Corzine: 'I don't know where the money is'

[wayneflorida 0]

1.2 billion

Quote:
He also apologized "to all those affected."


An apology would be jumping out of a 20 story building.

Joe Biden's go to guy.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/08/news/companies/corzine_mf_global/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

[DougH 270]

He will look for that money once he finds all the money he blew while running the fine state of NJ.

Trash.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[popsjumper 2]

It looks like our goobermint is spending a lot of our money duplicating efforts here.

-The Federal Bureau of Investigation
and
-other federal authorities
are probing the company, which is also being investigated by the
-House Financial Services Committee
-a subcommittee of House Financial Services
and the
-Senate Agriculture Committee.

Jill Sommers, commissioner of the
-U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission,


everybody wants ink..it doesn't matter what color.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

He will look for that money once he finds all the money he blew while running the fine state of NJ.

Trash.

The guy who killed OJ's wife has it.

[StreetScooby 5]

The money is in Europe... MF Global's London office used it for re-hypothecation. Be careful to read any documents you sign with brokerages and clearing houses. You'll find this, and other similar activities, are part of your agreement.


MF Global and the great Wall St re-hypothecation scandal

Quote

A similar re-hypothecation provision can be seen in MF Global’s U.S. client agreements. MF Global’s Customer Agreement for trading in cash commodities, commodity futures, security futures, options, and forward contracts, securities, foreign futures and options and currencies includes the following clause:

“7. Consent To Loan Or PledgeYou hereby grant us the right, in accordance with Applicable Law, to borrow, pledge, repledge, transfer, hypothecate, rehypothecate,loan, or invest any of the Collateral, including, without limitation, utilizing the Collateral to purchase or sell securities pursuant to repurchase agreements [repos] or reverse repurchase agreements with any party, in each case without notice to you, and we shall have no obligation to retain a like amount of similar Collateral in our possession and control.”

We are all engines of karma

[shah269 0]

How many people have gone to jail for causing and orchestrating the financial crisis?
Was it just Martha Stewart?

You know....the Shah of Iran was truly a fucked up cold blooded dictator but that boy knew how to deal with business.

Great story
Back in the mid 70's when the US had an energy problem Iran and Iraq were the only two countries from OPEC who sold Oil to the US. Well as with most businessmen Oil Men are corrupt and in it to make as much money as they can even if it's not legal or if it's not their money they are using to generate more funds.

Anyhow apparently there were these two "smart guys" who had found a way to use public funds to bring cheap oil over from Saudi and sell it to Iran at a huge profit. Well eventually someone caught on to the game.

So the Shah had them arrested for stealing the people's money. And then he did something amazing. He made sure no other business person would ever contemplate ever stealing people's money. He made them a case study.
He arrested the entire family, wife, kids...the blood line....or anyone who had a 1% chance of getting the money these guys had made.
Then he did something fun, he hung the kids first, then the wife all the while making the oil men watch....and then he hung the oilmen in front of all of their fellow oil men.

Now I'm not big on killing kids but what the Shah did make good sense. The kids would have benefited long after their dad was dead because let's face it odds are the guys had stuck money in all kinds of bank accounts. So in a way it was not a bad plan.

Thus I suggest we do the same. We erect gallows a the head of Wall street with a live 24/7 webcam. We arrest Mr. C and his family and his kids and well by now his kids kids. We start with the little ones and work our way up to Mr. C. I'm sure once he is hanging by his neck all this shit would stop real quick!

Now I'm not big on executions but I'm more than willing to hear any suggestions you may have to prevent such gambling with your hard earned income.

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[Gravitymaster 0]

I'm really glad I live in a civilized country.

[weekender 0]

I'm no expert on commodities but the rules are bit different and need to be changed. you are, as i've read and understand, permitted to take customer money and put it in a principal account overnight. provided you meet a collateral requirement. this principal account then can be traded. its never been a problem before because regulators and traders figured whats the worst than can happen overnight. oops

we now know. So as i see it, MF lost so much overnight it couldnt put the money back into the accounts. This happened becuase they were so highly leveraged and the underlying securities movement was great. Not normal and obviously not accounted for. Sadly, it looks like it isnt a crime. YET

The rules should be similiar to equities, no client money mixed with principal money. Can anyone explain to me why commodity rules are different? i have no idea.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[shah269 0]

Quote

I'm really glad I live in a civilized country.

YOU live in a civilized country....

