Professor fights for right to sex with coeds

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And the thing about "if one of them decides to be a dick about it" . . . that's just going to happen eventually so you might as well pay attention to the sexual harassment aspect of it from the very beginning and just not do it.

I don't think it's true that "that's just going to happen eventually." I would bet that a lot of these relationships go on and we never hear about them because no problem arises.

But it's a pretty broad topic. On one end, you've got a student taking a night class at a community college just for the hell of it, and on the other end you've got a student in a very prestigious and competitive graduate program. Obviously, one situation is going to be more of a problem than the other.

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who are both consenting adults.

So if I tell my admin assistant that she has to have sex with me, or else lose her job, I'm good, right? I mean, we're both consenting adults...

How about if I tell her that her work load will be lighter?

Or how about that i would really appreciate it, hint hint?

Or that I say that she should be promoted because she is very good at what she does?

After all, we're both consenting adults...

Same thing for prof/students. Way too easy to abuse power. And yes, it is addressed in federal law.

Sorry Keely, but it's not just a case of consenting adults.

Perhaps "consenting" was not the right word. What I meant was without harrassment involved.

(Though I think you're stretching the meaning of the word. I mean, if a woman _lets_ you have sex with her because you've got a gun pointed at her head, I suppose you could technically call that sex between two consenting adults.)

[quade 4]

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But it's a pretty broad topic. On one end, you've got a student taking a night class at a community college just for the hell of it, and on the other end you've got a student in a very prestigious and competitive graduate program. Obviously, one situation is going to be more of a problem than the other.

It's "one size fits all" legislation, but it's always seemed to me that it protects the instructor as much, if not more than, the student. It let's them know right up front it's illegal and not something to be messed with.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Remster 30]

My point is that with positions of authority, the line between coerced and freewill becomes hard to draw.

But then, some people like to get coerced...

Remster

[Bolas 5]

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I mean, if a woman _lets_ you have sex with her because you've got a gun pointed at her head,

I knew you were kinky, but...

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

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My point is that with positions of authority, the line between coerced and freewill becomes hard to draw.

True. And I agree that it's a situation best avoided.

(But man, that one professor... If he hadn't been married... )

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But then, some people like to get coerced...

Must you really make everything all about you???

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I mean, if a woman _lets_ you have sex with her because you've got a gun pointed at her head,

I knew you were kinky, but...

Hey, how do you think I got my nickname?

j/k

[quade 4]

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Perhaps "consenting" was not the right word. What I meant was without harrassment involved.

I don't want you to take this the wrong way, but I think you may only think this because you're a woman. Please don't take offense as none is intended. It is merely a statement about an experience you have not nor could you ever actually live.

Unless you've been a man working in "modern society" (corporate, government) I don't think you can really know what it's like in terms of the fine line that must be walked when dealing with females. Oh, you -may- have sat in on one or two mandatory "sexual harassment" courses, but you really haven't lived it.

Over the course of my lifetime, things have changed drastically. Watch films from the '60s or early '70s.

How to Murder Your Wife
The Apartment
The Taking of Pelham 123

And see how "carefree" people were in expressing their opinions about men and their relationships to women or women's capabilities. Can you imagine even suggesting a film with the title "How to MURDER Your Wife" today? What kind of shit storm that would cause? Forget the fact it's a comedy. Just the name alone would create an uproar.

Virtually everything that is done by men in professional circles when dealing with women has to take into consideration the occasional crazy that is going to cause trouble. Everything. Just saying "Hi" can have ramifications if the person on the receiving end is crazy enough -- and that's the thing, ya never know.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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Perhaps "consenting" was not the right word. What I meant was without harrassment involved.

I don't want you to take this the wrong way, but I think you may only think this because you're a woman. . . .

I see what you're saying, and you're probably right that I can't completely understand what it's like for men.

But I think it's more that I am looking at it from a very particular perspective - someone who has had a fairly casual experience at school. I have only been through community college, and mostly at an age where I was around the same age as many of the professors. I usually addressed them by their first names, and I didn't have a sense of them having power over me. (I felt that _I_ detemined my grades, not them.)

Anyhow, that being said, if I had wanted to have a relationship with one of the professors, I probably would have waited until I was no longer in his class. Partially to avoid any complications as you have mentioned, but also because of the other students. (In one class, I had several other students suggest that I was doing well because the professor "liked" me. I'm guessing an actual relationship, if not hidden well, would cause worse accusations.)

[Bolas 5]

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Any unbalance of power in a sexual relationship, whether teacher/student, boss/employee (usually a secretary), cop/woman motorist, Senator/page, etc. is a likely breach of ethics and possibly illegal.

Or to put it another way, if it's a sex fantasy, it's probably wrong.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[kallend 2,184]

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There is a Federal law about sexual harrasment;
http://www.dol.gov/oasam/regs/statutes/titleix.htm

California has a law that is similar law specifically aimed at grades 12 and under;
http://law.justia.com/california/codes/edc/221.5-231.5.html

I don't think either of these would apply if we're talking about a college student and professor who are both consenting adults. (Well, the sexual harrassment thing could apply if one of them decides to be a dick about it.)

