pirana 0 #51 October 10, 2011 STEP 1: Stop spending more than we make. STEP 2: Eliminate loopholes. The tax rates are just fine - it's the exceptions/credits/incentives/deductions/etc allowed that kill us. If all personal and business income actually got taxed the gov would be loaded. Missing from the big list of waste - subsidies for billionaire sports team owners. How can anyone with half a brain be OK with subsidizing the building of these castles by the public?" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #52 October 10, 2011 So who pays no federal income tax? Nearly 1,500 making over $1M a year, apparently www.usatoday.com/money/economy/story/2011-10-06/income-tax-nonpayment/50676912/1... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #53 October 10, 2011 QuoteSo who pays no federal income tax? Nearly 1,500 making over $1M a year, apparently www.usatoday.com/money/economy/story/2011-10-06/income-tax-nonpayment/50676912/1 0.6% Oh, the humanity!!!Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #54 October 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteSo who pays no federal income tax? Nearly 1,500 making over $1M a year, apparently www.usatoday.com/money/economy/story/2011-10-06/income-tax-nonpayment/50676912/1 0.6% Oh, the humanity!!! Kind of like wrongful executions in Texas, then - 0.6% is not a problem worth worrying about.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
charlie5 0 #55 October 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo who pays no federal income tax? Nearly 1,500 making over $1M a year, apparently www.usatoday.com/money/economy/story/2011-10-06/income-tax-nonpayment/50676912/1 0.6% Oh, the humanity!!! Kind of like wrongful executions in Texas, then - 0.6% is not a problem worth worrying about. A non sequitur says whatThe feather butts bounce off ya like raindrops hitting a battle-star when they come in too fast...kinda funny to watch. - airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #56 October 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteSo who pays no federal income tax? Nearly 1,500 making over $1M a year, apparently www.usatoday.com/money/economy/story/2011-10-06/income-tax-nonpayment/50676912/1 0.6% Oh, the humanity!!! Kind of like wrongful executions in Texas, then - 0.6% is not a problem worth worrying about. A non sequitur says what Tell us, since your post is nonsensical as it stands.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #57 October 10, 2011 QuoteSTEP 1: Stop spending more than we make. STEP 2: Eliminate loopholes. The tax rates are just fine - it's the exceptions/credits/incentives/deductions/etc allowed that kill us. If all personal and business income actually got taxed the gov would be loaded. Missing from the big list of waste - subsidies for billionaire sports team owners. How can anyone with half a brain be OK with subsidizing the building of these castles by the public? It's funny how the right wingers say that everyone, even the poor, should pay something so they have "skin in the game", but then defend millionaires who pay nothing.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #58 October 10, 2011 Quote It's funny how the right wingers say that everyone, even the poor, should pay something so they have "skin in the game", but then defend millionaires who pay nothing. they didn't pay nothing in the years when they made the millions. Rather the opposite. They put in plenty of skin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #59 October 10, 2011 QuoteQuote It's funny how the right wingers say that everyone, even the poor, should pay something so they have "skin in the game", but then defend millionaires who pay nothing. they didn't pay nothing in the years when they made the millions. Rather the opposite. They put in plenty of skin. Well, good chance they inherited and are just clipping coupons. And just as likely, the poor could have been paying all along too. Sauce for the goose and all that...... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #60 October 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuote It's funny how the right wingers say that everyone, even the poor, should pay something so they have "skin in the game", but then defend millionaires who pay nothing. they didn't pay nothing in the years when they made the millions. Rather the opposite. They put in plenty of skin. Well, good chance they inherited and are just clipping coupons. And just as likely, the poor could have been paying all along too. Sauce for the goose and all that... then they paid an inheritance tax, no? You made your statement- you think wealth should be taxed instead of income, even though it's totally unworkable (and you declined to show a plausible method). But we tax income. And if a millionaire loses 200k and has no taxable income, he doesn't pay income taxes that year. If the next year goes back to good and he earns 300k, he'll end up paying ~100k of it. (CA) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #61 October 11, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote It's funny how the right wingers say that everyone, even the poor, should pay something so they have "skin in the game", but then defend millionaires who pay nothing. they didn't pay nothing in the years when they made the millions. Rather the opposite. They put in plenty of skin. Well, good chance they inherited and are just clipping coupons. And just as likely, the poor could have been paying all along too. Sauce for the goose and all that... then they paid an inheritance tax, no? You made your statement- you think wealth should be taxed instead of income, even though it's totally unworkable (and you declined to show a plausible method). But we tax income. Your argument, Captain Obvious II, is silly. You are in essence saying that anyone at all who has previously paid tax has "skin in the game". This can equally apply to a poor family who paid $1 in tax 10 years ago. Yet the right constantly whines about poor families that pay no tax, while excusing millionaires that pay no tax.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #62 October 11, 2011 skin in the game (to me) means someone who paid taxes last year, or has the potential to pay taxes this year, or next year. Pretty wide net, I know, but that's the way I see it. If above referenced middle-class non-tax paying families haven't paid taxes in a while, and don't stand to pay taxes next year, then they don't have skin in the game. They have good reason to vote for whomever stands the best chance of letting them not pay taxes still (regardless of the candidate's platform). The millionaire non-tax payers are likely sheltering what income they are paid through some of the many allowances (loopholes) that our tax code makes. They have skin in the game... they may be forced to pay taxes next year. They have good reason to vote for the candidates not for tax reform, and for allowing these loopholes to continue. Tax reform should be high on the priority list.