Doesn't mean that the bankers on Wall Street don't see this as a civilized country.....

After all they are gabling with your money. Not like they are going to loose anything now are they? Will they go to jail? Nope! Will they keep the money they made? Yeah. Will they still live in the home they own? Sure why not! And will they use their gains to set up another company take you and your 401k for another ride? Sure!

At this moment in time we live in a nation where banks and investors are immune from taking huge risks with your livelihood. With little to no reproductions.

Again, how many people went to prison for their role in the financial meltdown? Remember S&L and how many did time? Well now look around.

You tell me if you were not held accountable for your actions and the financial risk to you was little to nothing would you do the same?

I know I would!
Mr. C will plead the 5th nonstop. He will then return home in his private jet, go to his warm home, eat a very nice dinner, maybe watch a movie, make love to his wife, think of his kids and sleep in a warm bed....hell he didn't lose any of his money now did he? He lost YOUR money!

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[mpohl 1]

Or as Mao used to say: "Punish one to deter one hundred," and "Kill a chicken to scare a monkey."

Quote

How many people have gone to jail for causing and orchestrating the financial crisis?
Was it just Martha Stewart?

You know....the Shah of Iran was truly a fucked up cold blooded dictator but that boy knew how to deal with business.

Great story
Back in the mid 70's when the US had an energy problem Iran and Iraq were the only two countries from OPEC who sold Oil to the US. Well as with most businessmen Oil Men are corrupt and in it to make as much money as they can even if it's not legal or if it's not their money they are using to generate more funds.

Anyhow apparently there were these two "smart guys" who had found a way to use public funds to bring cheap oil over from Saudi and sell it to Iran at a huge profit. Well eventually someone caught on to the game.

So the Shah had them arrested for stealing the people's money. And then he did something amazing. He made sure no other business person would ever contemplate ever stealing people's money. He made them a case study.
He arrested the entire family, wife, kids...the blood line....or anyone who had a 1% chance of getting the money these guys had made.
Then he did something fun, he hung the kids first, then the wife all the while making the oil men watch....and then he hung the oilmen in front of all of their fellow oil men.

Now I'm not big on killing kids but what the Shah did make good sense. The kids would have benefited long after their dad was dead because let's face it odds are the guys had stuck money in all kinds of bank accounts. So in a way it was not a bad plan.

Thus I suggest we do the same. We erect gallows a the head of Wall street with a live 24/7 webcam. We arrest Mr. C and his family and his kids and well by now his kids kids. We start with the little ones and work our way up to Mr. C. I'm sure once he is hanging by his neck all this shit would stop real quick!

Now I'm not big on executions but I'm more than willing to hear any suggestions you may have to prevent such gambling with your hard earned income.

[shah269 0]

Not saying it's right to kill kids or the dumb fucks wife but.....can you think of a better way to have these fucktards to stop screwing us?

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[weekender 0]

Quote

The money is in Europe... MF Global's London office used it for re-hypothecation. Be careful to read any documents you sign with brokerages and clearing houses. You'll find this, and other similar activities, are part of your agreement.


MF Global and the great Wall St re-hypothecation scandal

Quote

A similar re-hypothecation provision can be seen in MF Global’s U.S. client agreements. MF Global’s Customer Agreement for trading in cash commodities, commodity futures, security futures, options, and forward contracts, securities, foreign futures and options and currencies includes the following clause:

“7. Consent To Loan Or PledgeYou hereby grant us the right, in accordance with Applicable Law, to borrow, pledge, repledge, transfer, hypothecate, rehypothecate,loan, or invest any of the Collateral, including, without limitation, utilizing the Collateral to purchase or sell securities pursuant to repurchase agreements [repos] or reverse repurchase agreements with any party, in each case without notice to you, and we shall have no obligation to retain a like amount of similar Collateral in our possession and control.”

if that article explains it i am confused. the author uses specific terms inconsistently and as if they are interchangable. for example, he refers to broker dealers able to borrow then explains how it works referencing the rules for a prime broker. they are not the same thing. one can be the other but they dont have to. so which is it? can a prime broker do it AND a broker dealer or both??

the author seems to think bank, broker dealer and prime broker are all the same. they are not. in addition, he used equities as an explanation for a commodity transaction. they dont even have the same regulators or rules. that makes his comparisons meaningless.

by using jargon he doesnt understand he made the article impossible to understand. its a shame because he probably could have made a good point if he took the time to understand what he was saying.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

