daily TSA f#$k-up thread

[nigel99 577]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

I can see the body scanner gaining more support if it's actually used in a way that can speed things up and provide passengers with more convenience. Taking your jacket, belt, and shoes off and emptying your pockets is slow and annoying but when you're just going through a metal detector it makes sense due to the limitations of that machine's ability to resolve threats. And if you do set off a metal detector, getting patted down seems reasonable because everyone involved understands the limited information a metal detector provides.

The TSA is using backscatter machines like they are fancy metal detectors rather than being a whole new tool. Let me leave my jacket and shoes on and let me leave my things in my pockets. Use that big fancy machine you're making me walk through to resolve the difference between a cell phone and a weapon rather than patting me down just because you see "something."

Actually the full body scanners make it worse. They warn you not to even have gum wrappers in your pockets. Even if you go through the scanner you can end up getting patted down for some silly reason.

That said I still believe that the polite friendly approach to the TSA helps substantially. Occasionally being friendly to the TSA agent makes you a convenient pick for their quota of searches but I have still found that it goes quickly and is pretty cursory.

I just wish they would classify screaming kids as dangerous weapons and provide a disposal point for them on the way onto the plane

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[Ion01 2]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

Well lets see, since the government is always so trustworthy and honest........no.......wait....... they have already had issues month and months ago with making fun of people and thier size.

From article:
I asked him if he was looking forward to conducting the full-on pat-downs. "Nobody's going to do it," he said, "once they find out that we're going to do."

In other words, people, when faced with a choice, will inevitably choose the Dick-Measuring Device over molestation? "That's what we're hoping for. We're trying to get everyone into the machine." He called over a colleague. "Tell him what you call the back-scatter," he said. "The Dick-Measuring Device," I said. "That's the truth," the other officer responded.



When the TSA calls it a Dick measuring device......when adam savage can get two long razor blades through it.......really?

[kelpdiver 2]

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>... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

Some use millimeter waves and do not do any damage; some use xrays and expose you to a measurable amount of ionizing radiation.

Dangerous? Not that dangerous. But several people do not see the reason to take _any_ risks with their health for the sake of the TSA, and I can't say I blame them.

that, and the peepshow problems, and the numerous lies by the TSA regarding the subject.

ZigZag - there's no reason to accept them when they're not even effective.

[DSE 5]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

I boycotted today.

I was asked if I was sure I wanted to avoid the body scanner. I explained I did not trust that my naked body wouldn't find its way to the internet. The pat down was made to sound like a punitive action for refusing the body scanner. They asked me to remove a bulky sweatshirt and when I pulled off the sweatshirt, rmy tshirt partially with the sweatshirt, I was told that I'd be fined if I exposed skin. I wasn't removing my Tshirt, but they were expecting it, or so it seems.

As I was being felt up, I asked the TSA agent if he enjoyed being paid for groping people. He replied that I wasn't being groped, and that any further comments could result in "a bad day for me."

TSA could stand for Tolerated Sexual Assault. I'm convinced it's a place pedophiles and perverts can find jobs and be exceptionally happy. Erstwhile, the terrorists already have won, and will win again.

It must suck to be a rent-a-moron right now, and that's only going to serve to make them more defensive and likely to make more errors.

[Ion01 2]

Anyone ever consider this:
The government is pushing hard for "green" technology like mag lev trains and such but people won't use them when they could use airplanes, so here is a nice way to "nudge" (as Cass Sunstein would say) the people to make the "right decision" by getting people so sickened by the TSA they would rather take a train that doesn't exist and needs funding for that nobody wants right now. Ever heard of Cass' book called nudge? Its full of stuff like this.
"
We have received hundreds of e-mails and phone calls from travelers vowing to stop flying,” said Geoff Freeman, an executive vice president of the U.S. Travel Association

[skyrider 0]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

I boycotted today.

I was asked if I was sure I wanted to avoid the body scanner. I explained I did not trust that my naked body wouldn't find its way to the internet. The pat down was made to sound like a punitive action for refusing the body scanner. They asked me to remove a bulky sweatshirt and when I pulled off the sweatshirt, rmy tshirt partially with the sweatshirt, I was told that I'd be fined if I exposed skin. I wasn't removing my Tshirt, but they were expecting it, or so it seems.

As I was being felt up, I asked the TSA agent if he enjoyed being paid for groping people. He replied that I wasn't being groped, and that any further comments could result in "a bad day for me."

TSA could stand for Tolerated Sexual Assault. I'm convinced it's a place pedophiles and perverts can find jobs and be exceptionally happy. Erstwhile, the terrorists already have won, and will win again.

It must suck to be a rent-a-moron right now, and that's only going to serve to make them more defensive and likely to make more errors.

Couldn't get hired as a Police officer, too lazy to be a Security Guard....Not like they come from the top of the barrel!

