turtlespeed 226 #1 June 8, 2010 What can I do to get that idea somewhere to be tested? No - I'm not a mechanical engineer or anything of the like. I have an idea and it is relatively simple, and might be implemented pretty easily. I was at work today when a situation made me think how to stop a burst pipe and voila - we have a solution. One thing I don't know is what the actual pressure of the oil coming out is, and how that would affect the device.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #2 June 8, 2010 QuoteWhat can I do to get that idea somewhere to be tested? No - I'm not a mechanical engineer or anything of the like. I have an idea and it is relatively simple, and might be implemented pretty easily. I was at work today when a situation made me think how to stop a burst pipe and voila - we have a solution. One thing I don't know is what the actual pressure of the oil coming out is, and how that would affect the device. OK - so it looks like the pressure can get pretty substantial with the volume - SO - here is my idea: Take several thousand yards of this stuff and put small flotation devices at the connection to somewhat carry the weight as it descends. Then make a bladder manifold out of thick vulcanized rubber, with several ports that can hook up to these hoses. Build a closable valve onto the end of the bladder manifold. Hook up a few of the hoses that are attached to some kind of storage device at the surface. Push a pump deep into the hoses to help out just in case the oil woun't flow up the hose even though it is boyant compared to the water around it. Lastly - secure the whole thing by taking a heavy duty innertube and slipping it over the pipe, slip the bladder manifold in place and let the hoses start filling up and the pressure is released through the filling of the hose and the valve at the top of the bladder. Over lap the innertube over the bladder manifold and inflate to seal. Then slowly close the valve on top. If there needs to be less pressure, then open the valve and attach another hose. Repete this process until all the pressure can be contained into the vinyl hoses and let it rise to the surface. It could work. It's not a permanent fix, but it would keep the oil from infiltrating the ocean. I also know it is over simplified, but I think it is better than any idea posted thus far.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billeisele 130 #4 June 8, 2010 Chuck Norris offered to dive down and fix it but Obama knows that he's a conservative, can't do thatGive one city to the thugs so they can all live together. I vote for Chicago where they have strict gun laws. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #5 June 8, 2010 QuoteChuck Norris offered to dive down and fix it but Obama knows that he's a conservative, can't do that Maybe we can get him to punch it closed.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billeisele 130 #6 June 8, 2010 Quote Quote Chuck Norris offered to dive down and fix it but Obama knows that he's a conservative, can't do that Maybe we can get him to punch it closed. the leak or Obama's mouth if it is the latter even Chuck will need some help the biggest blow hard in the history of the worldGive one city to the thugs so they can all live together. I vote for Chicago where they have strict gun laws. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,099 #7 June 8, 2010 >Take several thousand yards of this stuff and put small flotation devices >at the connection to somewhat carry the weight as it descends. I think the issue there might be that the oil/gas is coming out under pressure at about 1500 PSI. That's about the pressure of a SCUBA tank. That hose is rated about 30 PSI, which is the pressure of an underfilled tire. I don't think it would stand much chance of containing that much pressure. >Lastly - secure the whole thing by taking a heavy duty innertube and >slipping it over the pipe . . . Which part of the pipe? There's a long broken section of pipe that sticks up into the water then folds back on itself, ending up on the bottom. It's leaking from several locations. Where would you put the innertube? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyrider 0 #8 June 8, 2010 Quote>Take several thousand yards of this stuff and put small flotation devices >at the connection to somewhat carry the weight as it descends. I think the issue there might be that the oil/gas is coming out under pressure at about 1500 PSI. That's about the pressure of a SCUBA tank. That hose is rated about 30 PSI, which is the pressure of an underfilled tire. I don't think it would stand much chance of containing that much pressure. >Lastly - secure the whole thing by taking a heavy duty innertube and >slipping it over the pipe . . . Which part of the pipe? There's a long broken section of pipe that sticks up into the water then folds back on itself, ending up on the bottom. It's leaking from several locations. Where would you put the innertube? That part was cut off, it is now a straight short section of pipe! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #9 June 8, 2010 QuoteWhat can I do to get that idea somewhere to be tested? Stopthegulfspill.com http://www.bp.com/bodycopyarticle.do?categoryId=1&contentId=7052055 See: "Do you have ideas to help us?" Get in line... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #10 June 8, 2010 Politics be damned! We've got a horrible situation in the Gulf. Git after it, Mr. Norris! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,099 #11 June 8, 2010 >That part was cut off, it is now a straight short section of pipe! Cool, sounds like they're making progress. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyrider 0 #12 June 8, 2010 Quote>That part was cut off, it is now a straight short section of pipe! Cool, sounds like they're making progress. here is the live feed, their cap slowed it, but is far from stopping it! http://www.wkrg.com/gulf_oil_spill/spill_cam/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #13 June 8, 2010 I understood, when the pipe was cut-off, something went wrong and they wound-up with a jagged edge. I thingk they were wanting to put a BOP or something on the pipe and now, they can't. ??? Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyrider 0 #14 June 8, 2010 Quote I understood, when the pipe was cut-off, something went wrong and they wound-up with a jagged edge. I thingk they were wanting to put a BOP or something on the pipe and now, they can't. ??? Chuck The way they went at it, I'd be surprised if thye got a clean cut, they still had almost a thousand pounds of side presure from th ebent pipe , as they cut into the straight section, Needless to say, the side presure broke th ecut off wire, cuasing a delay...but guesss they worked that out, by the next time I looked at the live feed, the bent section was gone! I ahve never heard of trying to cap a pipe with a flat peice, (which is what It apears they did)....Duh...how is that going to cap it? i am sure greater minds than mine are working on this, I am only a half ass machinist and a metal fabricator...but suire looks stupid to me, several aproaches they have taken! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #15 June 8, 2010 Quote Quote I understood, when the pipe was cut-off, something went wrong and they wound-up with a jagged edge. I thingk they were wanting to put a BOP or something on the pipe and now, they can't. ??? Chuck The way they went at it, I'd be surprised if thye got a clean cut, they still had almost a thousand pounds of side presure from th ebent pipe , as they cut into the straight section, Needless to say, the side presure broke th ecut off wire, cuasing a delay...but guesss they worked that out, by the next time I looked at the live feed, the bent section was gone! I ahve never heard of trying to cap a pipe with a flat peice, (which is what It apears they did)....Duh...how is that going to cap it? i am sure greater minds than mine are working on this, I am only a half ass machinist and a metal fabricator...but suire looks stupid to me, several aproaches they have taken! Too bad, Red Adair is no longer with us. There's always 'Boots and Coots'... they could cap it. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1969912 0 #16 June 9, 2010 QuoteI understood, when the pipe was cut-off, something went wrong and they wound-up with a jagged edge. I thingk they were wanting to put a BOP or something on the pipe and now, they can't. ??? Chuck They could put a BOP onto the cut off section of the riser, but they couldn't close it because the stuff attached to the top of the original BOP (called the LMRP, Lower Marine Riser Package) is not designed to handle the well pressure. What they could do is unbolt the LMRP from the BOP and install another BOP. They would have to deal with the fact that there are two pieces of drill pipe side-by-side in the open end of the riser that likely extend down through the LMRP and likely into the BOP. There are discussions about removing the drill pipe on ~pages 28-29-30 here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/uscgd8/4551846015/page28/. No solution is simple and they all come with risk of making the thing worse. What they're doing right now isn't the greatest for capturing the oil, but it's low-risk. "Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ." -NickDG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #17 June 9, 2010 QuoteQuoteI understood, when the pipe was cut-off, something went wrong and they wound-up with a jagged edge. I thingk they were wanting to put a BOP or something on the pipe and now, they can't. ??? Chuck They could put a BOP onto the cut off section of the riser, but they couldn't close it because the stuff attached to the top of the original BOP (called the LMRP, Lower Marine Riser Package) is not designed to handle the well pressure. What they could do is unbolt the LMRP from the BOP and install another BOP. They would have to deal with the fact that there are two pieces of drill pipe side-by-side in the open end of the riser that likely extend down through the LMRP and likely into the BOP. There are discussions about removing the drill pipe on ~pages 28-29-30 here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/uscgd8/4551846015/page28/. No solution is simple and they all come with risk of making the thing worse. What they're doing right now isn't the greatest for capturing the oil, but it's low-risk. Interesting stuff! No matter how you slice it, it's a heckuva mess. The Gulf is in dire straits. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #18 June 9, 2010 Quote I think the issue there might be that the oil/gas is coming out under pressure at about 1500 PSI. is that relative or absolute pressure? The absolute pressure at 5000 feet is about 152.5atm which is slightly over 2200 psi. QuoteThat's about the pressure of a SCUBA tank. That hose is rated about 30 PSI, which is the pressure of an underfilled tire. I don't think it would stand much chance of containing that much pressure. well, if the internal pressure is 2220psi, and the external pressure is 2200psi, it should be fine, but again, I don't know what the pressure being generated by the well is. And the list time I dived, the Al tanks were filled to 3000psi, I seem to recall some going to 3500, but it was a long time ago. There were some old steel tanks that would only take 2250.-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,142 #19 June 9, 2010 Maybe they could put Rush Limbaugh's mouth over the hole. The amount of hot air he produces will overcome any amount of pressure from below.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,142 #20 June 9, 2010 Quote No - I'm not a mechanical engineer or anything of the like. . Tell us, then, WHAT are your engineering credentials? (and yes, that IS relevant).... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1969912 0 #21 June 9, 2010 Based on live video from the ROV's, it looks like quite a bit less oil is escaping now than there was yesterday or a couple days ago. I think they are working on a better tophat to capture oil from the sheared off riser. It also looks like they're rigging up a bunch of flex line on the sea floor, and it seems reasonable that they are planning to capture oil from a couple of 4" ID lines (Choke and Kill lines) on the BOP as well as through the "improved" tophat. IF that works they might be able to really cut the leak rate down. If they can significantly cut down on the oil leaking to the sea they should be OK until August or so when the relief well(s?) are done. Not sure about the impact of hurricanes on the tophat since it's currently connected by drillpipe to a ship. There has been talk about capturing the oil in huge underwater bladders while hurricanes are present. The Skandi ROV 1 or 2 live feed shows the tophat, and a lot more of the yellow tophat is visible than there was a couple days ago. ROV live feed list here: http://www.troutbugs.com/rovs.html "Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ." -NickDG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #22 June 9, 2010 QuoteWhat can I do to get that idea somewhere to be tested? Myth busters Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #23 June 9, 2010 QuoteMyth busters They better damn well do the downwind faster than the wind one first!Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,577 #24 June 9, 2010 QuoteToo bad, Red Adair is no longer with us. There's always 'Boots and Coots'... they could cap it.Coots died just before the blowout (at 86), and the company is being acquired (maybe) by Halliburton. But I'd hope that every single person with that kind of expertise (like, for instance, Boots) is at least being consulted for their opinion. Wendy P.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 2 #25 June 9, 2010 i am sure greater minds than mine are working on this, I am only a half ass machinist and a metal fabricator...but suire looks stupid to me, several aproaches they have taken! It looks like thw professional engineers are fucking it up as fast as they can. I'm thinking a group of amateurs might come up with some ideas "out of the box" that couldn't be any worse.Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
