Obama and Immigration

[airdvr 210]

Just when I thought I'd heard as much bullshit as I was going to hear from this administration we get this load of crap called immigration reform.

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Obama dismissed the focus on a "border security first" approach, saying the system is too big to be fixed "only with fences and border patrols."

That sounds all too familiar to 'too big to fail'. It's not too big. In fact, it's pretty simple. Take away the motivation to be an illegal in the US and they will run back to Mexico.

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The scientific breakthroughs of Albert Einstein, the inventions of Nikola Tesla, the great ventures of Andrew Carnegie’s U.S. Steel and Sergey Brin’s Google, Inc. -– all this was possible because of immigrants.

Legal immigrants both.

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It’s been inscribed on our nation’s seal since we declared our independence. “E pluribus unum.” Out of many, one. That is what has drawn the persecuted and impoverished to our shores. That’s what led the innovators and risk-takers from around the world to take a chance here in the land of opportunity. That’s what has led people to endure untold hardships to reach this place called America.

'Out of many, one' isn't what we're talking about now. More like Out of Many, Many More. E Pluribus Unum means you come here and assimilate into our country and prosper. I don't see these folks doing either of those things.

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It was at this time that a young woman named Emma Lazarus, whose own family fled persecution from Europe generations earlier, took up the cause of these new immigrants. Although she was a poet, she spent much of her time advocating for better health care and housing for the newcomers. And inspired by what she saw and heard, she wrote down her thoughts and donated a piece of work to help pay for the construction of a new statue — the Statue of Liberty — which actually was funded in part by small donations from people across America.
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2010/07/01/transcript-of-obamas-immigration-speech/

The island and the place to mount the statue maybe, but not the statue. Another attempt at a re-write of history.

Bottom line for me, fix the immigration problem by enforcing the existing laws. If you go with some sort of amnesty program you'll be encouraging those who haven't entered illegally that there is a benefit in doing so.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Southern_Man 0]

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It’s been inscribed on our nation’s seal since we declared our independence. “E pluribus unum.” Out of many, one. That is what has drawn the persecuted and impoverished to our shores. That’s what led the innovators and risk-takers from around the world to take a chance here in the land of opportunity. That’s what has led people to endure untold hardships to reach this place called America.

'Out of many, one' isn't what we're talking about now. More like Out of Many, Many More. E Pluribus Unum means you come here and assimilate into our country and prosper. I don't see these folks doing either of those things.

I believe you are both wrong. I believe E Pluribus Unum was talking about making a nation out of the colonies/states. No reference to individuals or ethnicities at all.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[jakee 1,599]

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Obama dismissed the focus on a "border security first" approach, saying the system is too big to be fixed "only with fences and border patrols."

That sounds all too familiar to 'too big to fail'. It's not too big. In fact, it's pretty simple. Take away the motivation to be an illegal in the US and they will run back to Mexico.

You realise that what you just said means you agree with him, right (or at least, you don't disagree with what you think you disagree with)?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Amazon 7]

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Obama dismissed the focus on a "border security first" approach, saying the system is too big to be fixed "only with fences and border patrols."

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That sounds all too familiar to 'too big to fail'. It's not too big. In fact, it's pretty simple. Take away the motivation to be an illegal in the US and they will run back to Mexico.

No what that sounds like is someone not willing to spend billions in boondoggle dollars thta would not solve the problem.

If you were going to use that approach you would need to be moving a whole lot of people from near the border. For a truly secure border region you need to have only the most trusted residents within a few miles of your side of the border. Next you would have to have the fence and have a sufficient kill zone with sensors and mines and regularly spaced guard towers and patrols. Security in depth requires a lot of manpower to maintain.

I think they tried something like that in Europe... it was called the IRON CURTAIN...and I hear the North Koreans have similar border controls.

Or you could just remove the financial incentive for them to come here... with comprehensive reform and real penalties for the people who hire illegals.

[airdvr 210]

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Obama dismissed the focus on a "border security first" approach, saying the system is too big to be fixed "only with fences and border patrols."

That sounds all too familiar to 'too big to fail'. It's not too big. In fact, it's pretty simple. Take away the motivation to be an illegal in the US and they will run back to Mexico.

You realise that what you just said means you agree with him, right (or at least, you don't disagree with what you think you disagree with)?

I agree with the first part of his blather, but that's just condiments for the big hot dog...amnesty.

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Finally, we have to demand responsibility from people living here illegally. They must be required to admit that they broke the law. They should be required to register, pay their taxes, pay a fine, and learn English. They must get right with the law before they can get in line and earn their citizenship — not just because it is fair, not just because it will make clear to those who might wish to come to America they must do so inside the bounds of the law, but because this is how we demonstrate that being — what being an American means. Being a citizen of this country comes not only with rights but also with certain fundamental responsibilities. We can create a pathway for legal status that is fair, reflective of our values, and works.

None of this means a rats ass unless you secure the border. Until then, this will only make things worse (which seems to be the role of government).

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[airdvr 210]

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They must be required to admit that they broke the law.

What if they don't?

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They should be required to register,

How will we know if they did?

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pay their taxes,

How will that be decided?

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pay a fine,

How much? Who's going to enforce it?

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and learn English.

This one is laughable. No lib has ever agreed learning english should be required of anyone.

SO I'm to believe that we can't find these folks and deport them but we can get them to do all of the things mentioned above? Please.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Lucky... 0]

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I agree with the first part of his blather, but that's just condiments for the big hot dog...amnesty.

