so...how long before gen. mcchrystal retires, writes a book, and becomes a fox news contributor?

[wmw999 2,589]

He's put Petraeus in charge now; he and McChrystal are on the same page for most stuff. It wasn't because of the tactics, it was because of his lack of control of his personnel.

There are times when you just don't mouth off to the boss.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[MajorDad 0]

I'd put money on Petraeus becoming Chairman of the Joint Chiefs next year after the incumbents term is up.

Blue Ones,

Major Dad
CSPA D-579

[rehmwa 2]

I'll look, but can anyone post the actual text of the article?

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,589]

Here is a link to it.

Sounds like lots of workplaces where people smart off to each other and express their unvarnished and not-always-flattering opinion. The reporter might have taken some out of context. Regardless, it's not what gets shown to the outside world -- that's why you have press training for people who might talk to the press.

They work for the Army, and the Army works for the US. They can, as individuals, give their opinions to other individuals. But once they do that to national publications they reall need to put the company hat back on. Because if they believe in the organization, it's better to fix it from the inside than it is to destroy it. And the Army's purpose is to defend the USA, NOT to preserve the Army.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[TrophyHusband 0]

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what could obama have done

he could listen to someone that has a clue because he clearly does not.

reguarding what? the war strategy? that's a separate issue.

the issue here is that a general publicly talked shit about his commander in chief. that is a big problem and a violation of the ucmj. obama had no choice but to remove mcchrystal and he did so in the best way possible. i have a feeling that no matter what obama did with reguard to this situation, you would have a problem with it.

"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com

[Zep 0]

Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

Gone fishing

[Skyrad 0]

The General's actions were unprofessional and unacceptable. That said, sacking him was a massive mistake by Obama who seems to have let his ego get in front of what is best for his country (I usually support Obama) he should have bollocked him, got a public appology and moved on with the best man for the job in Afghanistan still in the job.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[okalb 104]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

Actually, yes. I have thought about that quite a bit. Given that the man has spent the better part of his life as a strategist, I find it hard to believe that he didn't know exactly what he was doing. Just not sure exactly what his endgame is. Although now he has become a household name, so there are lots of options for him.

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[metalslug 36]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

I'm with quade on this one, from his reply in a related thread on this topic:

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Not that I'm making excuses for him, but how about this . . . he was talking to a reporter from Rolling Stone and didn't take the interview seriously enough.

I seriously doubt he would have said those things to ABC, CBS, NBC or even Fox, but he saw a hippie stoner reporter from a rock-n-roll rag and didn't think twice about it.

It's funny too because I just said earlier today elsewhere that character is what you are in the dark. He didn't think anybody of any importance was watching and let his true self be heard. That same sort of mistake has cost quite a few people more than just their jobs over the years.

[Skyrad 0]

I disagree, McChrystal is one of the most calculating generals in the US Army. His intellect is superb and as a stratergist he is up there with some of the best in history. I can't believe that this wasn't a deliberate act. Not sure why he did it but I have little doubt that he knew exactly what he was doing and thought it through before opening his mouth.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[rehmwa 2]

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I disagree, McChrystal is one of the most calculating generals in the US Army. His intellect is superb and as a stratergist he is up there with some of the best in history. I can't believe that this wasn't a deliberate act. Not sure why he did it but I have little doubt that he knew exactly what he was doing and thought it through before opening his mouth.

we'll find out one way on another soon now that he's cut loose and free to do what he thinks he needs to

in the meantime - GWObama's team now loves Bush's general - into year ten of the same administration

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rhaig 0]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

yes. I figure he didn't want the job anymore and to quietly retire wouldn't make him any publicity for his speaking engagements.

--
Rob

[Rstanley0312 1]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

yes. I figure he didn't want the job anymore and to quietly retire wouldn't make him any publicity for his speaking engagements.

The guy is more left than right on politics so a Fox News guy? I don't think so. I think with McChrystal gone and General P in charge Obama has some more problems bc he is all about offense and I doubt the rules of engagement set forth by the adminsitration will sit well with General P.

I think McChrystal knew exactly what he was doing.

Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

[Andy9o8 2]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

yes. I figure he didn't want the job anymore and to quietly retire wouldn't make him any publicity for his speaking engagements.

The guy is more left than right on politics so a Fox News guy? I don't think so. I think with McChrystal gone and General P in charge Obama has some more problems bc he is all about offense and I doubt the rules of engagement set forth by the adminsitration will sit well with General P.

I think McChrystal knew exactly what he was doing.

I, for one, do not believe for a minute that McChrystal deliberately orchestrated the public self-sabotage of his his stellar military career for the purpose of his own financial gain, or for that matter, any other reason. And I think the onus is on you to make a clear persuasive case that he did, not on me to make out a case that he did not.

[rehmwa 2]

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for the purpose of his own financial gain

I don't believe that part either.

time will tell why he did it -

I suspect it's one of two things:

1 - on purpose in order to do something he feels is important or:
2 - he screwed up by not treating this interview like he would treat an interview from a "real" news agency

I'm leaning towards 2, but really we'll find out soon enough.

If it's 1, then this won't be the first vocal retirement.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Rstanley0312 1]

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Any one contemplated the idea that he knew exactly what he was doing,

yes. I figure he didn't want the job anymore and to quietly retire wouldn't make him any publicity for his speaking engagements.

