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maxmadmax

How many rounds of ammo are too many?

By maxmadmax, in Speakers Corner

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quade    4

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There really isn't any need for that. The containers are specifically designed to hold smokeless powder.
Those containers have to meet standards (set by the DOT IIRC) for behavior in a fire. They are required to fail at a certain pressure point to prevent an explosion.
That applies to both the plastic and metal containers.


Prove it.


Ok, after reading your more detailed expanation behind the "prove it", DOT regs for smokeless container construction are covered under CFR49 173.93, but I can't find any text of that.
SAMMI has recommendations for smokeless storage HERE and mention "DOT approved containers" without actually saying what those are.
And it's 25# not 40. My mistake.



Just because there is a regulation that covers it, doesn't mean it's "safe."

I would have thought skydivers, among all people, would understand that concept.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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Coreece    190

Coreece
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There really isn't any need for that. The containers are specifically designed to hold smokeless powder.
Those containers have to meet standards (set by the DOT IIRC) for behavior in a fire. They are required to fail at a certain pressure point to prevent an explosion.
That applies to both the plastic and metal containers.


Prove it.


Show me the money...



I will happily reimburse you for the cost of the one pound container of black powder you hold a lit road flare to.

The medical bills as a result of your doing so are your own concern.



That wasn't the experiment.



OK, drop the cigarette in. However you want to do it. I was giving you the benefit of JR's "melt" = "loose" theory.



It seems you're having trouble distinguishing between black powder and smokeless powder...
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

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quade    4

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There really isn't any need for that. The containers are specifically designed to hold smokeless powder.
Those containers have to meet standards (set by the DOT IIRC) for behavior in a fire. They are required to fail at a certain pressure point to prevent an explosion.
That applies to both the plastic and metal containers.


Prove it.


Show me the money...


I will happily reimburse you for the cost of the one pound container of black powder you hold a lit road flare to.
The medical bills as a result of your doing so are your own concern.


That wasn't the experiment.


OK, drop the cigarette in. However you want to do it. I was giving you the benefit of JR's "melt" = "loose" theory.


It seems you're having trouble distinguishing between black powder and smokeless powder...



Pick your doom! Black, smokeless, either way. Just make sure you get video. Or better, make sure your buddy does, 'cause I think you're going to the emergency room.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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airtwardo    7

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>And that's no excuse for firefighters to stand by and do nothing to save someone's
>home.
In some cases it is a reason to burn someone's home down, actually.


Case, Bill. Case. You are using your common tactic of perverting a singular event that is only marginally related to try to stir the pot and deflect attention from that which you don't agree with.


Either that or JR is . . . ;)

His claim that a pound of black powder is no more dangerous than a gallon of gasoline for instance.

They may (or may not) contain the same amount of energy, but a person can walk up to a gallon of gasoline and put a cigarette out in it. I don't think the same can be said for the pound of black powder. At least not and still have a hand afterwards. It all has to do with air/fuel mixture.



Ummm....he didn't SAY black powder, he said gun powder.

There IS a difference you know...:) HUGE one.










~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

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quade    4

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>And that's no excuse for firefighters to stand by and do nothing to save someone's
>home.
In some cases it is a reason to burn someone's home down, actually.


Case, Bill. Case. You are using your common tactic of perverting a singular event that is only marginally related to try to stir the pot and deflect attention from that which you don't agree with.

Either that or JR is . . . ;)
His claim that a pound of black powder is no more dangerous than a gallon of gasoline for instance.
They may (or may not) contain the same amount of energy, but a person can walk up to a gallon of gasoline and put a cigarette out in it. I don't think the same can be said for the pound of black powder. At least not and still have a hand afterwards. It all has to do with air/fuel mixture.

Ummm....he didn't SAY black powder, he said gun powder.
There IS a difference you know...:) HUGE one.


Again, fine . . . do it with black powder or smokeless gunpowder. Your choice.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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airtwardo    7

airtwardo

but a person can walk up to a gallon of gasoline and put a cigarette out in it.

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If you're referring to the old parlor trick...do it
~ s l o w l y ~ with the cigarette, you'll burn your hand off.

Yeah do it real fast and yes the fuel/air fumes won't have time to heat up enough to ignite.

It's a silly comparison.


Real comparison... on the floor, pile of smokeless powder and a puddle of gas, drop a cigarette in each and see which has more 'energy'. which causes the most damage.:)
Another old 'parlor' trick is to make a cigarette into a bomb, stick a burning one into a glass bottle and blow in some 02 with a cutting torch...KaBOOM! :ph34r: -pullin' glass outta the walls for a week.











~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

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GQ_jumper    4

GQ_jumper



I'm wondering if anyone here, perhaps we can talk Shah or JR into doing it, would be willing to do an experiment for me and post it on YouTube. It would be essentially recreating the Mythbuster's experiment, but instead of the robot dumping the bullets you wear typical fireman gear and do it up close and remain there for several minutes.

Obviously the reason I wouldn't do it is because I'm fairly certain it's going to hurt. However, those that have said it isn't anything to worry about should be perfectly fine with the concept.

Maybe we could work out some sort of arrangement where the "loser pays" in terms of the cost of the expendables involved.

Any takers?



Now I don't always have a perfect memory, but I do recall saying a few posts before you made this challenge that I had done that exact thing.

Take that round count in excess of 250,000, with a good percentage of them being tracer(phosphorous rounds), thousands of flares of different types, and 100+ 120MM rounds. I didn't have any protective gear on, unless you count running shorts, a t-shirt, and one boot as protective gear and I came out unscathed.

I can also count numerous times in which the feed tray cover on a crew-served weapon has been opened and the round on the feed tray cooked off. Only once have I ever seen more than a scratch, and it was a round digging itself into a guys chin. I agreed that cooked off rounds can put your eye out, but unless your number is up you aren't going to be killed.

Since you wanted a video I'll see what I can do to dig up the aftermath of my adventure. KH posted the aftermath of their strike on livelink.com, I'll see if I can dig it up.

Although I am going to assume that like most all dz.com arguments everyone is going to ignore the only person that has direct experience in the topic because it would stop their opportunity to insult people who disagree with them.
History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower

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rhaig    0

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Although I am going to assume that like most all dz.com arguments everyone is going to ignore the only person that has direct experience in the topic because it would stop their opportunity to insult people who disagree with them.


butbutbut.... personal attacks aren't allowed... the moderators would... oh... yeah...

Those rules don't apply to the mods. I forgot.
--
Rob

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SkyDekker    1,465

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quade:

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I wouldn't do it is because I'm fairly certain it's going to hurt.



GQ_jumper:

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round digging itself into a guys chin. I agreed that cooked off rounds can put your eye out,



Why would anybody ignore your direct experience? You guys appear to be agreeing with eachother.

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quade    4

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Listen just fund the experiment, and I'll worry about the safety issues ok?


It's funded! Go for it.


now were you going to do the counter experiment with the gas can? You also claim that this is safe.



Well, I just know you want a quick answer to this so yeah, I'd be more than willing to do it. I don't think we're going to see any result much different than this though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUtqcxlIDXg

It's a reproducible experiment with fairly predictable results.

BTW, I said gallon of gas. Just to be as pedantic as you guys have been, you've added the bit about a gas can, although depending on the can it's not going to make a whole lot of hoo-ha difference.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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