-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,114 #63 October 11, 2011 >How can anyone with half a brain be OK with subsidizing the building >of these castles by the public? Football fans. And I guarantee you that if the aviation tax gets implemented, skydivers will want an exemption (a "loophole" if you will) for skydiving. Everyone wants their own stuff for free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Southern_Man 0 #64 October 11, 2011 Quoteskin in the game (to me) means someone who paid taxes last year, or has the potential to pay taxes this year, or next year. Pretty wide net, I know, but that's the way I see it. If above referenced middle-class non-tax paying families haven't paid taxes in a while, and don't stand to pay taxes next year, then they don't have skin in the game. They have good reason to vote for whomever stands the best chance of letting them not pay taxes still (regardless of the candidate's platform). Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly."What if there were no hypothetical questions?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #65 October 11, 2011 QuoteQuoteskin in the game (to me) means someone who paid taxes last year, or has the potential to pay taxes this year, or next year. Pretty wide net, I know, but that's the way I see it. If above referenced middle-class non-tax paying families haven't paid taxes in a while, and don't stand to pay taxes next year, then they don't have skin in the game. They have good reason to vote for whomever stands the best chance of letting them not pay taxes still (regardless of the candidate's platform). Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Because everyone pays the same rate on those up to any applicable caps.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #66 October 11, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteskin in the game (to me) means someone who paid taxes last year, or has the potential to pay taxes this year, or next year. Pretty wide net, I know, but that's the way I see it. If above referenced middle-class non-tax paying families haven't paid taxes in a while, and don't stand to pay taxes next year, then they don't have skin in the game. They have good reason to vote for whomever stands the best chance of letting them not pay taxes still (regardless of the candidate's platform). Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Because everyone pays the same rate on those up to any applicable caps. True, but that's NOT an answer to his question. In fact the whole "skin in the game" thing is an irrelevance conjured up by the right to justify raising taxes on the poor so the wealthy can have lower tax rates. Nothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #67 October 11, 2011 Quote Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Those taxes are returned in the form of benefits. It seems that everyone comes out ahead on the MC side (until it breaks) and the lower income rungs come out well ahead on SS. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #68 October 11, 2011 QuoteQuote Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Those taxes are returned in the form of benefits. We benefit from roads and bridges too. And from education, defense...... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #69 October 11, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuote Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Those taxes are returned in the form of benefits. We benefit from roads and bridges too. And from education, defense... I don't benefit from a lot of federal spending. SS/MC are direct benefits, no different than participation in an insurance plan. The only reason these two programs are treated as part of the budget rather than separately is that for 3 decades their surpluses masked the size of the deficit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #70 October 11, 2011 QuoteTrue, but that's NOT an answer to his question. Sure it is - it's just not an answer that you or he likes. QuoteIn fact the whole "skin in the game" thing is an irrelevance conjured up by the right to justify raising taxes on the poor so the wealthy can have lower tax rates. "Everybody's going to have some skin in the game" - Barack Obama Sourcing problem, AGAIN? QuoteNothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay. Thank you, Captain Obvious - unfortunately for your argument, nobody made that claim.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #71 October 12, 2011 QuoteQuoteTrue, but that's NOT an answer to his question. Sure it is - it's just not an answer that you or he likes. QuoteIn fact the whole "skin in the game" thing is an irrelevance conjured up by the right to justify raising taxes on the poor so the wealthy can have lower tax rates. "Everybody's going to have some skin in the game" - Barack Obama Sourcing problem, AGAIN? QuoteNothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay. Thank you, Captain Obvious - unfortunately for your argument, nobody made that claim. Who said they did? You're playing your silly parsing game again.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #72 October 12, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Why does only income tax count as skin in the game? People who don't pay income tax commonly pay Social Security and Medicare taxes, as well as a variety of federal taxes on items like gas. Honestly just about everybody pays some sort of federal tax, even if indirectly. Those taxes are returned in the form of benefits. We benefit from roads and bridges too. And from education, defense... I don't benefit from a lot of federal spending. Yes, I doubt you drive much on roads, nor benefit from ATC services when flying or skydiving. Probably never visited a national park... Who cares HOW MUCH, the fact is that you DO benefit, as do the millionaires who manage to weasel out of paying any federal income tax.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #73 October 12, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteNothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay. Thank you, Captain Obvious - unfortunately for your argument, nobody made that claim. Who said they did? You're playing your silly parsing game again. You're playing your silly attempt to misdirect game again - I'm just defusing it before it starts.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #74 October 12, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteNothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay. Thank you, Captain Obvious - unfortunately for your argument, nobody made that claim. Who said they did? You're playing your silly parsing game again. You're playing your silly attempt to misdirect game again - I'm just defusing it before it starts. You flatter yourself excessively. Thanks for agreeing that all have skin in the game.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #75 October 12, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteNothing in the Constitution states that any rights or privileges or participation in "the game" depend on how much tax you pay. Thank you, Captain Obvious - unfortunately for your argument, nobody made that claim. Who said they did? You're playing your silly parsing game again. You're playing your silly attempt to misdirect game again - I'm just defusing it before it starts. You flatter yourself excessively. No, not really. QuoteThanks for agreeing that all have skin in the game. Thanks for agreeing it was Obama that said it and not the Reps.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
