dreamdancer 0 #51 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote Quote ***benefit do you currently enjoy that you'd be willing to sacrifice. I'll sacrifice Pedro, my illegal immigrant gardener, and pay a little more to hire an American citizen. Most American citizens don't want Pedro's job. Those that do want a lot more... And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #52 August 9, 2011 Quote--if that concept requires a better explanation, you wouldn't understand it anyway. nonsense - I get his point. All the 'clever' posts are fine and true in many cases, but that's in ALL the other threads. His was very specific and intended to weed out that stuff which is already discussed to death. I like the idea of eliminating the home mortgage deduction - and, yes, this would greatly increase my taxes paid with the current brackets. I think the government shouldn't be "encouraging" or "discouraging" financial behavior at all in either business or private - let them delete the personal exemptions too - and business 'props' and 'penalties'. Let the market do its job and keep the tax code simple. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #53 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage I agree that when China and Mexico do that we will be more competative with them. Good luck making that happen. (I'm not even gonna ask DreamDasher how increasing the cost of American labor will make it look more appealing to American consumers when they have cheaper foreign labor available.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #54 August 9, 2011 QuoteYou're not being clever. You're very clearly making Dave's point in the original post that people are approaching the budget issue in a selfish manner. I don't think the thread is very clever, in fact I think the premise is pretty stoooooopid. It implies that the primary solution is more tax revenue, and further implies that I am selfish for not wanting to give up additional money to be wasted for the government. What else would you like me to do besides kick in more cash. I don't use many government functions directly. The ones that I use indirectly I can't exactly give back my share. You want me to cut the military or the DOT a rebate check? The middle class and the youth of our nation are being squeezed by the choices of our elders past and the growing percentage of the population that rely heavily on the government and yet contribute nothing in return. I don't think the people in this thread are the selfish ones. I think the seniors whose elected officials spent their social security contributions, and failed to ever plan for their retirement, and who would shit a brick if we even looked at reforming social security or medicare in their lifetime, are pretty damn selfish. I think people who continue to have children while on state and federal welfare are pretty damn selfish. I think the medical industry that continues to raise costs well in excess of inflation is pretty damn selfish. I think the people who would rather sit and claim unemployment benefits until they are exchauted because taking a lower paying job or switching fields is beneath them, are pretty damn selfish. Don't tell me this doesn't happen to a great extent, I have heard on several instances from people that think unemployment insurance is the ticket to a paid vacation. Politicians... pretty fucking selfish. Corporations... pretty fucking selfish, but that is what they exist for. The working self made middle class selfish? Kiss my ass!"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #55 August 9, 2011 Quote the answer is to increase the minimum wage brilliant today, I make $5/hour and a sandwich costs me about $5 tomorrow, I'll be making $8/hour (YAYYY) and that sandwich will only cost me $9 freakin'......brilliant ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #56 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote Quote And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage I agree that when China and Mexico do that we will be more competative with them. Good luck making that happen. (I'm not even gonna ask DreamDasher how increasing the cost of American labor will make it look more appealing to American consumers when they have cheaper foreign labor available.) that's cheaper illegal labour...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #57 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote Quote Quote And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage I agree that when China and Mexico do that we will be more competative with them. Good luck making that happen. (I'm not even gonna ask DreamDasher how increasing the cost of American labor will make it look more appealing to American consumers when they have cheaper foreign labor available.) that's cheaper illegal labour... The last I heard, we legally import manufactured goods from foreign countries because they provide cheaper labor than we do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #58 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage I agree that when China and Mexico do that we will be more competative with them. Good luck making that happen. (I'm not even gonna ask DreamDasher how increasing the cost of American labor will make it look more appealing to American consumers when they have cheaper foreign labor available.) that's cheaper illegal labour... The last I heard, we legally import manufactured goods from foreign countries because they provide cheaper labor than we do. so who you gonna import to do your lawn...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #59 August 9, 2011 QuoteQuoteIf you honestly think that you, personally, don't actually benefit from anything the government spends* money on or that you feel can't be eliminated/reduced to help get us towards a fiscally responsible budget then say so and defend your position. I didn't hear anyone say that. Did you? Where? Reading comprehension problem? I didn't hear anyone say that either which is why, in the last third of that sentence, I asked anyone who held that opinion to simply say so. What people had been doing instead was making sarcastic comments about cutting stuff they simply don't want. That's great and all but, as rehmwa pointed out, there's umpteen dozen threads of people bitching about things they consider 100% wasteful already. Turning this thread into yet another one by answering the question in the original post while rolling your eyes is NOT clever. QuoteQuoteYou're very clearly making Dave's point in the original post that people are approaching the budget issue in a selfish manner. Hmm. Point finger and blame. Nasty selfish people want the government to spend thier tax dollars more effectively. Read the thread. I've heard some ideas to voluntarily pay more. Those of us who belong to the half that pay income tax would like it to be spent more responsibly--if that concept requires a better explanation, you wouldn't understand it anyway. QuoteWhat else would you like me to do besides kick in more cash? I don't use many government functions directly. The ones that I use indirectly I can't exactly give back my share... ..The working self made middle class selfish? Kiss my ass! I haven't pointed fingers at anyone and I'm not going to kiss anyone's ass. I think people are sticking thier nose up at an interesting idea for a thread so I said something. It doesn't just have to be about increasing revenue just because "tax expenditures" seem to be things people are bringing up a lot. It could be closing a military base near you that brings jobs/money into the area, or infrastructure cuts that affect you, etc. Use your imagination. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #60 August 9, 2011 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote And most Americans aren't willing to pay more for American labor. Two sides of the same problem that's drasticly reduced our ability to generate income tax revenue to fund our government. the answer is to increase the minimum wage I agree that when China and Mexico do that we will be more competative with them. Good luck making that happen. (I'm not even gonna ask DreamDasher how increasing the cost of American labor will make it look more appealing to American consumers when they have cheaper foreign labor available.) that's cheaper illegal labour... The last I heard, we legally import manufactured goods from foreign countries because they provide cheaper labor than we do. so who you gonna import to do your lawn... That would sound really cute to anyone who hadn't read my post #15 (and others) in this thread. OOPS--you didn't read those? And BTW, those of us who care about American jobs don't spell "labor" like you do: l-a-b-o-u-r. Reading and writing a limited amount of English isn't the same as being an American, and I think I now see "where you're coming from." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #61 August 9, 2011 post number 15 says you're going to pay more for your us labour. this seems to me to be an agreement that the minimum wage is too low...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #62 August 9, 2011 Quote post number 15 says you're going to pay more for your us labour. this seems to me to be an agreement that the minimum wage is too low... I'll indeed willingly pay more for US labor than I will pay for foreign labor because it's worth the extra expense--that's my sacrifice per the OP. Since you've reverted back to your normal strategy of "putting words in my mouth," I'm through corresponding with you in this thread. My assertions stand on what I've already written, and I've only answered you this much for the entertainment of other readers. Bye-bye for now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #63 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteYou're not being clever. You're very clearly making Dave's point in the original post that people are approaching the budget issue in a selfish manner. I don't think the thread is very clever, in fact I think the premise is pretty stoooooopid. It implies that the primary solution is more tax revenue, and further implies that I am selfish for not wanting to give up additional money to be wasted for the government. ! www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-10/republicans-no-tax-stand-unsupported-by-history-or-facts-view.html... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #64 August 10, 2011 Quotewww.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-10/republicans-no-tax-stand-unsupported-by-history-or-facts-view.html “When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.” - Benjamin Franklin "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." - Thomas Jefferson "Collecting more taxes than is absolutely necessary is legalized robbery." - Calvin Coolidge "We contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle." - Winston Churchill "An economy hampered by restrictive tax rates will never produce enough revenue to balance the budget, just as it will never produce enough jobs or enough profits." - John F. KennedyMike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #65 August 10, 2011 So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #66 August 10, 2011 Quote So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK. The quotes themselves rebut it.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #67 August 10, 2011 I find the article less then relevant. Considering that Reagan, Bush Sr, and Clinton did not have this looming medicare and social security nut to crack."The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #68 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuote So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK. The quotes themselves rebut it. No, they do not.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #69 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuote So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK. The quotes themselves rebut it. No, they do not. You're welcome to your opinion.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #70 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK. The quotes themselves rebut it. No, they do not. You're welcome to your opinion. The opinion is due to the author of the article. Your ancient quotes are hardly relevant to the current situation.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #71 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote So you have no actual rebuttal to the article. OK. The quotes themselves rebut it. No, they do not. You're welcome to your opinion. The opinion is due to the author of the article. Your ancient quotes are hardly relevant to the current situation. Did you get your telepathy machine working, that the author is posting here through you? The author speaks of history, so historical quotes *ARE* relevant.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #72 August 10, 2011 QuoteQuoteQuoteYou're not being clever. You're very clearly making Dave's point in the original post that people are approaching the budget issue in a selfish manner. I don't think the thread is very clever, in fact I think the premise is pretty stoooooopid. It implies that the primary solution is more tax revenue, and further implies that I am selfish for not wanting to give up additional money to be wasted for the government. ! www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-10/republicans-no-tax-stand-unsupported-by-history-or-facts-view.html Too bad the children here have not lived thru history of the last 60 years...IT'S MY MONEY AND I WANT IT ALL. “Taxes are what we pay for a civilized society.” Oliver Wendel Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #73 August 10, 2011 QuoteReagan did not raise tax rates. He cut tax rates in 1982. with a key exception of payroll taxes (SS + MC). The tax paid by everyone with income. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,148 #74 August 10, 2011 www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/60952.html www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/61007.html... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #75 August 10, 2011 Quote Too bad the children here have not lived thru history of the last 60 years...IT'S MY MONEY AND I WANT IT ALL. “Taxes are what we pay for a civilized society.” Oliver Wendel Holmes I don't see any one in here claiming that they shouldn't pay taxes and that they should keep all of their money. That is a false argument, nice try though. I do see people questioning their willingness to give up additional taxes when spending is out of control, they didn't elect the last 40 years of retards, and a large percentage of the population vocal about tax increases don't even pay federal income tax!!! Funny how the older generation is so big on personal responsibility, until it comes time to own up to their own actions."The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