When are you guys gonna pick a side of the fence and build a house on it?

- Reagan = hero

- Amnesty = bad

- Obama = amnesty


Seriously, figure yourselves out.

NOTE: In case you didn't get it, Reagan's 1986 amnesty to all illegal Mexicans creates such a massive hypocrisy that even you guys can't escape it with BS.

[Lucky... 0]

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This one is laughable. No lib has ever agreed learning english should be required of anyone.

When I see people constantly use absolutes, I realize they are just of out of constructive arguments and use these to create emotion.

I'm a lib and I think immigrants should learn conversational English.

[Andy9o8 2]

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I think immigrants conservatives should learn conversational English.

fixie.

[airdvr 210]

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This one is laughable. No lib has ever agreed learning english should be required of anyone.

When I see people constantly use absolutes, I realize they are just of out of constructive arguments and use these to create emotion.

I'm a lib and I think immigrants should learn conversational English.

\
Should or must? Why would any immigrant from south of the border learn english when everywhere you go they cater to spanish for them?

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[ChangoLanzao 0]

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This one is laughable. No lib has ever agreed learning english should be required of anyone.

When I see people constantly use absolutes, I realize they are just of out of constructive arguments and use these to create emotion.

I'm a lib and I think immigrants should learn conversational English.

\
Should or must? Why would any immigrant from south of the border learn english when everywhere you go they cater to spanish for them?

So that they can understand all of the nonsense you're saying about them while you think they aren't listening

[airdvr 210]

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I agree with the first part of his blather, but that's just condiments for the big hot dog...amnesty.

When are you guys gonna pick a side of the fence and build a house on it?

- Reagan = hero

- Amnesty = bad

- Obama = amnesty


Seriously, figure yourselves out.

NOTE: In case you didn't get it, Reagan's 1986 amnesty to all illegal Mexicans creates such a massive hypocrisy that even you guys can't escape it with BS.

Show me where I said Reagan's plan was a good idea, or Bush's 2006 plan that mirrors Obama's. Reagan's plan is prolly why we have the problem we have now.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Lucky... 0]

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I think immigrants conservatives should learn conversational English.

fixie.

[Lucky... 0]

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This one is laughable. No lib has ever agreed learning english should be required of anyone.

When I see people constantly use absolutes, I realize they are just of out of constructive arguments and use these to create emotion.

I'm a lib and I think immigrants should learn conversational English.

\
Should or must? Why would any immigrant from south of the border learn english when everywhere you go they cater to spanish for them?

I think there needs to a comprehensive immigration program that requires a basic level of English reading/writing and speaking. There, ya feel better?

[Lucky... 0]

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I agree with the first part of his blather, but that's just condiments for the big hot dog...amnesty.

When are you guys gonna pick a side of the fence and build a house on it?

- Reagan = hero

- Amnesty = bad

- Obama = amnesty


Seriously, figure yourselves out.

NOTE: In case you didn't get it, Reagan's 1986 amnesty to all illegal Mexicans creates such a massive hypocrisy that even you guys can't escape it with BS.

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Show me where I said Reagan's plan was a good idea,...

Plan? As in the amnesty plan? You're not getting it, you guys call Reagan a hero, yet ignore some of his dirty deeds (deeds that would be dirty to you that is) like the 1986 Immigration Amnesty Bill. Of course you also ignore real dirty deeds like the pardoning of Yankee owner Steinbrenner for tax evasion.

Point is, IF YOU DESPISE IMMIGRATION AMNESTY TO THE BONE, THE START VILLIFYING REAGAN AND QUIT BEING PHONY.

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...or Bush's 2006 plan that mirrors Obama's.

I don't think we've seen Obama's plan, so quit guessing.

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Reagan's plan is prolly why we have the problem we have now.

Naw, the "problem" was long before Reagan and will live long after we're all dead.

Fools that think we can actually stop illegal immigration in a country fo our size also think we can stop M.E. terrorism. These are issues that can't be stopped but only semi-controleld at best.

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[rushmc 23]

Not fixing anything soon it seems

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/jul/14/justice-sanctuary-cities-are-no-arizona/

http://www.boston.com/news/local/rhode_island/articles/2010/07/13/ice_director_states_shouldnt_follow_arizona_lead/

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[masterrig 1]

So that they can understand all of the nonsense you're saying about them while you think they aren't listening

Ding, ding, ding... We have a winner!


Chuck

[DaVinci 0]

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Plan? As in the amnesty plan? You're not getting it, you guys call Reagan a hero, yet ignore some of his dirty deeds (deeds that would be dirty to you that is) like the 1986 Immigration Amnesty Bill. Of course you also ignore real dirty deeds like the pardoning of Yankee owner Steinbrenner for tax evasion.

Point is, IF YOU DESPISE IMMIGRATION AMNESTY TO THE BONE, THE START VILLIFYING REAGAN AND QUIT BEING PHONY.

What is it about you guys and liking folks that commit perjury? Clinton lied under oath.

Point is, IF YOU CLAIM TO HAVE ANY FAITH IN POLITICIANS... MAYBE YOU SHOULD VILIFY CLINTON FOR LYING UNDER OATH!!!!

Or, you could say that while you might disagree with Clinton on that one issue, that you still think he was a good President..... Just like people can disagree with Reagan on that issue and still think he was a good President.

But that MAY not fit into your black and white views. But still.... then you of all people should hate Clinton for lying under oath.... you almost being a real lawyer and all that.