O'Keefe "deceptive" and "unethical" from a surprising source

[GeorgiaDon 385]

A few days ago we were "treated" to an undercover expose' from James O'Keefe that purported to show NPR fund-raising executive Ron Schiller making outrageous comments about republicans, tea party members, etc. Now a detailed comparison of the edited version of the sting meeting with the raw video has been published by Scott Baker, a reporter who works for "The Blaze". Interestingly, The Blaze is a news outlet founded by Glen Beck as a conservative response the the Huffington Post. Baker concludes with "...even if you are of the opinion, as I am, that undercover reporting is acceptable and ethical in very defined situations, it is another thing to approve of editing tactics that seem designed to intentionally lie or mislead about the material being presented."

Details;
1. Muslim brotherhood connection. In the raw video O'Keefe makes it clear there is no connection between the organization he purports to represent and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, but then he edits the video to make it sound as if Schiller is knowingly supporting a Muslim Brotherhood affiliate. O'Keefe (in the raw video) makes it clear he is a very low-level employee in the organization he purports to represent, but in the edited version it sounds as if he is in a policy-making position.

2. Schiller laughing at spread of sharia law. In the edited version of the video, Schiller laughs and makes a light-hearted comment after O'Keefe tells him his organization has a mission to spread acceptance of Sharia law around the world. In the raw video, you can see that Schiller's comment is from a totally different part of the video, in fact at the very beginning where he is reacting to confusion over the name on the reservation at the restaurant where they were meeting.

3. Tea party members "racist and xenophobic". The edited version of the video shows Schiller describing tea party members as racist, xenophobic, etc. The raw video shows that most of these comments, and the most inflammatory of the comments, are actually Schiller recounting conversations where life-long Republicans (one a former ambassador) told him why they felt they had no choice but to support Obama in the last election. This is a favorite tactic of Ann Coulter as well: take a news article where a reporter is reporting about a statement made by a person who is a subject of the story, and then attribute the statement to the reporter in an effort to prove the newspaper is "liberal" or whatever.

Lots of other examples of intentionally deceptive editing are given as well, regarding the education of conservatives, NPR's need for federal funding, and basically everything that made O'Keefe's hit video so inflammatory.

Schiller does say some things conservatives may not want to hear, but he makes it clear that is his personal opinion and not the opinion of NPR. Of course that is edited out in the video O'Keefe released.

For the conservative posters here in SC, I'd say if you give O'Keefe any credibility at all, if you consider him anything other than a lying unethical scumbag, then you also have to accept Michael Moore as the epitome of fine reporting.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[rushmc 23]

Or the person that punked the WI gov as a Koch

And the list goes on

But
as others, you do not care to address the crap that is NPR

If O'Keede did something illegal then let him suffer from his actions.

And those who have shown their true colors? Well, they can be judged too


As can you and I huh....

Otherwise (to use an Amazon phrase) suck it up cupcakes

Selective indignation is a terrible thing to waste

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

A few days ago we were "treated" to an undercover expose' from James O'Keefe that purported to show NPR fund-raising executive Ron Schiller making outrageous comments about republicans, tea party members, etc. Now a detailed comparison of the edited version of the sting meeting with the raw video has been published by Scott Baker, a reporter who works for "The Blaze". Interestingly, The Blaze is a news outlet founded by Glen Beck as a conservative response the the Huffington Post. Baker concludes with "...even if you are of the opinion, as I am, that undercover reporting is acceptable and ethical in very defined situations, it is another thing to approve of editing tactics that seem designed to intentionally lie or mislead about the material being presented."

Details;
1. Muslim brotherhood connection. In the raw video O'Keefe makes it clear there is no connection between the organization he purports to represent and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, but then he edits the video to make it sound as if Schiller is knowingly supporting a Muslim Brotherhood affiliate. O'Keefe (in the raw video) makes it clear he is a very low-level employee in the organization he purports to represent, but in the edited version it sounds as if he is in a policy-making position.

2. Schiller laughing at spread of sharia law. In the edited version of the video, Schiller laughs and makes a light-hearted comment after O'Keefe tells him his organization has a mission to spread acceptance of Sharia law around the world. In the raw video, you can see that Schiller's comment is from a totally different part of the video, in fact at the very beginning where he is reacting to confusion over the name on the reservation at the restaurant where they were meeting.

3. Tea party members "racist and xenophobic". The edited version of the video shows Schiller describing tea party members as racist, xenophobic, etc. The raw video shows that most of these comments, and the most inflammatory of the comments, are actually Schiller recounting conversations where life-long Republicans (one a former ambassador) told him why they felt they had no choice but to support Obama in the last election. This is a favorite tactic of Ann Coulter as well: take a news article where a reporter is reporting about a statement made by a person who is a subject of the story, and then attribute the statement to the reporter in an effort to prove the newspaper is "liberal" or whatever.

