Five myths about Reagan

[kallend 2,131]

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Nixon's stature seemed to shoot up in the 90s, for reasons that escape me.

I remember why. It's because by then, enough time had passed since his resignation (about 20 years) that he managed (with great and largely successful effort) to rehabilitate and re-invent himself as a thoughtful and respected author, lecturer and senior statesman.

that is the storyline, but for me, doesn't quite explain "why." Other than people are idiots.

Because Nixon, like Carter, was a better ex-President than President.

Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

How many presidents have had operas written about them?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[popsjumper 2]

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Nixon's stature seemed to shoot up in the 90s, for reasons that escape me.

I remember why. It's because by then, enough time had passed since his resignation (about 20 years) that he managed (with great and largely successful effort) to rehabilitate and re-invent himself as a thoughtful and respected author, lecturer and senior statesman.

that is the storyline, but for me, doesn't quite explain "why." Other than people are idiots.

Because Nixon, like Carter, was a better ex-President than President.

Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

How many presidents have had operas written about them?

I remember "Dick Nixon before he dick's YOU."

Wasn't Romeo and Juliet about Bill and Monica?
Just askin'.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[popsjumper 2]

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I don't know your age, but I'm old enough to remember having Nixon as president. He was never "popular", not in the Reagan sense; he was just accepted by conservatives as one of them in '68 when everyone was exhausted with Johnson and Vietnam and civil rights and hippies and The Three Assassinations; and as a saner alternative to the (perceived) train wreck of McGovern in '72.

All too true. If I remember correctly, age was a factor too in the broad sense. McG had a following of young people, Dicky had the older ones.

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while I doubt anyone ever truly loved Richard Nixon who was not one of his next of kin.

I'm not sure his momma even loved him. I think Haldeman had a latent feeling for him though.

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Personally, as political history dweeb, I think Nixon was a very capable president.
-He had a very high intellect,
-was a good politician (usually),
-worked with the opposition-controlled Congress pretty -well, and
-was a good administrative manager
But his personality could be a black hole of darkness. Friendless, odd to the point of weird, paranoid, insecure, vindictive... it would prove to be his undoing in the end.

Smart guy who's national political skill was one of
-mess with me and I'll have your ass kicked.
-let me make you an offer that you can't refuse.
-I don't care what it takes, just DO it.

But yes, I agree. that on the international level he was much more the smoothie.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[turtlespeed 226]

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Nixon's stature seemed to shoot up in the 90s, for reasons that escape me.

I remember why. It's because by then, enough time had passed since his resignation (about 20 years) that he managed (with great and largely successful effort) to rehabilitate and re-invent himself as a thoughtful and respected author, lecturer and senior statesman.

that is the storyline, but for me, doesn't quite explain "why." Other than people are idiots.

Because Nixon, like Carter, was a better ex-President than President.

Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

How many presidents have had operas written about them?

I remember "Dick Nixon before he dick's YOU."

Wasn't Romeo and Juliet about Bill and Monica?
Just askin'.

You remember when that phrase was about Ceasar.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[quade 4]

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Nixon's stature seemed to shoot up in the 90s, for reasons that escape me.

I remember why. It's because by then, enough time had passed since his resignation (about 20 years) that he managed (with great and largely successful effort) to rehabilitate and re-invent himself as a thoughtful and respected author, lecturer and senior statesman.

that is the storyline, but for me, doesn't quite explain "why." Other than people are idiots.

Because Nixon, like Carter, was a better ex-President than President.
Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

How many presidents have had operas written about them?

Sir, I saw that piece of crap. It was bafflingly bad.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[freethefly 6]

Watched this a few days ago on PBS. Far different from what is normally shown about Reagan. Well worth watching.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/reagan/player/

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[kallend 2,131]

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Nixon's stature seemed to shoot up in the 90s, for reasons that escape me.

I remember why. It's because by then, enough time had passed since his resignation (about 20 years) that he managed (with great and largely successful effort) to rehabilitate and re-invent himself as a thoughtful and respected author, lecturer and senior statesman.

that is the storyline, but for me, doesn't quite explain "why." Other than people are idiots.

Because Nixon, like Carter, was a better ex-President than President.
Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

How many presidents have had operas written about them?

Sir, I saw that piece of crap. It was bafflingly bad.

