'so, instead of letting a court decide, we have a new decider of whether a law is constitutional

[rushmc 23]

Yet the admin ignores other court rulings they do not like

A power grab?

Forget which law we are talking about here. Think about seperation of powers.


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/02/23/obama-administration-drops-defense-anti-gay-marriage-law/#

Quote

Attorney General Eric Holder said President Obama has concluded that the administration cannot defend the federal law that defines marriage as only between a man and a woman. He noted that the congressional debate during passage of the Defense of Marriage Act "contains numerous expressions reflecting moral disapproval of gays and lesbians and their intimate and family relationships -- precisely the kind of stereotype-based thinking and animus the (Constitution's)Equal Protection Clause is designed to guard against."

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 3,119]

>so, instead of letting a court decide . . .

Should be a GOPers dream. No activist judges legislating from the bench!

[rushmc 23]

Quote

>so, instead of letting a court decide . . .

Should be a GOPers dream. No activist judges legislating from the bench!

I guess the libs dont need an activist court anymore

They got a activist executive branch

Hell

We dont even need courts anymore huh

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

>so, instead of letting a court decide . . .

Should be a GOPers dream. No activist judges legislating from the bench!

tangent and useless

what do you think about the executive branch bypassing the judicial?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[LyraM45 0]

Bravo to the Pres for making a decision that was legal/constitutional based despite what his personal beliefs on the situation are. I definitely respect that kind of leadership.

Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :)

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Bravo to the Pres for making a decision that was legal/constitutional based despite what his personal beliefs on the situation are. I definitely respect that kind of leadership.

Cool
So we now know what leadership means to you

The exec branch can now determine if a law is constituional instead of defending laws as defined by the constitution

But maybe the next Admin will decide that they do not like search laws and stop defending those laws because that is the opinion they have

you would be ok with that and call that leadership?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 897]

While I agree with your intent ... it's way over the legal boundaries of his position and branch of government to do this IMO.

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Bravo to the Pres for making a decision that was legal/constitutional based despite what his personal beliefs on the situation are. I definitely respect that kind of leadership.

His correct action would be to request a stay on the law and ask the Supremes to review the constitutionality.

Once the Supremes granted a stay, then he could legally not enforce it.



perhaps the branches of government are all cross training in each others' areas for career flexibility

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

While I agree with your intent ... it's way over the legal boundaries of his position and branch of government to do this IMO.

all you need to do is flip it in a scenario

law passes to protect gay marriage everywhere - President then "chooses" to call it unconstitutional and not enforce that law - I wonder if Lyra would "applaud the leadership then"

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[lawrocket 3]

Quote

Bravo to the Pres for making a decision that was legal/constitutional based despite what his personal beliefs on the situation are. I definitely respect that kind of leadership.

Once again, we have a circumstance of an executive who not only decides not to so the job but also instructs others not to do theirs. The only way it can be worse is like it was when Jerry Brown - in his role as California Attorney General - actually advocatyed AGAINST his client. He still lost because his argument was political and philosophical instead of legal.

I, for one, support the repeal of the DOMA. However, our President has demonstrated the opposite of leadership. The President has had a couple of years to propose a law repealing it. He had a House and Senate in his favor that was pretty filibuster proof. He and Congress had the chance to show leadership and get this done. Instead he's not only letting someone else do it in Court (leaving political questions to the court) but he is also instructing his Solicitor General and Attorney General not to defend a law in court - which is their job.

Once again, I am in the position of applauding the substantive policy and despising the procedural shenanigans. Another example of doing the right thing the wrong way.

I don't know how sitting idly by while others do something became "leadership." Now, of course, leadership includes not just sittingf idly by but also means sitting idly by when your job is to do something.

"That doctor demonstrated great leadership. He didn't treat that criminal because he wasn't worth treating."
"What great leadership. That pharmacist refused to dispense a morning after pill. Sure, it's his job and duty, but his subjective opinion means that he is exempt from the rules."
"Great job by that defense lawyer. Not only did he not defend his client, but he got a guilty plea out of him that will put him in jail for life. Somebody had to pay for that murder."
"How about that President? He's said we'll keep enforcing DOMA but it's unconstitutional so we won't defend it in court. We also don't want to repeal it - leace that to the courts. What leadership!"

Pass the Tylenol...

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[rehmwa 2]

Law is about a defined process. He consistently fails to support the process for those positions based on his on philosophies.

That's so very scary.

Even more so when it's also HIS job to enforce the very processes he ignores.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Law is about a defined process. He consistently fails to support the process for those positions based on his on philosophies.

That's so very scary.