Lots of other examples of intentionally deceptive editing are given as well, regarding the education of conservatives, NPR's need for federal funding, and basically everything that made O'Keefe's hit video so inflammatory.

Schiller does say some things conservatives may not want to hear, but he makes it clear that is his personal opinion and not the opinion of NPR. Of course that is edited out in the video O'Keefe released.

For the conservative posters here in SC, I'd say if you give O'Keefe any credibility at all, if you consider him anything other than a lying unethical scumbag, then you also have to accept Michael Moore as the epitome of fine reporting.

Don

I decided to post again using the quote function so as not to loose your brilliant post of self defined superior morality

Good start to a Sunday though. I gotta admit

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[ryoder 1,590]

The story on The Blaze's own website with video clips: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/does-raw-video-of-npr-expose-reveal-questionable-editing-tactics/

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

The story on The Blaze's own website with video clips: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/does-raw-video-of-npr-expose-reveal-questionable-editing-tactics/

Please dont get me wrong as I am not defending O'Keefe. But all need to know that this happening everyday. It is called gotcha reporting.

But everyone needs to realize that while O'Keefe's editing is less that pure, the reason the two resigned is not because of his editing, it is because of what they did say.

Example,
Walker from WI was punked by a person saying he was a Koch. So why didn't Walker get in big trouble politically from this call?

Simple, he said the same to the lying caller as he was saying public. He was consistent

What if Murdock was the head of NPR and he got recorded telling a KKK member that they could donate under an anonymous title? What would the left be doing? (that is an easy one)

Point is, those who will get caught up in this kind of journalism are those who say one thing in public and then do different in an office or behind closed doors.

The two from NPR, had they been lied about, would still have their jobs. But since they are agenda driven liars they are out of office
As should anyone of any party be if they are caught

It is simple to stay out of this kind of trouble

Say what you mean and do what you say.

There will always be those that disagree but at least one will not fall due to scandal

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[GeorgiaDon 385]

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If O'Keede did something illegal then let him suffer from his actions.

As I'm sure you are well aware, there is a difference between "illegal" and "unethical". Reporters who lie lose their jobs, as they should; they don't usually go to prison. If O'Keefe wishes to present himself as a "reporter" doing "undercover investigative journalism" he is ethically, not legally, obliged to present a factual accounting of the substance of his interviews. It's clear from the raw footage of the interview that he has absolutely no interest in doing that.

Quote

Selective indignation is a terrible thing to waste

Coming from you, that's really really funny. Thanks for the laugh, I'll be chuckling all day.

Quote

I decided to post again using the quote function...

Nice waste of bandwidth, considering my post is directly above yours.

Quote

...so as not to loose your brilliant post of self defined superior morality

So you consider an expectation of some semblance of truth from those who call themselves "investigative reporters" to be "self defined moral superiority"? Perhaps you consider a view of the world founded on outright lies to be preferable? Of course, I guess it's all OK (to you) if those lies conform to your "reality".

Quote

Good start to a Sunday though. I gotta admit

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[rushmc 23]

Unethical happens every day

The selective indignation is what makes it interesting

And I wanted to make sure you did not delete your post
that is the reason for my waste of bandwidth

what do you think of the boys claiming to be one of the Koch brothers and calling Walker?

Or is that different for you?

All the same to me

again
I do not agree with O'Keefe's editing tech but those two did it to themselves with their own lack of ethics

O'Keefe just helped them along.

Oh

and I was posting to YOUR showing of superior morality

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Gravitymaster 0]

Great! Let's just remove any public funding from NPR and then they can say and do whatever they want and nobody will care. The fact they try to portray themselves as balanced and non-political, while at the same time recieving public funding is the real issue. Remove the public funding and let their advertisers and listeners judge their content.

Unlikely that will happen though. Haven't you ever noticed that liberals like those at NPR always think of themselves as so intelligent and enlightened. However, for some reason they aren't smart enough to push their agenda on their own fundraising efforts without government support. They don't sound too smart to me.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Great! Let's just remove any public funding from NPR and then they can say and do whatever they want and nobody will care. The fact they try to portray themselves as balanced and non-political, while at the same time recieving public funding is the real issue. Remove the public funding and let their advertisers and listeners judge their content.

Unlikely that will happen though. Haven't you ever noticed that liberals like those at NPR always think of themselves as so intelligent and enlightened. However, for some reason they aren't smart enough to push their agenda on their own fundraising efforts without government support. They don't sound too smart to me.

As you indicate this has nothing to do with O'Keefe.