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Many schools as well as companies have rules against people in positions of authority having sexual relations with those under their responsibility.

This is what I was thinking, that it's a school policy thing rather than the government legislating morality. I can understand that it might be in the school's best interest to try and prevent questionable situations from arising.

It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

Does it apply to any student at your school? Or does it only apply to your students?

[kallend 2,184]

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It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

Does it apply to any student at your school? Or does it only apply to your students?

Any situation covered by the following:

" determining admission to an institution of higher education, courses, fields of study, or programs, including honors and graduate programs; educational performance requirements or expectations; attendance or assignment requirements; placement or course proficiency requirements; quality of instruction; tuition or fee requirements; scholarship opportunities; membership on extracurricular teams or participation in extracurricular competitions; grades in any examination or in any course or program of instruction; progress toward successful completion of or graduation from any course or program of instruction; or what degree, if any, the student will receive. For purposes of this definition, higher education representative means any administrator, a member of the faculty, or anyone else providing instruction, including graduate assistants."

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Bolas 5]

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It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

If it's explicitly forbidden why is it that long a section?

This is the problem with incredibly long laws, regulations, bills, etc. Not only are they extremely difficult to read, comprehend, and interpret, the message and intent lots of times gets lost. Specifying every criteria allows loopholes in new situations versus simply using direct statements. Additionally, the longer it is the easier to slide additional items in for some group's special interest.

Clear, conicse, and to the point eliminates gray areas and loopholes.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[tbrown 26]

Aside from being a coercive power trip, keeping it forbidden makes it more dangerous, and therefore even hotter !

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

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Any situation covered by the following:

" determining admission to an institution of higher education, courses, fields of study, or programs, including honors and graduate programs; educational performance requirements or expectations; attendance or assignment requirements; placement or course proficiency requirements; quality of instruction; tuition or fee requirements; scholarship opportunities; membership on extracurricular teams or participation in extracurricular competitions; grades in any examination or in any course or program of instruction; progress toward successful completion of or graduation from any course or program of instruction; or what degree, if any, the student will receive. For purposes of this definition, higher education representative means any administrator, a member of the faculty, or anyone else providing instruction, including graduate assistants."

That sounds reasonable.

[kallend 2,184]

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It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

If it's explicitly forbidden why is it that long a section?

Because I didn't write it.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[jakee 1,611]

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It's explicitly forbidden at our school - the section of the faculty handbook on sexual harrassment is longer than the US Constitution.

If it's explicitly forbidden why is it that long a section?

Well, one reason may be that sexual harrassment covers a wider range of behaviour than just having sex with someone...

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

WTF does this have to do with anything?

Assuming the coeds are of legal age and we're not talking rape here, if they boink their Professor(s), poor decision or otherwise, why the fuck should one care!!!???


This poll has nothing to do with skydiving, guns or boobies... a waste of Internet bandwidth!

[kallend 2,184]

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WTF does this have to do with anything?

It's an obvious dig (he denies it, of course, but it IS obvious).

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Assuming the coeds are of legal age and we're not talking rape here, if they boink their Professor(s), poor decision or otherwise, why the fuck should one care!!!???


This poll has nothing to do with skydiving, guns or boobies... a waste of Internet bandwidth!

The schools care because if the relationship goes sour and the student then cries "Harrassment" the school gets involved in the inevitable lawsuit.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rushmc 23]

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WTF does this have to do with anything?

It's an obvious dig (he denies it, of course, but it IS obvious).

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Assuming the coeds are of legal age and we're not talking rape here, if they boink their Professor(s), poor decision or otherwise, why the fuck should one care!!!???


This poll has nothing to do with skydiving, guns or boobies... a waste of Internet bandwidth!

The schools care because if the relationship goes sour and the student then cries "Harrassment" the school gets involved in the inevitable lawsuit.

Your profession is full of sick people who think they know best about the second and first amendments as long as they don't have to live under the rules they would would impose.

i think a registry like sex offenders is needed for professors.

Gotta group all these sick ones together

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[christelsabine 1]

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....
i think a registry like sex offenders is needed for professors.

Gotta group all these sick ones together

Oh man. That's new low level, even for you.

Are you jalous of folks with literacy? Feeling inferior, somehow?

Jesus Christ. SC has reached a new low.

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[rushmc 23]

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....
i think a registry like sex offenders is needed for professors.

Gotta group all these sick ones together

Oh man. That's new low level, even for you.

Are you jalous of folks with literacy? Feeling inferior, somehow?

Jesus Christ. SC has reached a new low.

As you seem to be defending professors, I feel you should be placed on the same registry

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

These sick ass professors do not agree with the second amendment either

See this.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/07/16/students-alumni-rally-u-illinois-professor-fired-expressing-catholic-beliefs/?test=latestnews

we gotta know who there depraved bastards are

A professors registry is required
Some one, make a law

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jakee 1,611]

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Your profession is full of sick people who think they know best about the second and first amendments as long as they don't have to live under the rules they would would impose.

I had no idea that engineers were such a cohesive political group.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?