Exactly what did th easshole mean by "long day" if you kept excersizing yoru right to speak? I'd HAVE to find out...fuck it, been in jail before, that don;t scare me!

[Ion01 2]

http://www.infowars.com/tsa-desktop-image-makes-joke-of-cavity-searching-children/

[skyrider 0]

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Anyone ever consider this:
The government is pushing hard for "green" technology like mag lev trains and such but people won't use them when they could use airplanes, so here is a nice way to "nudge" (as Cass Sunstein would say) the people to make the "right decision" by getting people so sickened by the TSA they would rather take a train that doesn't exist and needs funding for that nobody wants right now. Ever heard of Cass' book called nudge? Its full of stuff like this.
"
We have received hundreds of e-mails and phone calls from travelers vowing to stop flying,” said Geoff Freeman, an executive vice president of the U.S. Travel Association

What even for a second makes you think TSA wouldn't be at the train station?

[champu 1]

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Actually the full body scanners make it worse. They warn you not to even have gum wrappers in your pockets. Even if you go through the scanner you can end up getting patted down for some silly reason.

Exactly my point. To the traveller, it's the same or slightly worse than a metal detector in terms of convenience and not getting patted down. It also takes longer and it has added privacy issues due to the images produced. It's completely useless the way it's being used at present.

Unless they can get their operators trained to the point where you can send a group of average people through with shoes on, a wallet, phone, and keys in their pocket and maybe a wrist watch on and only have 5-10% require any additional attention to resolve something, they need to ditch the machines.

[airdvr 210]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

I boycotted today.

I was asked if I was sure I wanted to avoid the body scanner. I explained I did not trust that my naked body wouldn't find its way to the internet. The pat down was made to sound like a punitive action for refusing the body scanner. They asked me to remove a bulky sweatshirt and when I pulled off the sweatshirt, rmy tshirt partially with the sweatshirt, I was told that I'd be fined if I exposed skin. I wasn't removing my Tshirt, but they were expecting it, or so it seems.

As I was being felt up, I asked the TSA agent if he enjoyed being paid for groping people. He replied that I wasn't being groped, and that any further comments could result in "a bad day for me."

TSA could stand for Tolerated Sexual Assault. I'm convinced it's a place pedophiles and perverts can find jobs and be exceptionally happy. Erstwhile, the terrorists already have won, and will win again.

It must suck to be a rent-a-moron right now, and that's only going to serve to make them more defensive and likely to make more errors.

Worst part of that whole encounter is they're just doing what they've been told to do. Can't imagine the amount of grief they're taking right now. There must have really been a credible source that said something was up.

We're leaving for St. Martin second week of December. I hope this all settles down by then.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[kelpdiver 2]

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Worst part of that whole encounter is they're just doing what they've been told to do. Can't imagine the amount of grief they're taking right now. There must have really been a credible source that said something was up.

no, they're doing it to establish a new line in the sand. Once it is established, they can move on to even more invasive measures that produce no results other than agency growth. They made two separate outrageous statements here.

1) "if you show skin, you'll be fined." An obvious attempt to threaten would be protesters who might strip down, again applied in a heavy handed, zero tolerance (zero intelligence) manner.

2) "if you say anything more, it will be bad for you" More abuse of position. He certainly was being groped, and now on top of it, threatened. Very unprofessional, which of course is the problem with all of this.

DSE - the ACLU is asking for incident reports. I think it's important for them to know about both of these remarks.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Anyone ever consider this:
The government is pushing hard for "green" technology like mag lev trains and such but people won't use them when they could use airplanes, so here is a nice way to "nudge" (as Cass Sunstein would say) the people to make the "right decision" by getting people so sickened by the TSA they would rather take a train that doesn't exist and needs funding for that nobody wants right now. Ever heard of Cass' book called nudge? Its full of stuff like this.
"

This is a pretty round about method of promoting train use, and is more likely to simply grow car use, which leads to costly maintenance needs on the interstates.

I see it nearly as far fetched as Rhys's 9/11 theories. It might be more plausible if these mag levs actually existed already, rather than be mere concepts in search of funding support. The California bullet train will take more than a decade to complete - too far down the road to work as positive feedback.

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

hmmmm... interesting...

So is this an irrational fear most men have that there's going to become some big database in the sky logging how big our junk really is that anyone can just google and find out?

[ManagingPrime 0]

If these security measures are to keep use safe from terrorists, when will we be safe?

Let's say the terrorists adapt their techniques (they will) and are still able to get devices on planes.....

Perhaps we should all be wired up on flights to detect heart rate, breathing, etc. We should also be under constant video survelience on the flight and wear stun belts...that way if it looks like someone might act in a threatening manner they can be temporarily disabled (in less than letal way of course).

I think the irational fear is efforts designed to deliver "peace and security" we will find our selves striped of privacy, liberty and other valuable freedoms....and still have no peace and security.