I'm no expert on commodities but the rules are bit different and need to be changed. you are, as i've read and understand, permitted to take customer money and put it in a principal account overnight. provided you meet a collateral requirement. this principal account then can be traded. its never been a problem before because regulators and traders figured whats the worst than can happen overnight. oops

we now know. So as i see it, MF lost so much overnight it couldnt put the money back into the accounts. This happened becuase they were so highly leveraged and the underlying securities movement was great. Not normal and obviously not accounted for. Sadly, it looks like it isnt a crime. YET

If he just suffered grave losses due to leverage and hubris, that wouldn't be criminal. But he claims to not even know where the money is, implying a failure to keep records at all. I know you have to keep every scrap of paper under the sun, have all external communication archived, even IMs...for his firm to fail to do this makes a strong implication of fraud.

[weekender 0]

Quote

Quote

I'm no expert on commodities but the rules are bit different and need to be changed. you are, as i've read and understand, permitted to take customer money and put it in a principal account overnight. provided you meet a collateral requirement. this principal account then can be traded. its never been a problem before because regulators and traders figured whats the worst than can happen overnight. oops

we now know. So as i see it, MF lost so much overnight it couldnt put the money back into the accounts. This happened becuase they were so highly leveraged and the underlying securities movement was great. Not normal and obviously not accounted for. Sadly, it looks like it isnt a crime. YET

If he just suffered grave losses due to leverage and hubris, that wouldn't be criminal. But he claims to not even know where the money is, implying a failure to keep records at all. I know you have to keep every scrap of paper under the sun, have all external communication archived, even IMs...for his firm to fail to do this makes a strong implication of fraud.

First thing i thought when it was announced that money was missing was a crime was commited. it is possible, i suppose, but i cannot figure out how you missplace money without fraud being commited by someone there. I am no accountant and record keeping is done way above me but i agree with you. if the money is missing thats WAY different than just lost in the market.

usually my post are explaining how just because you dont like something doesnt make it a crime. not here. i smell a rat. my previous posts, i would imagine, tend to show i am not reactionary about this stuff.

to be clear. i do not believe the loss's are a crime, sadly. i do believe the missing money is most likely a crime. two different points.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[mpohl 1]

RIGHT ON!

But these days it is like, "I am really sorry. But please don't take my Ferrari and yacht away from me!" Responsibility these days is out the window (ground floor!).

P.S.: Too bad the letter bomb to Ackermann (CEO, Deutsche Bank) didn't make it to its intended recipient. It is not like he has not been throwing financial "bombs" left and right.

Quote

...
An apology would be jumping out of a 20 story building.

Joe Biden's go to guy.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/08/news/companies/corzine_mf_global/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

[shah269 0]

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/2011/12/08/news/companies/corzine_mf_global/corzine-swearing-in.gi.top.jpg

Quote

"My sadness, of course, pales in comparison to the losses and hardships that customers, employees and investors suffered as a result of MF Global's bankruptcy."

OK give me one good reason why we can't start by hanging his kids on Wall Street then his wife and then him infront of all the other CEO's?

One good reason...just one....remember odds are your money was a part of this dea.

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[mpohl 1]

Because it is against zoning ordinances.

And let's leave kids/wife/mistresses out of the equation. But his rotten corpse would stink up Wall Street after a few days. Bad for tourism!!!

Quote

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/2011/12/08/news/companies/corzine_mf_global/corzine-swearing-in.gi.top.jpg

Quote

"My sadness, of course, pales in comparison to the losses and hardships that customers, employees and investors suffered as a result of MF Global's bankruptcy."

OK give me one good reason why we can't start by hanging his kids on Wall Street then his wife and then him infront of all the other CEO's?

One good reason...just one....remember odds are your money was a part of this dea.

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

OK give me one good reason why we can't start by hanging his kids on Wall Street then his wife and then him infront of all the other CEO's?

well, some of us try to have serious conversations, not just drunken rantings at closing time when we can't get laid.

Or vaguely seriously - what CEO ever has time to spend with his kids? And isn't it time for a younger wife anyway? You'll get CEOs bringing the rope.

[jgoose71 0]

Quote

Not saying it's right to kill kids or the dumb fucks wife but.....can you think of a better way to have these fucktards to stop screwing us?

Ok, it' not right. Maybe think of a way that is?

Remember, liberals are not fond of the death penalty and everyone is innocent until proven guilty.....

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything