The small blood vessels around the lungs burst and fill the lungs with fluid and blood."

[brenthutch 444]

Quote

>And the deaths from coal pale in comparison the hundreds of thousands
>that have starved because of corn ethanol , , ,

I call bullshit on that number. Take a look around; we have no shortage of corn syrup based on the size of people in any country that uses ethanol.

http://redgreenandblue.org/2011/02/01/egypts-ethanol-revolution-bad-us-policy-driving-up-worldwide-food-prices/

Dont forget that when the developed world spits the third world swims. It is not just about us.

[yourmomma 0]

"And the deaths from coal pale in comparison the hundreds of thousands
>that have starved because of corn ethanol , , ,"


So making ethanol for capitalistic reasons should be abandoned to give other nations welfare. Check. Your far more liberal than I would have thought.

[brenthutch 444]

The only capitalistic reason for making corn ethanol is to drink it. Only gov subsidies, make ethanol in your tank, a profitable endeavor.

[billvon 3,120]

>Only gov subsidies, make ethanol in your tank, a profitable endeavor.

You'll have to let Venezuela and Brazil know that they're not making any money from ethanol production. I am sure they will be glad someone on the Internet is willing to correct them.

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

>Only gov subsidies, make ethanol in your tank, a profitable endeavor.

You'll have to let Venezuela and Brazil know that they're not making any money from ethanol production. I am sure they will be glad someone on the Internet is willing to correct them.

They are making it from sugarcane, not corn. Right?

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[billvon 3,120]

>They are making it from sugarcane, not corn. Right?

Both, actually - but mostly sugarcane.

[billvon 3,120]

>http://redgreenandblue.org/...rldwide-food-prices/

Now I _definitely_ call bullshit. That article gives no facts whatsoever.

I can't even figure out where they get this. Do they claim that corn will become more scarce since we use more for ethanol now, so fewer people will be able to eat it? Corn exports have been rising here in the US ever since 1984. Do they claim that it will make it more expensive for other people to grow grain? 2/3 of the cost of grain production worldwide is fuel costs - so decreasing the fuel supply by banning ethanol production would hurt, not help, farmers in other countries.

[brenthutch 444]

"banning"? who said anything about banning? Just don’t spend taxpayer dollars on that boondoggle. For what we waste on corn ethanol subsidies we could pay 140,000 teachers $50,000 a year. What do you think is a better way to spend our limited resources?

[brenthutch 444]

Quote

>They are making it from sugarcane, not corn. Right?

Both, actually - but mostly sugarcane.

Do you understand the substantive difference? The sucrose in sugarcane is ready to ferment into ethanol. Corn has to be mashed first, converting the starches in the corn into sugar, this required about as much energy as the finished product produces making it an inefficient method of ethanol production.

[billvon 3,120]

>For what we waste on corn ethanol subsidies we could pay 140,000
>teachers $50,000 a year. What do you think is a better way to spend our
>limited resources?

And for what we're wasting on our various wars we could pay every teacher in the US $100,000 a year - or eliminate most of our dependence on foreign oil through biofuels or synfuels.

Being able to create our own fuel is going to be one of the things that determines whether the US survives at all in the coming decades. If we're willing to spend trillions on wars we don't need, surely spending billions on something we desperately need is a far better use of that money.

BTW I agree that corn ethanol is not a long term solution; at best it's a short term solution, one that allows us to use otherwise-unused farmland. It's much, much better to use cellulose (i.e. trash, paper, wood chips) to make fuel. We have companies like Abengoa Bioenergy, BlueFire Ethanol, Colusa Biomass Energy Corporation, DuPont, Fulcrum BioEnergy etc etc doing that now, and hopefully they will soon replace corn based ethanol.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

"banning"? who said anything about banning? Just don’t spend taxpayer dollars on that boondoggle. For what we waste on corn ethanol subsidies we could pay 140,000 teachers $50,000 a year. What do you think is a better way to spend our limited resources?

Psssst.. have you been keeping up with WHO gets rich off all those farm subsidies???

It SURE as hell is not family farms

[brenthutch 444]

You are quite right. The only reason we have even heard of corn ethanol subsidies is that the first political contest in the presidential primaries is the Iowa caucus. Both parties are guilty.