JohnRich 4 #1 June 29, 2011 News:Feds Ban 'God' From Houston National Cemetery "Local veterans and volunteer groups accuse Department of Veterans Affairs officials of censoring religious speech — including the word 'God' - at Houston National Cemetery. "In one example cited in documents filed this week in federal court, cemetery director Arleen Ocasio reportedly told volunteers with the National Memorial Ladies that they had to stop telling families 'God bless you' at funerals and that they had to remove the words 'God bless' from condolence cards..."Full story: http://nation.foxnews.com/texas/2011/06/29/feds-ban-god-houston-national-cemetery Personally, a think a person's last wishes should be honored, including those of Veterans buried on Federal property. If someone is offended by another's religious beliefs at a funeral, they should suck it up and defer to the wishes of the deceased and their family. They don't have the right to tell someone else what can be said at their funeral. Try having a little tolerance for the beliefs of others, instead of making everything all about you. And if the use of the word "God" really pisses you off that much, you don't have to attend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #2 June 29, 2011 I wonder if they will have to remove all religious references and symbols from all Military Cemetaries? Got to have that seperation of Church and State. Will all the Cross's have to be taken down? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #3 June 29, 2011 That's all it is John, it's this 'all about ME' attitude of too many people. Some friend or relative they are to not be able to go along with a dead person's wishes who fought for their rights and freedoms. All this has gone way too far and gotten totally out of hand. Shame on those who go along with this thinking. Everybody wants it their way! They need to learn... this ain't Burger King!Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sfzombie 3 #4 June 29, 2011 i'm not a christian and haven't been for a while, and am also a veteran. the thing people keep getting wrong is there is nothing that seperates the church and state. there is, however, an ammendment that says the government shall make no exceptions for any religion. that basically says that they can't create a state church or say that jews can't serve in congress.http://kitswv.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #5 June 29, 2011 I said it before in a similar thread: religious people should be allowed to have religion at their funeral, but non-religious people should be allowed to have a religion-free funeral. Anyone attending a funeral (military or otherwise) should respect the wishes of the family of the departed. The cemetary director sounds like an moron (or is it sexist of me to say that, Gravitymaster?) It also sounds like her dumb decisions will be swiftly overturned by the judge. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wayneflorida 0 #6 June 29, 2011 Quote I wonder if they will have to remove all religious references and symbols from all Military Cemetaries? Got to have that seperation of Church and State. Will all the Cross's have to be taken down? Even worst. The Navy will have go net osama's body up and redue his funeral. Too Islamic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #7 June 29, 2011 I am very curious how those who claim that having religious symbols on Federal and State owned land is a violation of Church and State are going to see this. It's actually quite the conundrum, isn't it. On one hand if religious symbols on gov't land constitute a violation of Church and State, then they should be removed. OTOH if you try to remove them, you will incur more hatred than you can imagine. Very interesting, indeed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,595 #8 June 29, 2011 QuoteSome friend or relative they are to not be able to go along with a dead person's wishes who fought for their rights and freedoms. Maybe worth pointing out that, right or wrong, the story linked has nothing to do with the wishes of the dead person, their families or objections from friends or relatives. You've basically just made up something to rant about.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #9 June 29, 2011 QuoteNews:Feds Ban 'God' From Houston National Cemetery "Local veterans and volunteer groups accuse Department of Veterans Affairs officials of censoring religious speech — including the word 'God' - at Houston National Cemetery. "In one example cited in documents filed this week in federal court, cemetery director Arleen Ocasio reportedly told volunteers with the National Memorial Ladies that they had to stop telling families 'God bless you' at funerals and that they had to remove the words 'God bless' from condolence cards..."Full story: http://nation.foxnews.com/texas/2011/06/29/feds-ban-god-houston-national-cemetery Yep. I'm sure that's the full story.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #10 June 29, 2011 QuoteQuoteSome friend or relative they are to not be able to go along with a dead person's wishes who fought for their rights and freedoms. Maybe worth pointing out that, right or wrong, the story linked has nothing to do with the wishes of the dead person, their families or objections from friends or relatives. You've basically just made up something to rant about. That's basically what this is all about. I can't voice my 'personal' opinion of subject matter? I have to quote some book, news source or some brainiac to have a valid point or to have an opinion? What's the sense of just being a Poll-parrot? Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #11 June 29, 2011 I think you'll find that those people you refer to don't object to religious symbols on Federal land perse, they object to the practice of putting only Christian symbols up on Federal land. In other words, as long as it's okay to display Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Wiccan, etc. symbols on the same Federal land, then it's okay to display Christian ones, too. Since military grave markers have whatever religious symbol desired by the deceased on them, it is not a problem. If the Feds said that the only acceptable symbol on a military grave marker were a crucifix, then we have a problem. Do you can see the problem with volunteers praising Jesus at a Jewish person's funeral? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #12 June 29, 2011 Thats disgusting. I read the whole original article as I thought there must be some actual reason or larger story, but no. So much for the land of the free. Isn't freedom of speech part of your constitution? If you can't have freedom of speech at a funeral then where the hell can you??? Simply disgraceful.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #13 June 29, 2011 Can't offend the atheists, old chap...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #14 June 29, 2011 QuoteCan't offend the atheists, old chap... ...but they can offend 'believers'. Ya' know... a lot of streets have been named for them... 'One Way'! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #15 June 29, 2011 QuoteThats disgusting. I read the whole original article as I thought there must be some actual reason or larger story, but no. You do realize the article is only telling one side of the story don't you? Further, the story as reported is only hearsay, no proof whatsoever has been offered. But damn, it sure does sound good for those with the mindset that religion is under attack by the godless heathens in government.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #16 June 29, 2011 QuoteCan't offend the atheists, old chap... It is not about atheism, it's about assholism. I don't give a rat's ass if someone wants to be buried with their sword in their hand to be sure to get to Valhalla. Where I draw the line is when people presume to tell me what "The Truth" (tm) is. Thus, the people who are telling each other what to do are the ones with whom I have a problem. I do not know if the particular douchenozzles in this case were atheists, commies or whatever. They are, first and foremost, douchenozzles. BSBD, Winsor Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #17 June 29, 2011 While there may be some who believe as you say, I also believe there are complete Athiests who reject any symbol of a God or anything else that represents religion. In fact I have never heard your argument made. Every Athiest I'm aware of wants all signs of religion remove from public property. They claim they are offended by it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #18 June 29, 2011 QuoteI think you'll find that those people you refer to don't object to religious symbols on Federal land perse, they object to the practice of putting only Christian symbols up on Federal land. In other words, as long as it's okay to display Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Wiccan, etc. symbols on the same Federal land, then it's okay to display Christian ones, too. Since military grave markers have whatever religious symbol desired by the deceased on them, it is not a problem. If the Feds said that the only acceptable symbol on a military grave marker were a crucifix, then we have a problem. Do you can see the problem with volunteers praising Jesus at a Jewish person's funeral? Not if the Jew in question was Jesus... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,588 #19 June 29, 2011 QuoteI also believe there are complete Athiests who reject any symbol of a God or anything else that represents religionJust as there are Christians who think that only Christian symbols belong because of "America's Christian history"/"most Americans are Christians" (take your pick). The most militant of atheists that I know think that no public money should be spent on religious displays. I've never met one who thought that people buried in public cemeteries should not be able to have the service and grave marker of their family's choice. Wendy P.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaybird18c 25 #20 June 29, 2011 QuoteIt is not about atheism, it's about assholism. Coming from the tip of a douchenozzle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #21 June 29, 2011 QuoteQuoteIt is not about atheism, it's about assholism. Coming from the tip of a douchenozzle. I can't keep up with your razor wit. How do you achieve such subtlety and nuance? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #22 June 29, 2011 I predict the argument that having religious symbols on any government owned land, constitutes the government promoting religion, is coming. I truly hope I'm wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #23 June 29, 2011 It occurs to me that that having religious symbols on any government owned land constitutes the government promoting religion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #24 June 29, 2011 QuoteIt occurs to me that that having religious symbols on any government owned land constitutes the government promoting religion. That's the generic (and invalid, imo) argument, yes.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #25 June 29, 2011 QuoteIt occurs to me that that having religious symbols on any government owned land constitutes the government promoting religion. A military cemetery is owned by the residents - they have Bought the Farm, and paid the price. The Government is merely the caretaker. An obelisk to Baal in a cemetery is fine, but a courthouse with an engraving extolling the merits of Sharia is not OK. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
