Who Is The Man Behind The Ground Zero Mosque?

[normiss 893]

Nunya?

[turtlespeed 226]

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I can understand how some communities feel they have moral issues with topless bars in their communities.
I can't extend that understanding to religious persecution in others.

This is a very simple issue to sort out.
The local zoning board approved it.

I do not see this as religious persecution
I do not see this as religious issue at all.

And yes, it is simple and they should not legally be stopped but

I still have my questions
Questions they refuse to answer
Why?

Becasue they want the issue perpetuated. They are aiming for civil unrest in this situation. This is by design.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[wmw999 2,587]

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Becasue they want the issue perpetuated. They are aiming for civil unrest in this situation. This is by design.

You talking about the builders of the mosque, or the protesters? Seems that the unrest only started after the protesters came in; before that, they'd been meeting there for years.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rushmc 23]

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I can understand how some communities feel they have moral issues with topless bars in their communities.
I can't extend that understanding to religious persecution in others.

This is a very simple issue to sort out.
The local zoning board approved it.

I do not see this as religious persecution
I do not see this as religious issue at all.

And yes, it is simple and they should not legally be stopped but

I still have my questions
Questions they refuse to answer
Why?

Becasue they want the issue perpetuated. They are aiming for civil unrest in this situation. This is by design.

That could be
They seem to know how to manipulate the media and the left very well

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Becasue they want the issue perpetuated. They are aiming for civil unrest in this situation. This is by design.

You talking about the builders of the mosque, or the protesters? Seems that the unrest only started after the protesters came in; before that, they'd been meeting there for years.

Wendy P.

I see your point Wendy but, meeting there and building what they want to now build, along with what has been done in the past in these situations, does raise questions

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 893]

So if my neighbor suddenly decides he wants to improve his home to suit his family growth I should suddenly fear what he's building?

It's a pretty sad building now and their "customer" base has grown to the point they need to improve the facilities.

All of the pertinent questions have been answered.
It's the fear and mistrust that makes some worry.

[rushmc 23]

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So if my neighbor suddenly decides he wants to improve his home to suit his family growth I should suddenly fear what he's building?

It's a pretty sad building now and their "customer" base has grown to the point they need to improve the facilities.

All of the pertinent questions have been answered.
It's the fear and mistrust that makes some worry.

No they have not
And you assume too much

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

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And you assume too much

Are you, perhaps, assuming too much as well?

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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And you assume too much

Are you, perhaps, assuming too much as well?

Maybe

I just have questions

And I dont assume to know what some one who posts here thinks or believes or fears

You?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 893]

Based on multiple threads here, the flood of stories, mosque burnings, khoran burnings, picketing, I'd say my assumption is pretty much dead on.

All legal questions have been answered and the local authority on the issue has indeed authorized the building so I would venture to say all questions have indeed been answered.

[DanG 1]

I'd love to know what you think, believe, or fear, but since you won't tell us, I guess I'll just have to be disappointed.

I fear that the American people have forgotten the point of our experiment in democracy. Or, perhaps, the experiement is over, and the conclusion is that a democracy cannot protect the rights of minorities.

I also think that people don't have any idea how terrorism works. The goal of terrorism is not to destroy buildings and kill people, it is to provoke a backlash in the community. They seek to change our behavior, and erode our confidence in the ideals that make us great. The only way the terrorists can effect a change in the US is if we effect the change for them. Unfortunately, we're on the path of doing exactly what they want. Bin Laden sought to draw the US into a global war with Islam, and look where we are. They can only win if we help them, and throwing out the Constituition is the best help they can hope for.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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Based on multiple threads here, the flood of stories, mosque burnings, khoran burnings, picketing, I'd say my assumption is pretty much dead on.

All legal questions have been answered and the local authority on the issue has indeed authorized the building so I would venture to say all questions have indeed been answered.

I have never been talking about the legality of the right to build it

My question is, is it proper

Many things are legal but people dont do them just because

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 893]

If I want to build something and the local boards approve it, why the hell should I even begin to care or worry about some housewife in Kansas telling me otherwise???
(No offense to Kansas )
This is a local issue. The locals say it's ok.

[rushmc 23]

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If I want to build something and the local boards approve it, why the hell should I even begin to care or worry about some housewife in Kansas telling me otherwise???
(No offense to Kansas )
This is a local issue. The locals say it's ok.

You wouldnt
But if everybody is pissed and you have other good options why would you not want to consider them?

I dont get it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

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Based on multiple threads here, the flood of stories, mosque burnings, khoran burnings, picketing, I'd say my assumption is pretty much dead on.

All legal questions have been answered and the local authority on the issue has indeed authorized the building so I would venture to say all questions have indeed been answered.

I have never been talking about the legality of the right to build it

My question is, is it proper

Many things are legal but people dont do them just because

How about flipping the question around?

It was already there.
It is a couple blocks away from the WTC site (which is pretty far in Manhattan terms).

Is it proper to deny it?

DanG's post above says "not" pretty eloquently.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[wmw999 2,587]

Everybody isn't pissed. Some people are pissed. The people who started the pissed-off-ness have the de-Islamification of the US as their stated goal. If I were a mosque committee, I'd probably disregard their opinion.

There are lots of jumpers who don't let their parents' opinions stop them from jumping.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rushmc 23]

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I'd love to know what you think, believe, or fear, but since you won't tell us, I guess I'll just have to be disappointed.

I fear that the American people have forgotten the point of our experiment in democracy. Or, perhaps, the experiement is over, and the conclusion is that a democracy cannot protect the rights of minorities.