BUT...I agree. Most men are just affraid that the world will find out they are not hung nearly as large as they say they are online.

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

The issue boils down to security vs. privacy/liberty.

The issue boils down to the illusion of security and more budget/money for certain government agencies/private companies vs. privacy/liberty.

Terrorists willing to die for their cause should not care too much about working for a while as baggage people or airline janitors until they strike.

Terrorists planning to die for their cause should not care too much about smuggling explosives in body cavities or having them surgically implanted where they won't be picked up by the scanners.

Or they could just skip the whole plane thing and detonate their explosives in the security lines (which the Israelis don't allow to form for that reason).

[ManagingPrime 0]

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... and the problem with just going through the body scanner is?

The issue boils down to security vs. privacy/liberty.

The issue boils down to the illusion of security and more budget/money for certain government agencies/private companies vs. privacy/liberty.

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Yeah...Well, I don't want to be called un-american for making statements like that.

[rehmwa 2]

Let everybody through, lock the cockpit and rig the cabin for sleepy gas.

And I like the other poster's idea of wiring up the individual seats for shock treatment. Mostly for parents with out of control kids and fat people.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

Or perhaps we should remove the terrorists from the earth to be safe?


Anyway, I hear what DSE and others are saying, but one of their twists in (what I think I hear) they're saying is fear and uncertainty that their images after going through a body scanner... which I doubt even one's mother would recognize and their name / boarding pass isn't associated with... might become public, thus "violating them", they're opting for an aggressive pat-down which they then come away from certainly feeling violated?

[kelpdiver 2]

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Anyway, I hear what DSE and others are saying, but one of their twists in (what I think I hear) they're saying is fear and uncertainty that their images after going through a body scanner... which I doubt even one's mother would recognize and their name / boarding pass isn't associated with... might become public, thus "violating them", they're opting for an aggressive pat-down which they then come away from certainly feeling violated?

The point of the pat down is to share the fun with the bastards responsible for it. It falls apart if no one wants to spend their day doing it.

What sort of job do you have? You are quick to dismiss the potential consequences, esp considering there has already been a violent incident over the problem.

[mnealtx 0]

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Or perhaps we should remove the terrorists from the earth to be safe?


Anyway, I hear what DSE and others are saying, but one of their twists in (what I think I hear) they're saying is fear and uncertainty that their images after going through a body scanner... which I doubt even one's mother would recognize and their name / boarding pass isn't associated with... might become public, thus "violating them", they're opting for an aggressive pat-down which they then come away from certainly feeling violated?

Damned if you do, damned if you don't - but you evidently hadn't heard of the 100 scanner images that were already leaked, along with the tens of thousands that were illegally stored by authorities.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

What does what sort of job I have got to do with anything?

*Confused* What potential consequences do you think I'm dismissing? What violent incident over what problem?

[Amazon 7]

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Or perhaps we should remove the terrorists from the earth to be safe?


Anyway, I hear what DSE and others are saying, but one of their twists in (what I think I hear) they're saying is fear and uncertainty that their images after going through a body scanner... which I doubt even one's mother would recognize and their name / boarding pass isn't associated with... might become public, thus "violating them", they're opting for an aggressive pat-down which they then come away from certainly feeling violated?

Hey, some people pay perfectly good money to be violated and felt up like that.... I mean whatever yanks their cranks... as long as they can beg forgiveness on Sunday morning from the pervert who is into even more shit than they are

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

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Damned if you do, damned if you don't - but you evidently hadn't heard of the 100 scanner images that were already leaked, along with the tens of thousands that were illegally stored by authorities.

Good point and those responsible should be punished justly and not that the images having been leaked reason to not use the machines.

Also, in how many of those cases of leaked images was the I.D. of the person associated with the image? OBTW, y'all understand we're talking a Radar generated image here, not a photograph.

[DSE 5]

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hmmmm... interesting...

So is this an irrational fear most men have that there's going to become some big database in the sky logging how big our junk really is that anyone can just google and find out?

Laugh all you want...
I just ordered a set of these underwear
I'm not kidding. But I ordered them mostly because I want to have fun when I travel.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Damned if you do, damned if you don't - but you evidently hadn't heard of the 100 scanner images that were already leaked, along with the tens of thousands that were illegally stored by authorities.

Good point and those responsible should be punished justly and not that the images having been leaked reason to not use the machines.

The TSA told us (lied) that these machines weren't even capable of storing images.

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Also, in how many of those cases of leaked images was the I.D. of the person associated with the image? OBTW, y'all understand we're talking a Radar generated image here, not a photograph.

The celebrities will be the first victims of disclosure. Even if you believe (not a chance) that the person in the remote room has no idea who's in the machine, the onsite guard can flag his attention. Easy money that the press will happily pay.

After that, who knows. That's why I asked what sort of work you do. For many of us, reputation does matter. And so far you have declined to provide any justification for allowing the possibility of such a privacy violation.