Even more so when it's also HIS job to enforce the very processes he ignores.

He also is showing he will ignore the courts (drilling in the Gulf) and the HC law

He has sworn to up hold the constitution

Is he holding to that oath?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[tkhayes 348]

Bush signed his 'signing papers' saying the tortue was Ok and redefined his rights within the law, and overrode courts and legislators at the same time

Quote

Yet the admin ignores other court rulings they do not like

A power grab?

Forget which law we are talking about here. Think about seperation of powers.

thanks for making my case with your own words. Seems the conduct is neiterh liberal nor conservative I am afraid......

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Seems the conduct is neither liberal nor conservative I am afraid......

which is why both sides should be very afraid when the branch responsible for upholding the law breaks the very foundations of law

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Bush signed his 'signing papers' saying the tortue was Ok and redefined his rights within the law, and overrode courts and legislators at the same time

Quote

Yet the admin ignores other court rulings they do not like

A power grab?

Forget which law we are talking about here. Think about seperation of powers.

thanks for making my case with your own words. Seems the conduct is neiterh liberal nor conservative I am afraid......

In some cases?

Yes

But not in the example you provide

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Southern_Man 0]

I think DOMA is not a very good law. However it was passed with the consent of both houses of congress and signed by the (former) president. I think process is important and the current administration should be actively trying to repeal the law if they don't like it. I can't see just deciding not to defend it. I guess the NY judge will just rule it unconstitutional? Then will it go to the Supreme Court? I believe other circuits have held differently. Pretty funny to hold a supreme court hearing and have one side not appear at all.

This administration previously has said that they will not pursue convictions in medical marijuana states. I am for full legalization. Frankly I am against the medical marijuana (because it is apparent to me that this is a sham). However, I don't think the administration just declining to enforce the law is the way to go about change.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[rushmc 23]

Quote

I think DOMA is not a very good law. However it was passed with the consent of both houses of congress and signed by the (former) president. I think process is important and the current administration should be actively trying to repeal the law if they don't like it. I can't see just deciding not to defend it. I guess the NY judge will just rule it unconstitutional? Then will it go to the Supreme Court? I believe other circuits have held differently. Pretty funny to hold a supreme court hearing and have one side not appear at all.

This administration previously has said that they will not pursue convictions in medical marijuana states. I am for full legalization. Frankly I am against the medical marijuana (because it is apparent to me that this is a sham). However, I don't think the administration just declining to enforce the law is the way to go about change.

Well put!

Not that I agree with your positions on all you posted but, the pres has a job to do

And deciding the constitutionality of a law in not one them

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Quote

Bravo to the Pres for making a decision that was legal/constitutional based despite what his personal beliefs on the situation are. I definitely respect that kind of leadership.

Cool
So we now know what leadership means to you

The exec branch can now determine if a law is constituional instead of defending laws as defined by the constitution

But maybe the next Admin will decide that they do not like search laws and stop defending those laws because that is the opinion they have

you would be ok with that and call that leadership?

WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH

Are you sure you were awake from Jan of 2001 til 2009??

[lawrocket 3]

And the lack of standards applicable to all continues.

by the way - this "unconstitutional" law wasn't Bush's fault, was it?

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

And the lack of standards applicable to all continues.

by the way - this "unconstitutional" law wasn't Bush's fault, was it?

Lawyers live on precedent...

[Belgian_Draft 0]

A couple points that I find interesting.
First, this is nothing new. Presidents have been ignoring laws they don't like for decades.
Second, the Obama haters have new ammunition to go after him with...only this time it is real. Dereliction of duty, breach of oath, take your pick.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[lawrocket 3]

[Reply]Lawyers live on precedent...

[Amazon 7]

Quote

[Reply]Lawyers live on precedent...

Funny how there isn't a precedent with DOMA being unconstitutional. I think it's tough to take a case of first impression and say "Unconstitutional."

So you make a good point. There ain't no precedent.

[rhaig 0]

Quote

Are you sure you were awake from Jan of 2001 til 2009??

are we going to discuss how many years that is again? Because if we are, I need another drink. that was a painful thread.

--
Rob

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Quote

Are you sure you were awake from Jan of 2001 til 2009??

are we going to discuss how many years that is again? Because if we are, I need another drink. that was a painful thread.

Hey facts is facts...Its not my fault if some people can't grasp the concept of an Inauguration Day that defines when a President enters office or leaves his presidncy. We have this great thing... The inaguration of our presidents is on the 20th or the 21st of January for every one of our presidents Since FDR in the 1930's

That happens on Jan 20 or 21 every 4 or 8 years... I always considered that a simple concept.