I also think that people don't have any idea how terrorism works. The goal of terrorism is not to destroy buildings and kill people, it is to provoke a backlash in the community. They seek to change our behavior, and erode our confidence in the ideals that make us great. The only way the terrorists can effect a change in the US is if we effect the change for them. Unfortunately, we're on the path of doing exactly what they want. Bin Laden sought to draw the US into a global war with Islam, and look where we are. They can only win if we help them, and throwing out the Constituition is the best help they can hope for.

I dont think they have forgotten as much as others want to modify it to fit their beliefs

We are not throwing out the constitution in this debate. We are supporting it by allowing the discourse

And the other stuff you posted is unrelated to this thread
Not a time to go off topic

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Everybody isn't pissed. Some people are pissed. The people who started the pissed-off-ness have the de-Islamification of the US as their stated goal. If I were a mosque committee, I'd probably disregard their opinion.

There are lots of jumpers who don't let their parents' opinions stop them from jumping.

Wendy P.

You raise another point that needs addressed here
Just because I wounder about this as do others, this in and of itself does not make anyone any of the things you post here. Doing so it an attempt to lable and shut people up

It is just as bad as those who say if you disagree with Obama you are a racist

Sorry, they both are bs

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jakee 1,594]

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It is just as bad as those who say if you disagree with Obama you are a racists

Who is it that says this?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[DanG 1]

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I dont think they have forgotten as much as others want to modify it to fit their beliefs

Can you elaborate? I think I was fairly clear, but I don't know what you're trying to say.

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We are not throwing out the constitution in this debate. We are supporting it by allowing the discourse

You're right, the debate is great. The fact that we need to have the debate at all is what troubles me. If the only objection were that the site is insensitive, and the debate was about how the mosque builders should proceed, then I think the debate would be warranted. However, there are a lot of people who are arguing that the mosque should not be allowed. You, yourself, keep bringing up questions of funding and intent. You are not just debating about the sensitivity of the site, you are making (very fuzzy) arguments about the right to build the mosque at all.

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And the other stuff you posted is unrelated to this thread

The fact that you think it is unrelated is the problem. It is wholly and completely related.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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I dont think they have forgotten as much as others want to modify it to fit their beliefs

Can you elaborate? I think I was fairly clear, but I don't know what you're trying to say.

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We are not throwing out the constitution in this debate. We are supporting it by allowing the discourse

You're right, the debate is great. The fact that we need to have the debate at all is what troubles me. If the only objection were that the site is insensitive, and the debate was about how the mosque builders should proceed, then I think the debate would be warranted. However, there are a lot of people who are arguing that the mosque should not be allowed. You, yourself, keep bringing up questions of funding and intent. You are not just debating about the sensitivity of the site, you are making (very fuzzy) arguments about the right to build the mosque at all.

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And the other stuff you posted is unrelated to this thread

The fact that you think it is unrelated is the problem. It is wholly and completely related.

We were in a global war with Bin Lauden and his type long before 9/11. Many just fail to admit it.

I am sorry allowing the debate is troubling to you. I wonder who should be silenced next.

I have questions about building it where they want to. I have a right here (at lesat so far) to voice those questions. But I take from you post that I should not be allowed to? (just asking)

I have stated and will state again
They have the legal right to build there. No law should stop them.

I however, questing why they want to build there. Doesnt make sense in that setting. And if it is really to be a center to bring people together why would you want to start out like this?

Does not make sense to me

Thats all I am saying

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

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I am sorry allowing the debate is troubling to you. I wonder who should be silenced next.

I have questions about building it where they want to. I have a right here (at lesat so far) to voice those questions. But I take from you post that I should not be allowed to? (just asking)

Um, no. Try reading what I wrote. I think having the debate is fine, great even, and no one should be silenced. I just think that if people truly believed in the Constitution, no one would be debating their right to build the mosque wherever they wanted. Some people, apparently not you, are saying that they should not be allowed to build their mosque two blocks from Ground Zero.

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I have stated and will state again
They have the legal right to build there. No law should stop them.

Good, then we agree.

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I however, questing why they want to build there. Doesnt make sense in that setting. And if it is really to be a center to bring people together why would you want to start out like this?

Those questions are fine. I personally think they have been answered over and over again, and most likely can never be answered to everyone's satisfaction.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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I am sorry allowing the debate is troubling to you. I wonder who should be silenced next.

I have questions about building it where they want to. I have a right here (at lesat so far) to voice those questions. But I take from you post that I should not be allowed to? (just asking)

Um, no. Try reading what I wrote. I think having the debate is fine, great even, and no one should be silenced. I just think that if people truly believed in the Constitution, no one would be debating their right to build the mosque wherever they wanted. Some people, apparently not you, are saying that they should not be allowed to build their mosque two blocks from Ground Zero.

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I have stated and will state again
They have the legal right to build there. No law should stop them.

Good, then we agree.

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I however, questing why they want to build there. Doesnt make sense in that setting. And if it is really to be a center to bring people together why would you want to start out like this?

Those questions are fine. I personally think they have been answered over and over again, and most likely can never be answered to everyone's satisfaction.

They refuse to talk about these questions so how can they have been answered?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 893]

Bin Laden isn't building this mosque.
They have been on this site for many years now, why didn't you complain years ago when they first started worshiping there?
Makes plenty of sense to me. An established house of worship in place for many years and in need of expansion. Why would they NOT improve the existing location?

[DanG 1]

You said you questioned why they want to build at that location. I'm pretty sure that has been answered.

There are some potentially legitimate questions about funding, but the siting issue has been discussed at length.

- Dan G