Why Are We Afraid of Saying "Socialism"?

[dreamdancer 0]

you say potatoes and i say potatos...

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And now to socialism. What is it? Maybe it’s harder to define. Hitler used the term “national socialism” for his brand of fascism in Germany, which explains a lot about its bad name today.

But “democratic socialism” or “social democracy” is commonly used to describe the Scandinavian countries, France, or the Germany of today in which government plays an essential role in making sure that all citizens have the essentials to thrive: Unemployment benefits in Germany, to take but one example, offer about two-thirds of previous pay, compared to less than half in the U.S.; and they last much longer.

Americans see anything labeled socialism as restricting citizens’ freedoms.

So, let’s add “freedom” to our list of terms that need our immediate attention.

For, if freedom means in part enjoying power over one’s destiny, workers in Germany arguably have much more freedom than U.S. workers.

How’s that? “German workers are at the table when the big decisions are made, and elect people who still watch and sometimes check the businessmen, they have been able to hang on to their manufacturing sector,” unlike in the U.S., observes lawyer Thomas Geoghegan in the March issue of Harper’s.

They get to the table via widespread “works councils,” giving clerks and other low-level employees a voice in management — deciding, for example, on store hours and who takes which shift, as well as on layoffs, and more. “Co-determined boards” are another feature of German social democracy. Mainly in firms with more than 2,000 employees, clerks elect half of the members on these governing boards. “Clerks have all this power without owning any shares!” notes Geoghegan. “In this stakeholder [rather than shareholder] model, they need only act on their interests as ‘the workers.’” Unions also provide workers a greater say over their lives and almost half of Germany’s workforce are union members.

http://www.alternet.org/vision/146143/why_are_we_afraid_of_saying_%22socialism%22

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
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[StreetScooby 5]

The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money to spend.

We are all engines of karma

[Andy9o8 2]

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The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money to spend.

But that's not the question posed in the thread title.

The answer to the question "Why Are We Afraid of Saying 'Socialism'? " - and this is a super-simplified answer - is that, historically, ever since the turn of the 20th Century, "anti-Socialism" (and its early 20th century cousin, "anti-anarchism") has been the closest thing the United States has had to a "national religion". In the US, during the run-up to WW2 in the 1930's, and even after WW2 started (but before the US joined the War), the biggest international/ideological "threat" that was perceived by conservatives in the US was not Hitler and fascism, it was Russia, Socialism and Communism.

After WW2, when the US became a permanent National Security State in 1947, anti-Communism became firmly entrenched as the "national religion". And in the American Cold War mindset, "Communism" and "socialism" were, for all intents and purposes, perceived as essentially synonymous.

To some extent, with the collapse of the Soviet Union and the communist governments in Eastern Europe in the 1990s, anti-communism has been replaced by "anti-terrorism/radical Islam" as the national religion of the US.

Nonetheless, "Socialism" remains a dirty word in the US; that feeling is soaked deeply into the psychological fiber of the US. So in the US, saying "socialism!!" is akin to saying "blasphemy!!" to a religious person: the label itself is a conclusive stigma that is damning and final without further proof.

And so it becomes the case: don't like something in the US, such as national health coverage, or for that matter, anything else? All you need to do is exclaim, "That's socialism!!" End of discussion.

[likearock 2]

He's not.

[rushmc 23]

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He's not.

Ouch!!!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[dreamdancer 0]

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Quote

He's not.

Ouch!!!

it only hurts if you click the link

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[Andy9o8 2]

It was hard enough to listen to Limbaugh for even a minute without vomiting.
Re: Putin - in the first place, he's always been a fascist dictator in Commie's clothing, anyway.

But what really pissed me off at the son of a bitch is that he took a cheap shot at Blind Faith. What an asshole.

Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IN1J5sMv28Q

[rushmc 23]

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Quote

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He's not.

Ouch!!!

it only hurts if you click the link

It only hurts if it nails your position

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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It was hard enough to listen to Limbaugh for even a minute without vomiting.
Re: Putin - in the first place, he's always been a fascist dictator in Commie's clothing, anyway.

But what really pissed me off at the son of a bitch is that he took a cheap shot at Blind Faith. What an asshole.

Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IN1J5sMv28Q

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[dreamdancer 0]

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The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money to spend.

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Glenn Beck and other far right multi-millionaires are claiming that the US is hot on the path towards socialism. Part of their claim is that the US is much more generous and supportive of our working and poor people than other countries.

People may wish it was so, but it is not.
As Senator Patrick Moynihan used to say “Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. But everyone is not entitled to their own facts.”

The fact is that the US is not really all that generous to our working and poor people compared to other countries.

Consider the US in comparison to the rest of the 30 countries that join the US in making up the OECD – the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development. These 30 countries include Canada and most comparable European countries but also include some struggling countries like Czech Republic, Greece, Hungary, Korea, Mexico, Poland, Slovak Republic, and Turkey. See www.oecd.org

When you look at how the US compares to these 30 countries, the hot air myths about the US government going all out towards socialism sort of disappear into thin air. Here are some examples of myths that do not hold up.

Myth #1. The US government is involved in class warfare attacking the rich to lift up the poor.

There is a class war going on all right. But it is the rich against the rest of us and the rich are winning. The gap between the rich and everyone else is wider in the US than any of the 30 other countries surveyed. In fact, the top 10% in the US have a higher annual income than any other country. And the poorest 10% in the US are below the average of the other OECD countries. The rich in the U.S. have been rapidly leaving the middle class and poor behind since the 1980s.

Myth #2. The US already has the greatest health care system in the world.

Infant mortality in the US is 4th worst among OECD countries – better only than Mexico, Turkey and the Slovak Republic.

Myth #3. There is less poverty in the US than anywhere.

Child poverty in the US, at over 20% or one out of every five kids, is double the average of the 30 OECD countries.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/04/10

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[masterblaster72 0]

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It was hard enough to listen to Limbaugh for even a minute without vomiting.
Re: Putin - in the first place, he's always been a fascist dictator in Commie's clothing, anyway.

But what really pissed me off at the son of a bitch is that he took a cheap shot at Blind Faith. What an asshole.

Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IN1J5sMv28Q

Love that song, used to sing it when I'd walk to class in college. Wish they'd have put out more than only one album...what a fantastic band.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[masterblaster72 0]

Don't expect to be taken seriously if your only sources are commondreams.org and alternet.org.

It's the same shit as the tools who cite Fox News and NewsMax as their sources: information cooked to the flavor of a certain agenda.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[dreamdancer 0]

facts are facts
(and myths are myths)

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[masterblaster72 0]

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facts are facts
(and myths are myths)

Right, and those who cite Fox and NewsMax say the same exact thing.

Discerning objective fact from bullshit takes a bit more work than cutting and pasting an article or editorial that favors your opinion.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[dreamdancer 0]

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facts are facts
(and myths are myths)

Right, and those who cite Fox and NewsMax say the same exact thing.

Discerning objective fact from bullshit takes a bit more work than cutting and pasting an article or editorial that favors your opinion.

so you're saying that this is not a fact?

...Myth #3. There is less poverty in the US than anywhere.

Child poverty in the US, at over 20% or one out of every five kids, is double the average of the 30 OECD countries...

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[Lucky... 0]

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He's not.

Limbaugh's not? Is that relevant? And to compare USSR Communism to Socialism is ridiculous. Here we go with the 2nd S being Socialist." USSR Communism was no where like quasi-Soicialist countries like Canada, who's currency is even with ours after having an economy tied to ours.