No, it's NOT OK

[wmw999 2,588]

Do you have any actual examples (other than the British-made movie)?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rushmc 23]

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And the disrespectful flames keep on growing...

It is disgusting which ever side pulls this crap but, it seems one side is more tolerant of their own

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Amazon 7]

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Fixed just for you

On the other hand we have Chris Matthews saying that Republicans should be looked at as criminals for ensighting this violence through thier speech but, once again, we should ignore things like this that he and others have said over and over:
"You guys see Live and Let Die, the great Bond film with Yaphet Kotto as the bad guy, Mr. Big? In the end they jam a big CO2 pellet in his face and he blew up. I have to tell you, Rush Limbaugh is looking more and more like Mr. Big, and at some point somebody's going to jam a CO2 pellet into his head and he's going to explode like a giant blimp. That day may come. Not yet. But we'll be there to watch. I think he's Mr. Big, I think Yaphet Kotto. Are you watching, Rush?"

Actually I think ole Lush Rimjob is doing a good job of that himself.. along the lines of Mr Creosote.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v29QfOyuZ3Y

[wmw999 2,588]

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it seems one side is more tolerant of their own

No, both sides are more tolerant of their own. One's own "side" understands the little in-jokes and quips that make it clear that offense really wasn't intended. Doesn't work the other way.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Ion01 2]

Guys like Russ Carnahan have good reason to be afraid. He had a coffin near his house as a violent threat!

"A coffin was placed in front of a Missouri Democrat’s house, another in a string of incidents against lawmakers after their vote Sunday on a health care overhaul.


Rep. Russ Carnahan (D-Mo.) had a coffin placed “near his home,” a spokesman said Wednesday evening."


The reality:
We brought a coffin with us to represent the millions of Americans who will suffer from inadequate treatment and perish under Obamacare.

After our prayer service we took our coffin and went and prayed on the sidewalk outside of Russ Carnahan’s home.

We prayed for Russ Carnahan. We prayed that God would forgive him for taking away our freedom. We prayed for the babies who will never feel the warmth of the sun or a gentle spring rain. We prayed for the elderly who will die waiting for care because they couldn’t make it past the Obama death panels.

[Ion01 2]

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it seems one side is more tolerant of their own

No, both sides are more tolerant of their own. One's own "side" understands the little in-jokes and quips that make it clear that offense really wasn't intended. Doesn't work the other way.

Wendy P.

Oh, so all that kill bush stuff was an acceptable joke and is no insitement of violence and is obviously equal to the average of the right.

[Amazon 7]

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Guys like Russ Carnahan have good reason to be afraid. He had a coffin near his house as a violent threat!

"A coffin was placed in front of a Missouri Democrat’s house, another in a string of incidents against lawmakers after their vote Sunday on a health care overhaul.


Rep. Russ Carnahan (D-Mo.) had a coffin placed “near his home,” a spokesman said Wednesday evening."


The reality:
We brought a coffin with us to represent the millions of Americans who will suffer from inadequate treatment and perish under Obamacare.

After our prayer service we took our coffin and went and prayed on the sidewalk outside of Russ Carnahan’s home.

We prayed for Russ Carnahan. We prayed that God would forgive him for taking away our freedom. We prayed for the babies who will never feel the warmth of the sun or a gentle spring rain. We prayed for the elderly who will die waiting for care because they couldn’t make it past the Obama death panels.

And every one of those points has been proven to be a lie that thr fringe righties have clung to

[rushmc 23]

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it seems one side is more tolerant of their own

No, both sides are more tolerant of their own. One's own "side" understands the little in-jokes and quips that make it clear that offense really wasn't intended. Doesn't work the other way.

Wendy P.

Oh, so all that kill bush stuff was an acceptable joke and is no insitement of violence and is obviously equal to the average of the right.

And one need only see how the state run media reacts to see there is a difference

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 3,116]

>The reality:
>We brought a coffin with us to represent the millions of Americans who will
>suffer from inadequate treatment and perish under Obamacare.

Perhaps next time you could bring a noose to represent all the millions of Americans who will be killed. Leave it hanging outside Eleanor Norton's house.

[rehmwa 2]

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Oh, so all that kill bush stuff was an acceptable joke and is no insitement of violence and is obviously equal to the average of the right.

that's not the point

no, I'd say that there was a mix of serious and joking in those comments and one side took most of it as joking and the other side took most of it as serious - so they butted heads on the issue

I suspect there's a pretty equal amount of the exact same thing going on with Obama right now and those perceptions are reversed - so they butt heads on the issue


the only real difference isn't in the public, it's more in how the media is reporting it than anything else - and I doubt anybody takes any of the media serious at all anymore - except for weather forecasting


the health care debate? well, that's a pretty tough one - I suspect that both sides have a higher proportion of fanatics about it and everyone should be cautious, especially if they are public

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[billvon 3,116]

>Oh, so all that kill bush stuff was an acceptable joke and is no insitement of
>violence and is obviously equal to the average of the right.