The guy is more left than right on politics so a Fox News guy? I don't think so. I think with McChrystal gone and General P in charge Obama has some more problems bc he is all about offense and I doubt the rules of engagement set forth by the adminsitration will sit well with General P.

I think McChrystal knew exactly what he was doing.

I, for one, do not believe for a minute that McChrystal deliberately orchestrated the public self-sabotage of his his stellar military career for the purpose of his own financial gain. And I think the onus is on you to make a clear persuasive case that he did, not on me to make out a case that he did not.

Andy I do not think I have any obligation to prove anything to you or persuade you in any way! Why would I? Ask yourself this though..... why would a very intelligent general that specializes in strategy let a Rolling Stones reporter which anyone would know would be out to get the military or its leadership in any way get so close not once but twice? Add that to the fact that the general was NOT happy with what the administration had been doing especially with not giving the general what he wanted. How else could he get out? Quit? Not an option for this guy......

Just my opinion and if you don't believe it that's fine.

I also do not believe it had anything to do with financial gain!

Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

[rehmwa 2]

why do either of you have to prove anything -

it'll all play out over the next couple months and will likely be public

nothing to prove - just wait and watch

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Andy9o8 2]

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Andy I do not think I have any obligation to prove anything to you or persuade you in any way! Why would I?

I wasn't really referring to your or my obligations (or lack) to each other; I was referring more to the concepts of burden of proof or persuasion in the areas of rhetoric, logic and debate. Generally speaking, the proponent of a proposition has the initial burden of proof or persuasion of that proposition; only after he fulfills that burden does the burden shift to the opponent of the proposition to offer a persuasive rebuttal.

This is the sort of thing that Bolas wouldn't understand because he didn't go to college.

[rehmwa 2]

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This is the sort of thing that Bolas wouldn't understand because he didn't go to college.

You mean "didn't ATTEND college"

I believe he hangs out at campuses frequently.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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for the purpose of his own financial gain

I don't believe that part either.

time will tell why he did it -

I suspect it's one of two things:

1 - on purpose in order to do something he feels is important or:
2 - he screwed up by not treating this interview like he would treat an interview from a "real" news agency

I'm leaning towards 2, but really we'll find out soon enough.

If it's 1, then this won't be the first vocal retirement.

I think there is a distinct third option:

This guy, whom most can agree is quite brilliant, is used to winning and getting what he wants, or at least finding himself in a fight with a fair chance.

Now he finds himself placed in what probably is a no-win situation. He may have thought this was the best way out...

[Andy9o8 2]

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for the purpose of his own financial gain

I don't believe that part either.

time will tell why he did it -

I suspect it's one of two things:

1 - on purpose in order to do something he feels is important or:
2 - he screwed up by not treating this interview like he would treat an interview from a "real" news agency

I'm leaning towards 2, but really we'll find out soon enough.

If it's 1, then this won't be the first vocal retirement.

I think there is a distinct third option:

This guy, whom most can agree is quite brilliant, is used to winning and getting what he wants, or at least finding himself in a fight with a fair chance.

Now he finds himself placed in what probably is a no-win situation. He may have thought this was the best way out...

Again, I don't think so, because the means by which he went out was by public disgrace due to conduct unbecoming an officer (and possibly in violation of the UCMJ). Douglas MacArthur was possibly the most brilliant general officer the US military has ever produced; he was absolutely convinced he was right and Truman was wrong; he never really believed that Truman would have the guts to fire him; and even though he came home to public adulation and hero-worship, he remained galled by the fact of his firing for the rest of his life.

[rhaig 0]

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I, for one, do not believe for a minute that McChrystal deliberately orchestrated the public self-sabotage of his his stellar military career for the purpose of his own financial gain, or for that matter, any other reason. And I think the onus is on you to make a clear persuasive case that he did, not on me to make out a case that he did not.

I don't see why the onus is on me. Maybe if I were trying to change anyone's mind, but I'm not. I stated my opinion, you disagree. OK. fine. I don't give a shit.

--
Rob

[rehmwa 2]

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I don't see why the onus is on me. Maybe if I were trying to change anyone's mind, but I'm not. I stated my opinion, you disagree. OK. fine. I don't give a shit.

I have no issues as long as you guys stop using the term "onus"

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Zep 0]

As all have said Mccrystal is a brilliant stratagist, his choice of magazine may have been a strategy
maybe he was looking for a certain section of the public to air his views.
( just to satisfy my curiosity I did a search on the typical profile of a Rolling stone reader, quite interesting)
The leak could of been some thing he did'nt bargain for.

Just a thought.

Gone fishing

[Andy9o8 2]

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I, for one, do not believe for a minute that McChrystal deliberately orchestrated the public self-sabotage of his his stellar military career for the purpose of his own financial gain, or for that matter, any other reason. And I think the onus is on you to make a clear persuasive case that he did, not on me to make out a case that he did not.

I don't see why the onus is on me. Maybe if I were trying to change anyone's mind, but I'm not. I stated my opinion, you disagree. OK. fine. I don't give a shit.

Relax, and don't get so butt-hurt. I just answered that exact point to Rstanley in post #68:

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I wasn't really referring to your or my obligations (or lack) to each other; I was referring more to the concepts of burden of proof or persuasion in the areas of rhetoric, logic and debate. Generally speaking, the proponent of a proposition has the initial burden of proof or persuasion of that proposition; only after he fulfills that burden does the burden shift to the opponent of the proposition to offer a persuasive rebuttal.