is that american culture glorifies violence, and demonizes sex. That's not so...the explicitly graphic imagery of both sex and violence are implied when sex and violence reaches a certain level...no big deal. Just look at the ratings - there can be a lot of violence in a PG/PG13 movie, but no more than a boob flash or 2 seconds of ass. And it's been this way for a long while - think back to the Westerns like Shane - lots of fighting, shooting, dying, and the only sexual tension was glances between Shane and the farmer's wife. The only place that I can think of as more violent, yet still lily white on sex is Hong Kong, which of course shares a common influence with Britain. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #237 April 11, 2012 QuoteIt's no big deal when dealt with in the proper context and environment when the PARENTS choose. You might want to avoid the rest of the Western World then if you've got kids. Like I said, we're discrete enough, but (for example) on many Western beaches, the top is optional for women, and no one is going to ask you for permission over that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #238 April 11, 2012 Throwing in a bit of a tangent here but, why do we place sex at the core of a relationship? How often have you heard a man/husband explain how he was taught by his parents to choose a suitable mate and culture the relationship? In other words, how do you find a soul mate? My counseling experience indicates never or almost never. One of the catch phrases I heard from a female client, a man will let the right woman go because it is not the right time. He will then marry the wrong woman because it is the right time. Men stumble in marriage with less understanding then they have about jumping out of an airplane. Both decisions put everything on the line for an expected positive return. The odds are better for the skydive. The man says, I love her and she will never change. The woman says, I love him and I can change him. Most marriages hit the critical mass crisis in 3 to 5 years. If they get through that one the next one is around 12 - 15 years. The next major breaking point is when the kids are grown and gone. Now the empty nest focuses everything on each others faults, bad judgments, lack of attention and just plain boredom. Why can't we teach our sons to do a better job and make marriages work? The cycle of domestic violence demonstrates that abusive husbands come from abusive fathers. The key to breaking that cycle is to teach nurturing concepts to fathers before their abuse totally programs their sons into abusive mates. Why don't we just teach nurturing concepts to our sons so that they know how to nurture a woman as a wife? The Bible commands the husband to love his wife. On the other side, the wife is commanded to respect her husband. How does a man earn that respect? He earns it by loving, nurturing and cherishing the woman he has chosen to marry. Is it any wonder the divorce rate is over 50% and more and more men are choosing homosexuality and avoiding the responsibility of a regular marriage?Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #239 April 11, 2012 Quote Is it any wonder the divorce rate is over 50% and more and more men are choosing homosexuality and avoiding the responsibility of a regular marriage? The idea of you counselling anybody is pretty scary. Quote Why can't we teach our sons to do a better job and make marriages work? Yup, failed marriages are always the husband's fault. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #240 April 11, 2012 Quoteand more men are choosing homosexuality and avoiding the responsibility of a regular marriage? I personally chose homosexuality to avoid vaginas not marriage. In normal modern societies, same-sex marriage is regular marriage, btw. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #241 April 11, 2012 QuoteThat's the whole issue. We have problems with sex AND violence. I agree...kudos on your previous post as well. Quotewe glorify AND demonize violence. We make a big stinking deal about it, and then act all surprised when even schools make a big stinking deal about it. Yep, phobias have have a tendency to make problems worse and and prompt ignorant people to fix 'em by ridiculous rules and regulations that only cause more problems...like condemning violent candy, super soakers and kids that enjoy them.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #242 April 11, 2012 Quote Well, darling, now you're twisting my words. I'm not twisting your words...Squeak is the one that made the reference to the misconception on how americans relate to sex and violence. That's what we were talking about. If you Europeans want the golden globe for most perversion in a film, that's fine...I'm sure you deserve it. Quote American cinema blushes and stutters when it handles the subject sex. meh, we're just not that preoccupied with it...I can get my own sex. Us writers are more concerned with creative content and storyline. Why spend all the extra money on nude actors and film for extended sex scenes that do absolutely nothing to enhance the plot. All we have to do is market the film as having a sex scene and people come in droves tossing money at our feet...besides, the real money is in movies that appeal to a general audience. Futhermore, most all adults are familiar with sex, but many are not that familiar with violence. We go to the movies to experience something unique. We all know what it's like to to make love...but what's it like to be in a life threatening situation? How do you respond? Quote But American cinema (we're not talking about US culture in general here) does glorify violence. It glorifies sex and violence...there is not some conspiracy to show preference to one or the other. The problem is that we're not really comparing apples to oranges...there are many creative ways to depict sex, but many more creative ways to depict violence. You may have 10 movies that have gunshots and only 1 that shows hard sex...10 movies that show hard sex and 1 movie that shows a man being sawed in half with a chainsaw from head to balls. How many movies are out there that are equivalent to "Dead Alive?" Quote Mind you that violence, and even glorified violence aren't necessarily a bad thing. Damn Straight!Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #243 April 11, 2012 >Yep, phobias have have a tendency to make problems worse and and >prompt ignorant people to fix 'em by ridiculous rules and regulations >that only cause more problems... As do fetishes. The sort of fetish for violence we have in our society leads people to see a need to protect themselves from a largely-imaginary threat. Which also feeds into ignorant people desiring ridiculous levels of protection from chimeras. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #244 April 11, 2012 QuoteQuoteIt's no big deal when dealt with in the proper context and environment when the PARENTS choose. You might want to avoid the rest of the Western World then if you've got kids. Hey listen Mari, AND Bill for that matter...This isn't about me...OK!?!? I work in media, film, advertising you name it. In Hollywood I worked on content for European television as well. I'm well aware or your preoccupation with sex. I found it rather boring have to edit this shit day in and day out for a bunch of horny fucks just to make a buck. I worked with a guy that quit a good job to work for "Girls gone Wild." He hated it...He said it was great for the first couple of weeks, but then he realized how fucked up these people's lifestyles really are.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #245 April 11, 2012 >why do we place sex at the core of a relationship? Because we make such a big stinking deal about it in the media. If we didn't try to hide it from everyone like it was the crowning secret of our society - and we didn't make "doing it wrong" into a big societal sin - you'd see a lot fewer people so fixated on making the core of their relationship. It would just be one of many factors in one's relationships. >Why can't we teach our sons to do a better job and make marriages work? You can, but the way to do that is to teach them first respect for themselves, then respect for others. All too often society teaches the skills needed to stalk, acquire and have sex with someone - and then teaches them that that's "success." That, overall, is a very small part of the overall challenge of any relationship. >Is it any wonder the divorce rate is over 50% and more and more men are >choosing homosexuality and avoiding the responsibility of a regular >marriage? On the plus side, more people than ever before are able to enter into marriage - no matter what sex their partner is. Also, I think overall you do the marriage a disservice by concentrating on the man's responsibility. Both parties bear equal responsibility for the success of a marriage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #246 April 11, 2012 Quote[ Us writers are more concerned with creative content and storyline. Why spend all the extra money on nude actors and film for extended sex scenes that do absolutely nothing to enhance the plot. The Europeans (or anyone seeing more than one Adam Sandler movie) have to be rolling their eyes. 'Creative with good storylines' might apply to 10% of the movies released. Sequels, mimicking the last blockbuster, and appealing to stupid kids with lots of free time are the better descriptors. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #247 April 11, 2012 QuoteQuote>She asks me to and it makes her feel good. So you have no desires in that direction, and it does not bring you pleasure - it's just a service you perform to make her feel good? Yeah, that is pretty much the case. Interesting, but kind of sad...you're missing out. Given your especially unusual perspective, I can see how it could seriously skew your view of other people's sexual motivations (be they gay or straight). Like a person without a sense of taste consulting for chefs and winemakers. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #248 April 11, 2012 bottom line is that there's more money in general audience and comedy films...extended sex scenes are a waste of time. flash a couple of implied nude scenes in the trailer to grab attention and get on with it. Capitalism at it's finest...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #249 April 11, 2012 Darling, you're shitting with the wrong hole. You've absolutely no experience whatsoever with European attitudes towards sex. You might have heard a thing or two on FOX news, but Bill O'reilly is a demented retard, so you might want to turn to another source. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #250 April 11, 2012 Quotebottom line is that there's more money in general audience and comedy films...extended sex scenes are a waste of time. flash a couple of implied nude scenes in the trailer to grab attention and get on with it. Capitalism at it's finest... People remember the sex scenes from Basic Instinct and Fatal Attraction more than they do the rest of the movies (save the rabbit in pot scene). As you say, lie to the audience in the trailer to get them to come, but not actually do it because we're prudes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