Quite appropriate for a baffling and bad president.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[marks2065 0]

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Reagan's shtick during his campaign speeches was how the Federal government is too big and spends too much.

Then he got into office and broke all previous records for big government spending.


I guess that Newsweek article comparing similarities between Reagan and Obama was right. Both made great speeches & promises to change things, and then got into office and didn't do it.


Isn't it great when the guy you voted for wins the election? You just can't wait for him to get into office so he can start fulfilling his campaign promises!!

maybe Reagan wasn't perfect but you can't argue his acomplishments while in office. While Reagan was in office the unemployment rate dropped by a large amount (over 16 million new jobs), the military was rebuilt, the cold war was ended with a treaty, germany was reunited. I know myself that my pay went from 22k his first year to 54k his last year. Reagan did raise taxes but you don't mind paying a little more when you are making more than double what you used to. was he a perfect president, no he wasn't, but very few can say they were doing worse when he left office and he made the nation feel good about itself. Putting the people at ease is the first step in improoving the country, something that this administration can't or won't do.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Nixon was a statesman on the international stage. Even though he was disliked by Americans, he was respected by leaders of other countries. Nixon, went to China. That doesn't sound like much nowadays, but at the time it was monumental.

I bet they love him in Chile or Cambodia.

well, they'd love to have tried him as a war criminal.

[lawrocket 3]

It's interesting seeing these kinds of commentaries. You've got Presidents, all of whom have had successes and failures both personal and professional.

LBJ - brought the welfare state into its present form, elevated the Vietnam war and was hated on all sides. he's listed as one of the better president.
Nixon - piss poor domestic policy, foreign policy kudos.
Gerald Ford - as time has gone on he's generally perceived to be a bit better
Carter - Generally the worst since Hoover. A better ex-president
Reagan - been discussed
GHW Bush - a middle of the road with the good and bad. Another one-termer
Clinton - started horribly, became damned good, lousy personal decision maker
GW Bush - not much I can find that was good about the guy
Obama - He seems to want to take Dubya's fuckups and do them worse.


It's the interesting stuff that we find whenever there is a situation where human beings are involved. We all have those things at which we excel. We all have foibles and those things at which we fail. We all have successes and fuckups. We are all right and wrong.

Presidents are people.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[deltron80 0]

This cult of Reagan is so funny..

The left does have heroes.. Problem is you have to read books to know about them.

edited to note: funny how most right-wingers' political heroes are men in high places who obviously aren't looking out for their interests whereas the heros of the left were moreso leaders of the common man...food for thought

[popsjumper 2]

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This cult of Reagan is so funny..

The left does have heroes.. Problem is you have to read books to know about them.

edited to note: funny how most right-wingers' political heroes are men in high places who obviously aren't looking out for their interests whereas the heros of the left were moreso leaders of the common man...food for thought

I thought about it and found it to be total, uneducated BS. More of the same "I read it in a book" drivel.

Thanks for playing though.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[masterblaster72 0]

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Funny how difficult it is for the left to find the same type of role model.

This cult of Reagan is just another right-wing propaganda blitz that shows if you repeat it enough times, it becomes truth to people who are too lazy to read. Reagan wasn't all that.

Reagan was neither a horrible president, nor was he anything more than a decent president. To elevate him to this Teddy Roosevelt type figure is just stupid...then again, so was electing George W. Bush -- twice.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[airdvr 210]

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This cult of Reagan is so funny..

The left does have heroes.. Problem is you have to read books to know about them.

edited to note: funny how most right-wingers' political heroes are men in high places who obviously aren't looking out for their interests whereas the heros of the left were moreso leaders of the common man...food for thought

Why don't you enlighten us with some examples?

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[airdvr 210]

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Funny how difficult it is for the left to find the same type of role model.

This cult of Reagan is just another right-wing propaganda blitz that shows if you repeat it enough times, it becomes truth to people who are too lazy to read. Reagan wasn't all that.

Better look in a mirror...ya got some ignorance there on your face.

You're obviously too young to remember what the years preceding the election of Reagan were like.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[wmw999 2,569]

I'm not too young to remember.
I voted against Reagan.
I'm glad I did.

He did some good things; he restored a sense of strength to the government, which a lot of people seemed to need to feel proud of their government.