It has everything to do with the liberals NPR taking a fall

Nothing more, nothing less

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[GeorgiaDon 385]

Quote

Haven't you ever noticed that liberals like those at NPR always think of themselves as so intelligent and enlightened.

I know lots of conservatives who think of themselves as intelligent and enlightened. Just because you think those are negative qualities doesn't make them so.

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Let's just remove any public funding from NPR and then they can say and do whatever they want ...

Schiller did say it would be an ideal situation if NPR could divest itself of any government funding, and that the "head office" would probably be able to do that. Local stations in smaller markets would probably have a very hard time, though. I suppose having local stations off the air, replaced by commercial top-40 crap playing franchised stations fits well with the tastes of some.

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The fact they try to portray themselves as balanced and non-political, while at the same time recieving public funding is the real issue.

For my part I do find them overwhelmingly non-political. The fact that they don't preface every mention of Obama's name with some pejorative adjective doesn't make them left wing. I guess if O'Reilly is your idea of "fair and balanced", though, you might find the lack of personal slurs against the president or democrats in general to suggest a leftist leaning.

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Remove the public funding and let their advertisers...

The point of the exercise is to eliminate the censorship and bias that comes with having to appease corporate sponsors.

Quote

...and listeners judge their content.

Listeners do judge their content.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[GeorgiaDon 385]

Quote

...this has nothing to do with O'Keefe.

It has everything to do with the liberals NPR taking a fall

Nothing more, nothing less

And you say you're not defending O'Keefe. Is a fall based on lies a good thing? I guess for you any means justifies the ends.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

Haven't you ever noticed that liberals like those at NPR always think of themselves as so intelligent and enlightened.

Ever listened to P.J. O'Rourke, or read any of his books?
He is definitely an intellectual and he is an avowed conservative.

Another very intellectual conservative was William F. Buckley Jr.

The Tea-Party mentality that intellectual == bad, is a very recent invention.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

I guess if O'Reilly is your idea of "fair and balanced", though, you might find the lack of personal slurs against the president or democrats in general to suggest a leftist leaning.

Well, O'Reilly seems to be making an effort.
Watch him grill Rumsfeld on 3 Mar 2011:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBwykiAjyQ8

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Or the person that punked the WI gov as a Koch

And the list goes on

But
as others, you do not care to address the crap that is NPR

If O'Keede did something illegal then let him suffer from his actions.

And those who have shown their true colors? Well, they can be judged too


As can you and I huh....

Otherwise (to use an Amazon phrase) suck it up cupcakes

Selective indignation is a terrible thing to waste

I know.. you do it soo well.. soooooooooooo often.


Oh and as far as the WI Gov thing... his own words.... UNEDITED... Suck it up

[Gravitymaster 0]

Talk about missing the point. Did you even read my post?

When I said they think of themselves as so smart and intelligent, the point was if they are so smart, why do they need public funding? Why can't they find a way to fund their enterprise without the government?

What does O'Reilly have to do with it? Oh, I get it you can't respond without a personal insult.

Not worth discussing with you any further.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

...this has nothing to do with O'Keefe.

It has everything to do with the liberals NPR taking a fall

Nothing more, nothing less

And you say you're not defending O'Keefe. Is a fall based on lies a good thing? I guess for you any means justifies the ends.

Don

What lies?
(nice try)

Was the Koch impostor the same as O'Keefe in your eyes?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[GeorgiaDon 385]

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What lies?
(nice try)

O'Keefe's lies. Editing the video to make it appear as if people said things they did not say.

Quote

Was the Koch impostor the same as O'Keefe in your eyes?

My understanding is that the Koch impersonator released a recording of the conversation as it actually occurred. If you have a link showing that the recording was edited so as to make the governor out to be saying things he did not actually say, I'd like to see that.

I don't have a problem with investigative journalism, and sometimes that means deceiving the target of the investigation. Not too different from undercover police work. In both cases lying about the outcome of the investigation is what is unethical.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

What lies?
(nice try)

O'Keefe's lies. Editing the video to make it appear as if people said things they did not say.

Quote

Was the Koch impostor the same as O'Keefe in your eyes?

My understanding is that the Koch impersonator released a recording of the conversation as it actually occurred. If you have a link showing that the recording was edited so as to make the governor out to be saying things he did not actually say, I'd like to see that.

I don't have a problem with investigative journalism, and sometimes that means deceiving the target of the investigation. Not too different from undercover police work. In both cases lying about the outcome of the investigation is what is unethical.

Don

You are being a bit selective IMO

But pretended to be something other than they were

O"keefe released an edited version howevern, the raw tape was still available

The raw version shows the context better however, it did NOT vindicate them from what they said at all

Again, all one need to to stay out of this kind of trouble it to be honest. The NPR exec were anything but

So they get what they did to themselves

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln