popsjumper 2 #26 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuote Give Mickey Mouse back his shotgun, and leave history alone. Not your decision to make. Taken literally, that is true. OTOH, that opinion as expressed by JR, is where a lot of us stand. Unfortunately for "us", the PC-crazy decision-makers are moving this country farther and farther away from reality and into the realm of make-believe. "Let's change things around so that it appears the we are good, caring people. Let's not let anyone think we are anything less than perfect angels." Unfortunately, it appears that the sane are in the minority in this country.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #27 October 13, 2011 QuoteWhat do you want to do, John? Do you want to BAN cartoons that the owners alter? What else do you want to BAN? Not speaking for JR, but let me say.... I want the PC-nutters to get a life.....or go away.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #28 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteNews:Disney Channel Edits Out Gun From 1938 Mickey Mouse Cartoon "One morning recently my kids were watching the Disney Channel when they featured an old Mickey Mouse classic called ‘Mickey’s Parrot‘ which was originally released back on September 09, 1938. In this episode, a parrot belonging to an escaped killer wanders into Mickey’s basement. Mickey hears it talking and thinks that the parrot is the killer who is on the loose who he just heard about on the radio. Mickey then goes and grabs his double barreled shotgun off of the wall and prepares to defend himself. Well, wouldn’t you know it… in the version they presented on the Disney Channel the other day, they had digitally removed the shotgun and replaced it with a broom. Yes, Mickey grabbed a broom off of the gun rack, shouldered it, and prepared to defend himself with his handy, dandy tactical… broom..."Full story: Ammoland Oh dear, civilization as we know it is coming to an end! Actually, yes. You do realize that, with your comment, you have endorsed censorship?HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #29 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteNews:Disney Channel Edits Out Gun From 1938 Mickey Mouse Cartoon "One morning recently my kids were watching the Disney Channel when they featured an old Mickey Mouse classic called ‘Mickey’s Parrot‘ which was originally released back on September 09, 1938. In this episode, a parrot belonging to an escaped killer wanders into Mickey’s basement. Mickey hears it talking and thinks that the parrot is the killer who is on the loose who he just heard about on the radio. Mickey then goes and grabs his double barreled shotgun off of the wall and prepares to defend himself. Well, wouldn’t you know it… in the version they presented on the Disney Channel the other day, they had digitally removed the shotgun and replaced it with a broom. Yes, Mickey grabbed a broom off of the gun rack, shouldered it, and prepared to defend himself with his handy, dandy tactical… broom..."Full story: Ammoland Oh dear, civilization as we know it is coming to an end! Actually, yes. You do realize that, with your comment, you have endorsed censorship? No, I am endorsing the right of the owner of a piece of rather trivial artwork to change it without consulting John Rich or you.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #30 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteNews:Disney Channel Edits Out Gun From 1938 Mickey Mouse Cartoon "One morning recently my kids were watching the Disney Channel when they featured an old Mickey Mouse classic called ‘Mickey’s Parrot‘ which was originally released back on September 09, 1938. In this episode, a parrot belonging to an escaped killer wanders into Mickey’s basement. Mickey hears it talking and thinks that the parrot is the killer who is on the loose who he just heard about on the radio. Mickey then goes and grabs his double barreled shotgun off of the wall and prepares to defend himself. Well, wouldn’t you know it… in the version they presented on the Disney Channel the other day, they had digitally removed the shotgun and replaced it with a broom. Yes, Mickey grabbed a broom off of the gun rack, shouldered it, and prepared to defend himself with his handy, dandy tactical… broom..."Full story: Ammoland Oh dear, civilization as we know it is coming to an end! Actually, yes. You do realize that, with your comment, you have endorsed censorship? It's not censorship.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #31 October 13, 2011 Sorry, but you're both wrong. Unless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Definition of CENSORSHIP 1a : the institution, system, or practice of censoring b : the actions or practices of censors; especially : censorial control exercised repressively 2: the office, power, or term of a Roman censor 3: exclusion from consciousness by the psychic censor www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/censorship Definition of CENSOR transitive verb : to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable ; also : to suppress or delete as objectionable www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/censoringHAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #32 October 13, 2011 QuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #33 October 13, 2011 QuoteSorry, but you're both wrong. I think they are right. Disney can't really 'censor' themselves. Censorship is when one party does it to another, not so much as to themselves, calling it (self) censorship in that case is more tongue in cheek. That doesn't mean this isn't really stupid, idiotic and just plain wrong, it just isn't censorship. Disney are idiots here. But it's their property and they can do what they want in a country of individuals and personal property rights (as least so far). This not analogous to Footloose (censorship) - it's more analogous to some idiot buying a flag and then burning it. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #34 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. Correct. There is a world of difference between self censorship and censorship imposed by external forces. If a person (company) has the right to say something, then they also have the right to NOT say something if they choose.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #35 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #36 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it. Your knowledge of intellectual property rights is truly astounding.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,116 #37 October 13, 2011 >The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who >originally wrote and produced the cartoon. No. But they are the people who own it. And they can do whatever they like with it. If you bought a car with a have a "VOTE FOR OBAMA" bumper sticker on it, and you cover it with a "VOTE FOR BACHMANN" sticker instead - are you engaging in censorship? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #38 October 13, 2011 Quote Quote Quote Unless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. If they were, would it still be censorship? Quote I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip Oh, please do!Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #39 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it. Your knowledge of intellectual property rights is truly astounding. Your lack of knowledge on even the simplest of subjects is astounding. I suppose you wouldn't call it censorship if the copyright owners of Uncle Toms Cabin removed the word "nigger" entirely from the book. Hell, you'd probably say it was needed.