No, that wasn't OK. Neither are the kill-Obama jokes. (Of course, the actual attempts to kill him are even worse.)

[rehmwa 2]

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>(Of course, the actual attempts to kill him are even worse.)

were there any 'actual' attempts to kill Obama or Bush to date?

(this of course opens up the floodgates of discussions why slashing Obama's tires are REALLY a murder attempt while throwing a shoe isn't threatening and actually should be rewarded - and vice versa - I've preemptively thrown up in response.)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[billvon 3,116]

>were there any 'actual' attempts to kill Obama or Bush to date?

There were four arrests in the 2008 plot to kill Obama. (Fortunately they were idiots and easy to stop.) In 2009 one guy was arrested for threatening to kill him.

[rehmwa 2]

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>were there any 'actual' attempts to kill Obama or Bush to date?

There were four arrests in the 2008 plot to kill Obama. (Fortunately they were idiots and easy to stop.) In 2009 one guy was arrested for threatening to kill him.

baselines are certainly meaningful here - how does this compare to any other year in the last 40 years?

I don't know, don't expect you to know either, but it's a reasonable thing to ask


I wonder what it tracks best with: Party affiliation, economic indices, war time or not, region he's from, age, culture, proximity to major policy changes, etc etc etc

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

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>(Of course, the actual attempts to kill him are even worse.)

were there any 'actual' attempts to kill Obama or Bush to date?

That depends on how you define "actual attempt". There were a couple, including a grenade being tossed.

I think there were a couple plots to kill GWB that were stopped well before any shots were actually fired.
There were also a couple prosecutions of fairly harmless threats. (again, I think)

Wiki Clicky Bush and Obama are near the bottom (chronoligical order).

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[Ion01 2]

Just making the statement does not make it true! You want proof of all of that then just look at all the countries that have socialized and government controlled healthcare. Just look at medicare in this country. Medicare has more frawd and more refusals than the government red tape covered system we had! We are surrounded by proof of those points! Why do you think some pharmacies are refusing to take medicare? because they don't get payed by the government! Look at canada where you can get a cat scan for a dog that day for about 1/4 the cost of a scan for you and you have to wait 6 months! Thats why the canadian prime minister went to florida for care! He obviously went to florida for care because the socialized system was so good? Statements do not equal truth. Look at the facts! Here are some for you:
http://www.angelfire.com/pa/sergeman/issues/healthcare/socialized.html
Would this happen here? Girl, 3, has heart operation cancelled three times because of bed shortage

Even if you have the money to buy it yourself your not allowed too so this happens:Kidney cancer patients denied life-saving drugs by NHS rationing body NICE

Whens the last time this happened here? Burnham Forgets 230,000 on List

Culture of targets prevents nurses from tending to patients
Failing hospital 'caused deaths'
- March 17, 2009 [BBC]

Health gap drive 'wasted money'

"Political meddling" threatens general practice, warns GP leader
- March 13, 2009 [Management in Practice (UK)]

Children at risk through lack of training for doctors and nurses, report warns
- Rebecca Smith, March 13, 2009 [Telegraph UK]

Chocolate should be taxed to control obesity epidemic, doctors are told
- Simon Johnson, March 13, 2009 [Telegraph UK]

1,000 villagers wait for a dentist after just one NHS practice opens
- March 10, 2009 [Daily Mail(UK)]

Study that proves the folly of NHS Alzheimer's drug ban
- Jenny Hope, March 7, 2009 [Daily Mail(UK)]

Disabled children wait up to two years for wheelchairs
- March 4, 2009 [Guardian Unlimited]

Two year wait for wheelchairs is the kind of thing you want? Look at the link. It has the fact not just an unfounded statement.

[wmw999 2,588]

Dude, I wish you'd actually reply to posts, instead of just using them as jumping points for diatribes.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[billvon 3,116]

=====================
Woman dies in ER lobby as 911 refuses to help

Tapes show operators ignored pleas to send ambulance to L.A. hospital

updated 7:43 a.m. PT, Wed., June 13, 2007

LOS ANGELES - A woman who lay bleeding on the emergency room floor of a troubled inner-city hospital died after 911 dispatchers refused to contact paramedics or an ambulance to take her to another facility, newly released tapes of the emergency calls reveal.

Edith Isabel Rodriguez, 43, died of a perforated bowel on May 9 at Martin Luther King Jr.-Harbor Hospital. Her death was ruled accidental by the Los Angeles County coroner’s office.

Relatives said Rodriguez was bleeding from the mouth and writhing in pain for 45 minutes while she was at a hospital waiting area. Experts have said she could have survived had she been treated early enough.
===================
Girl dies while waiting Cigna approval for liver TP
Dec 21, 2007 01:27PM
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22357873/

The girl had leukemia and needed a TP. Cigna turned her down until protesters marched on her behalf. Cigna "reconsidered it's decision in light of the rare circumstances surrounding the case."

But it was too late. She died yesterday. She was only 17.
====================
Posted On: April 18, 2009 by Dr. Shezad Malik

Kaiser Permanente to Settle Kidney Transplant Claims For $1 M

Kaiser Permanente has agreed to pay $1 million to settle claims on behalf of five patients alleging that the HMO mishandled its kidney transplant program, endangering lives and causing deaths.

The arbitration claims were filed in 2006, found that Kaiser's Northern California kidney transplant program jeopardized hundreds of patients by forcing them into a new program unprepared to handle an enormous caseload.

"The failure of the program resulted in the deaths of some patients who did not timely receive kidney transplants. The health of others was severely jeopardized," said Lawrence Eisenberg, an attorney for two former patients and the families of three deceased patients. "As the largest HMO in the country, Kaiser's gross mismanagement of the kidney transplant program certainly did not allow their patients to thrive."
============================

[rehmwa 2]

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Dude, I wish you'd actually reply to posts, instead of just using them as jumping points for diatribes.

Wendy P.

what I can't really understand is WHY do they have to put mayonaise on every single sandwich

I didn't ask for mayo, I don't want mayo, I don't need mayo

do they even offer a decent substitute like Sarachi, or raspberry chipotle? or even tobasco? NOOO

it's just nuts

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,588]

Why do you hate the poultry industry?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Remster 30]

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Why do you hate the poultry industry?

Wendy P.

That's exactly what's wrong in today's society. With our road infrastructure in such bad shape, our car maintenance costs are way too high. I couldn't agree with you more Wendy.

Remster

[wmw999 2,588]

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With our road infrastructure in such bad shape

That's because you burn your tires instead of recycling them into new roads. You obviously hate the environment.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[lawrocket 3]

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=====================
Woman dies in ER lobby as 911 refuses to help

Tapes show operators ignored pleas to send ambulance to L.A. hospital

updated 7:43 a.m. PT, Wed., June 13, 2007

LOS ANGELES - A woman who lay bleeding on the emergency room floor of a troubled inner-city hospital died after 911 dispatchers refused to contact paramedics or an ambulance to take her to another facility, newly released tapes of the emergency calls reveal.

Edith Isabel Rodriguez, 43, died of a perforated bowel on May 9 at Martin Luther King Jr.-Harbor Hospital. Her death was ruled accidental by the Los Angeles County coroner’s office.

Relatives said Rodriguez was bleeding from the mouth and writhing in pain for 45 minutes while she was at a hospital waiting area. Experts have said she could have survived had she been treated early enough.

MLK-Harbor is a county clinic - government run. It was a county hospital and trauma center but had problems with people dying.

It appears from this, therefore, that there isn't any improvement between government run free care and insured care.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[billvon 3,116]

>MLK-Harbor is a county clinic - government run.

Yep - and was apparently overcrowded because so many people were using the GOP "just go to the ER and don't pay" plan. We should fix that.

[lawrocket 3]

Yes. Interestingly enough, this was not an issue until 1986, when the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (EMTALA) was passed as part of Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act (COBRA).

EMTALA required hospitals that receive Medicare or Medicaid payments (which, considering that government is the dominant force in health care funding, is all of them except probably Shriners and VA) to treat all ER patients regardless of ability to pay. Oh, and the government decided not to fund it.

This is why more than half of ER visits are not compensated. The hospitals then make it up by charging higher amounts to those that DO pay.

Congress and Reagan created this problem. Rather than Congress say, "We'll make them treat you but we'll pay for it" they cause the payments to increase, meaning increased premiums, and then say the insurance companies and the medical industry are assholes and greedy, thus justifying a government takeover.

Create a big problem. Blame others. Then move in on the others.

It's what happened here. The problem you cite was a creation of the government - a problem only 24 years old.

Well done, government! Very well played.

My wife is hotter than your wife.