High School Student Stands Up Against Prayer at Public School and Is Ostracized, Demeaned and Threatened

[dreamdancer 0]

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The school did remove it from the program. The student took it upon herself to do it anyways. How should the school have handled it at that point?

she also led a prayer at the practise session the day before...

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[SkyDekker 1,465]

How does that answer the question you quoted?

[dreamdancer 0]

if they let her practise it the assumption is that the school condoned it...

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Your assumption maybe.

One could also assume the student was asked not to do that, based on the practice, but she did it anyways.

[DiverMike 5]

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Santa Fe, referencing Rosenberger: "We have held, for example, that an individual's contribution to a government-created forum was not government speech."

Way to cut and paste something that doesn't pertain to the circumstances of the event. You might have been more accurate to cut and paste from the same ruling:

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The delivery of a message such as the invocation here--on school property, at school-sponsored events, over the school's public address system, by a speaker representing the student body, under the supervision of school faculty, and pursuant to a school policy that explicitly and implicitly encourages public prayer--is not properly characterized as "private" speech

An invocation at a graduation ceremony is not protected by the first amendment.

For the same reason I jump off a perfectly good diving board.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

The school should send a really strong message and expell her!!!

[champu 1]

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The school did remove it from the program. The student took it upon herself to do it anyways. How should the school have handled it at that point?

<2011 graduation ceremony program RevA.pdf>

I - Introduction by District Superintendent

II - Processional

III - Student Lead Prayer Totally Not a Student Lead Prayer

IV - Valedictorian Speech

V - Presentation of Diplomas

VI - Performance of School Song

VII - Recessional

[SpeedRacer 1]

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And what if she didn't stop?

They should call in Navy Seals Team 6 & take her down.

Speed Racer
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[jaybird18c 25]

This is such an absolutely ridiculous conversation. I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this (because he doesn't believe any of it) except for the fact that I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

[david3 0]

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This is such an absolutely ridiculous conversation. I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this (because he doesn't believe any of it) except for the fact that I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

For me, I just want to make sure everyone has the same opportunity to express themselves as the one who delivered the prayer did. I’m indifferent about Jesus Christ.

[kallend 2,150]

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I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

Yes, but you also believe you have invisible friends, so your beliefs are really quite meaningless and irrelevant.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DanG 1]

How would you have felt if the student had given a Hindu prayer? Or a Muslim prayer? I suspect it would have bothered you, even though you don't believe any of it.

- Dan G

[Coreece 190]

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How would you have felt if the student had given a Hindu prayer? Or a Muslim prayer? I suspect it would have bothered you, even though you don't believe any of it.

How would you have felt if the student had given a Hindu prayer? Or a Muslim prayer? I suspect you wouldn't care because you don't believe any of it.

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[DanG 1]

No, I suspect I would care. How about you?

- Dan G

[Coreece 190]

I already said I don't care...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[jaybird18c 25]

If I were in India, I would expect that. Doesn't mean I have to participate. It certainly wouldn't offend me. Most people there are Hindu. Here, the majority are Christian. It doesn't offend my individual disbelief if I am with them in a group as they pray at an event. It is in their culture. I still have my freedom to worship how I choose or not. I think this is much to do over nothing.

Added: I was in Afghanistan and attended a funeral service for a friend (Afghan, Muslim) who was murdered because he worked for us. Muslim group prayer was offered. I payed my respects to him in my own way and also remained respectful to the Muslim majority. No problem.

[DanG 1]

We're not talking about what people do in another country, in another culture. We're talking about the government sponsoring Christian prayer in America. How would you feel if the government sponsored Hindu prayer in America?

- Dan G

[billvon 3,120]

>I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this

Same reason you'd scream bloody murder if Richard Dawkins gave a talk at your child's graduation about how the evidence doesn't support the existence of God.

[Coreece 190]

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How would you feel if the government sponsored Hindu prayer in America?

I have no problem with giving people the freedom to express their religious beliefs in such a way.

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Coreece 190]

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>I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this

Same reason you'd scream bloody murder if Richard Dawkins gave a talk at your child's graduation about how the evidence doesn't support the existence of God.

Another irrelevant billvonian analogy.

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Gravitymaster 0]

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I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

Yes, but you also believe you have invisible friends, so your beliefs are really quite meaningless and irrelevant.

Well, you believe in invisible particles that you have never seen.

[Shotgun 1]

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This is such an absolutely ridiculous conversation. I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this (because he doesn't believe any of it) except for the fact that I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

I can assure you that I do not hate Jesus Christ. Why would I? What a ridiculous thing to say.

[Andy9o8 2]

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This is such an absolutely ridiculous conversation. I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this (because he doesn't believe any of it) except for the fact that I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

I can assure you that I do not hate Jesus Christ. Why would I? What a ridiculous thing to say.

It's pointless to argue with fanaticism. Same goes for "irrational" or "crazy". Judge the situation, then take your pick.

[Shah]
Women take note: husbands live this every day.
[/Shah]

[kelpdiver 2]

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This is such an absolutely ridiculous conversation. I can't figure out for the life of me why the atheist cares at all about this (because he doesn't believe any of it) except for the fact that I believe deep down each one of them, in their suppression of the truth in unrighteousness, hates Jesus Christ (even if they deny it).

Why would I hate some carpenter from 2000 years ago?

Whereas I do care when religious zealots try to fuck with my life through legislation. And I have a Constitution that says that my government should be keeping them at a distance, not promoting their message.

I said early on how much I care about this particular incident, but if it's true that the school permitted the student to act as she did both in the rehearsal and the actual event, it's clear they were an active party to it.

Fortunately, I live in SF, where the most prominent religious figures may be the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence. http://www.thesisters.org/

[jaybird18c 25]

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We're not talking about what people do in another country, in another culture. We're talking about the government sponsoring Christian prayer in America. How would you feel if the government sponsored Hindu prayer in America?

If this country were primarily comprised of Indians with their culture, I would expect for those traditions to shine through including student led Hindu prayer at school. That would not be an "establishment of religion" and I would still be able to worship or not per the Constitution.