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #40 October 13, 2011 Quote>The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who >originally wrote and produced the cartoon. No. But they are the people who own it. And they can do whatever they like with it. If you bought a car with a have a "VOTE FOR OBAMA" bumper sticker on it, and you cover it with a "VOTE FOR BACHMANN" sticker instead - are you engaging in censorship? According o the definition given by M-W, yes.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #41 October 13, 2011 Quote Quote Quote Unless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. Correct. There is a world of difference between self censorship and censorship imposed by external forces. If a person (company) has the right to say something, then they also have the right to NOT say something if they choose. Incorrect. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #42 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it. Your knowledge of intellectual property rights is truly astounding. Your lack of knowledge on even the simplest of subjects is astounding. I suppose you wouldn't call it censorship if the copyright owners of Uncle Toms Cabin removed the word "nigger" entirely from the book. Hell, you'd probably say it was needed. Yeah, about that . . . this is exactly what I mean . . . Uncle Tom's Cabin is public domain.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,116 #43 October 13, 2011 >According o the definition given by M-W, yes. OK. Then yes, I can live with that level of "censorship." Sometimes I even delete old email. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #44 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuote>The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who >originally wrote and produced the cartoon. No. But they are the people who own it. And they can do whatever they like with it. If you bought a car with a have a "VOTE FOR OBAMA" bumper sticker on it, and you cover it with a "VOTE FOR BACHMANN" sticker instead - are you engaging in censorship? According o the definition given by M-W, yes. And there-in lies the problem with this overly-literal, dissected use of dictionary definitions - you end up reducing every word you examine to something that means everything and signifies nothing. I take it that, given your interpretation of the word, you do endorse censorship?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #45 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it. Your knowledge of intellectual property rights is truly astounding. Your lack of knowledge on even the simplest of subjects is astounding. I suppose you wouldn't call it censorship if the copyright owners of Uncle Toms Cabin removed the word "nigger" entirely from the book. Hell, you'd probably say it was needed. Yeah, about that . . . this is exactly what I mean . . . Uncle Tom's Cabin is public domain. Ok how would you feel if every government banned the word "nigger" from being published, read, downloaded or otherwise communicated as part of the book? Censorship is not connected with ownership. When I post on these forums I have a given amount of time to go back and censor my post. It's a form of editing. Just because a movie/book/etc. is censored by it's owner doesn't make it right. It is still censorship.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,116 #46 October 13, 2011 >Ok how would you feel if every government banned the word "nigger" >from being published, read, downloaded or otherwise communicated as >part of the book? That would be bad. Now, if Disney banned the word "nigger" from its kid's movies? That would be good. >Just because a movie/book/etc. is censored by it's owner doesn't make it >right. It is still censorship. Yes, but by your definitions, it is indeed sometimes a very good thing. For example, you cannot tell pedophilic jokes here. We will censor them. I think overall it makes this a better place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #47 October 13, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteUnless you reject the definition of censorship as published by Merriam-Webster. Not really, I just read it sensibly. When you break a word down into a list of every possible connotation and examine them individually then you put yourself in danger of losing the actual meaning of the word. The people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. It is the same as if the current copyright owners of Uncle Tom's Cabin re-wrote the novel to eliminate any passages that may offend the reader. I could have only posted the definition of consorshhip but I knew others, such as yourself, would argue what censoring meant. This ain't Clintonese. We all know what the meaning of "is" is. And now we all know what censorship is. Only problem now is that you don't like the definition. Well, tough. Deal with it. Your knowledge of intellectual property rights is truly astounding. Your lack of knowledge on even the simplest of subjects is astounding. I suppose you wouldn't call it censorship if the copyright owners of Uncle Toms Cabin removed the word "nigger" entirely from the book. Hell, you'd probably say it was needed. Yeah, about that . . . this is exactly what I mean . . . Uncle Tom's Cabin is public domain. Ok how would you feel if every government banned the word "nigger" from being published, read, downloaded or otherwise communicated as part of the book? Censorship is not connected with ownership. When I post on these forums I have a given amount of time to go back and censor my post. It's a form of editing. Just because a movie/book/etc. is censored by it's owner doesn't make it right. It is still censorship. Keeping that in mind, can you answer my question from post 38?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #48 October 13, 2011 QuoteJust because a movie/book/etc. is censored by it's owner doesn't make it right. It is still censorship. An one other point, from your response to Bill's bumper sticker query, censorship is not, in and of itself, a bad thing. You can't say that it's not right just because it's censorship. You'll have to explain why that particular form of censorship is not right.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #49 October 13, 2011 QuoteThe people at Disney who made the changes are not the same people who originally wrote and produced the cartoon. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If they were, would it still be censorship? Yes.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #50 October 13, 2011 Quote>Ok how would you feel if every government banned the word "nigger" >from being published, read, downloaded or otherwise communicated as >part of the book? That would be bad. Now, if Disney banned the word "nigger" from its kid's movies? That would be good. >Just because a movie/book/etc. is censored by it's owner doesn't make it >right. It is still censorship. Yes, but by your definitions, it is indeed sometimes a very good thing. For example, you cannot tell pedophilic jokes here. We will censor them. I think overall it makes this a better place. Agreed on all points. After all, I never said censorship was always bad and nobody asked.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