Me, I don't need to be strong to be proud of myself.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[deltron80 0]

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This cult of Reagan is so funny..

The left does have heroes.. Problem is you have to read books to know about them.

edited to note: funny how most right-wingers' political heroes are men in high places who obviously aren't looking out for their interests whereas the heros of the left were moreso leaders of the common man...food for thought

Why don't you enlighten us with some examples?

Some of my personal/political heroes:

-Kurt Vonnegut
-Martin Luther King Jr
-Bayard Rustin
-Eugene Debs
-Emma Goldman
-Noam Chomsky
-Howard Zinn
-Hannah Arendt
-Gandhi

I know a lot of them are authors, so sorry about that. I guess smart people write books sometimes.

[popsjumper 2]

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Why don't you enlighten us with some examples?

Did you really think you were going to get anything more than a professors assigned reading list?

I voted for Bonzo Reagan too. I think it was because of all the bad movies and I felt sorry for him...I don't remember exactly why.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[deltron80 0]

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Why don't you enlighten us with some examples?

Did you really think you were going to get anything more than a professors assigned reading list?

I voted for Bonzo Reagan too. I think it was because of all the bad movies and I felt sorry for him...I don't remember exactly why.

How is that a professor's reading list? lol

It's just a list of some of the greatest political minds of the 20th century! Sorry there aren't more Presidents & CEO's on there for you to agree with.

As a paragon of the right, who are some of your political heroes?

[popsjumper 2]

Samuel Langhorne Clemens
James Stewart
W.C. Fields
Pigasus

"paragon of the right"?
You have no clue but you might know....
Does that come with a crown or a large yearly stipend?
Heck, I'd take a washer/dryer combo.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[deltron80 0]

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Samuel Langhorne Clemens
James Stewart
W.C. Fields
Pigasus

"paragon of the right"?
You have no clue but you might know....
Does that come with a crown or a large yearly stipend?
Heck, I'd take a washer/dryer combo.

hehehehe

[DaVinci 0]

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Quite appropriate for a baffling and bad president.

Funny considering how you seem to love everything he did.... Except that he did it.

"he had legalized abortion in California as governor"

"Federal spending grew by an average of 2.5 percent a year"

"Ultimately, Reagan signed measures that increased federal taxes every year of his two-term presidency "

Lets not even get started on Kennedy:

1. Bay of Pigs is an awful lot alike Saddam in Iraq.

2. Banned travel to Cuba.

3 "Alliance for Progress" seems a lot like Iran Contra

4. He CUT taxes, "He proposed substantial tax reform and reduction, in income tax rates, from the current range of 20-90% to a range of 14-65%; he proposed a reduction in the corporate tax rates from 52 to 47%"

5. Kennedy presided over the first government budget to top the $100 billion mark

6. His first budget in 1961 led to the country's first non-war, non-recession deficit

So Kennedy was a hawk, who CUT taxes, limited freedom, and ran a deficit.

You bash Reagan, but love Kennedy?????

[kallend 2,131]

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Quite appropriate for a baffling and bad president.

Funny considering how you seem to love everything he did.... Except that he did it.

"he had legalized abortion in California as governor"

"Federal spending grew by an average of 2.5 percent a year"

"Ultimately, Reagan signed measures that increased federal taxes every year of his two-term presidency "

Lets not even get started on Kennedy:

1. Bay of Pigs is an awful lot alike Saddam in Iraq.

2. Banned travel to Cuba.

3 "Alliance for Progress" seems a lot like Iran Contra

4. He CUT taxes, "He proposed substantial tax reform and reduction, in income tax rates, from the current range of 20-90% to a range of 14-65%; he proposed a reduction in the corporate tax rates from 52 to 47%"

5. Kennedy presided over the first government budget to top the $100 billion mark

6. His first budget in 1961 led to the country's first non-war, non-recession deficit

So Kennedy was a hawk, who CUT taxes, limited freedom, and ran a deficit.

You bash Reagan, but love Kennedy?????

Wrong. Kennedy was a philandering warmonger from a family of bootleggers, who only got prominent on account of his family's ill gotten wealth.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DaVinci 0]

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Wrong. Kennedy was a philandering warmonger from a family of bootleggers, who only got prominent on account of his family's ill gotten wealth

You ignored that Reagan did things that you claim to support, yet bash him.