CanuckInUSA 0 #1 February 11, 2010 A friend was telling me about this "military" purpose automatic shotgun. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atchisson_Assault_Shotgun http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu965sVymMs&NR=1 The US military would be smart to prohibit access to this shotgun to only those inside of their trusted circles. But how long before others begin to make variants of it. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 February 11, 2010 QuoteThe US military would be smart to prohibit access to this shotgun to only those inside of their trusted circles Waiting for the howls coming from those that think they should have access to ALL weapons available to the military.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #3 February 11, 2010 This is one of those weapons "I hope" the US public is never given access to. But more importantly I wonder how long before the Chinese or Russians start selling variants of this weapon to anyone who will buy it. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #4 February 11, 2010 QuoteThis is one of those weapons "I hope" the US public is never given access to. But more importantly I wonder how long before the Chinese or Russians start selling variants of this weapon to anyone who will buy it. Why not? It's just a shotgun. No different, other than capacity from any other auto 12ga. The "street sweeper" (a cheap 12ga with a drum mag) and the SPAS-12 (a french semi-auto 12ga with some nice tactical feartures) and a few others were classed as "Any Other Weapon" by the ATF some years ago, making them as restriced as silencers, short barrelled weapons and full autos. Just like the "assault weapons, it was because of perceptions more than realities. And the Russians have been making and importing the Saiga for some time now. The Atchisson is a M-16/AR-15 platform, the Saiga is an AK platform."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #5 February 11, 2010 The Saiga 12/20 is a nice lower cost platform for the same feature set at semiauto but still a fast cycle rate. I've had my eye on one for a bit now Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #6 February 11, 2010 Hey what can I say I am still learning. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,107 #7 February 11, 2010 >The US military would be smart to prohibit access to this shotgun to >only those inside of their trusted circles. Why? Why deny people the right to defend themselves? I mean, if a dozen heavily armored robots attacked your house, the ability to shoot twelve HE grenades in under eight seconds could mean the difference between life and death for you and your family! All these gun-o-phobes here on SC, never seeing the big picture. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #8 February 11, 2010 If I had a rocket launcher ... Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyChile 0 #9 February 11, 2010 I don't know anything about real life guns, but that one is in Modern Warfare 2, and the fire rate really makes it kick all kinds of ass in the game. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pontiacgtp00 0 #10 February 11, 2010 It's the gun nubs use Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #11 February 11, 2010 QuoteWaiting for the howls coming from those that think they should have access to ALL weapons available to the military. What exactly is there about this shotgun that scares you? Is it the automatic fire capability? If so, would you be okay with civilians owning a semi-auto version, which would make it's action-type no different than any other semi-auto shotgun? Is it the magazine capacity? If so, would you be okay with a smaller magazine capacity? If so, how many rounds would you allow to be fired in semi-auto mode before a magazine change? Let's say we take the same shotgun, make it semi-auto only, and give it a box magazine that holds only 5 rounds. What about now? Would that make it okay for civilian usage? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #12 February 11, 2010 Quote What exactly is there about this shotgun that scares you? What exactly is there about this shotgun that makes it so much more desirable for the military? It overpowers virtually everything else that comes before it. What exactly is your problem with keeping it out of the hands of criminals? quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #13 February 11, 2010 Quote Why? Why deny people the right to defend themselves? I mean, if a dozen heavily armored robots attacked your house, the ability to shoot twelve HE grenades in under eight seconds could mean the difference between life and death for you and your family! I wonder how many rounds one can practically get off before the recoil issues overwhelm. Given my experience with an MP5 as well as with a traditional pump action 12 ga, I hope this model has some really good dampening. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #14 February 11, 2010 Of course being on the other end of having 20 rounds of shot fired at you in automatic succession would be pretty lethal. You would need to be dressed in some future armored suit to withstand it's barrage. But it was not the automatic action that got me. It was in the YouTube video when they talked about the miniature rocket propelled grenades that could be fired. Kind of makes the old single shot rocket propelled grenade launcher obsolete. Now a 5 shot mag for public use would not be much different than a pump action shotgun. Except you are able to fire faster thanks to the semi-automatic action. I do not know ... for the military (or tactical police) this firearm makes sense. It just seems like a little overkill for home protection. Of course when the people knocking on your door are carrying AA12s themselves what are you going to do. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #15 February 11, 2010 Quote I hope this model has some really good dampening. If you watch the YouTube video you will see that it does. Plus I looked up the Saiga firearm after others mentioned it and it too has some dampening. This is definitely not your grandfather's shotgun. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #16 February 11, 2010 Whatever... I've unlocked FMJ on it and its a kickass gun for room clearing and on Rust on MW2. Then again I'm an idiot that is an M4A1 Master also instead of something better. Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #17 February 11, 2010 Quote I hope this model has some really good dampening. It's a shotgun not a super soaker. quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #18 February 11, 2010 Quote .... What exactly is your problem with keeping it out of the hands of criminals law abiding gun owners? There you have JR's concern. Please, kindly show a bit of understanding for your country fellowman. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vanair 0 #19 February 11, 2010 It looks like low recoil from the video. Whats really cool is a 20mm type rifle that has a laser range finder. When the bad guy ducks behind something, tree, wall, ditch etc out of line of fire. Just point the laser at tree etc. It programs the round to detonate within three feet I think up to 1000yrds. So a 20mm round that has a kill radius of about 15 feet goes off next to him. No longer need line of sight. Just aim right next to tree or over wall etc. Also very cheap compared to arty. Was developed here in NJ at Picatiney Arsenal. Read about it about a week ago in the NJ Star Ledger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,107 #20 February 11, 2010 >Of course when the people knocking on your door are carrying >AA12s themselves what are you going to do. Get a Mk47 grenade launcher of course. 300 rounds per minute compared to the pitiful 120 rounds per minute of the AA12 - and can launch much larger grenades. It's also available with a 48 round belt, so you can take care of dozens of killer robots/people in full body armor without having to pause to reload (which, of course, is the primary reason that those killer robots win so often during their home invasions.) http://world.guns.ru/grenade/gl23-e.htm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #21 February 11, 2010 QuoteWhat exactly is there about this shotgun that makes it so much more desirable for the military? It overpowers virtually everything else that comes before it. Not really. At close range it's great, but no shotgun is of any real use beyond about 100yds. That's just the nature of the cartridge. One skilled soldier with a .30cal rifle (M14) could easily take out a large group armed with these shotguns, as long as he could engage them beyond 100yds. Mag capacity and rate of fire are much greater than for other shotguns, but (especially for military situations) shotguns are of limited utility. What they are good for, they are great for, but they aren't good in a lot of places."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #22 February 11, 2010 Quote If I had a rocket launcher ... There are many flame throwers on this site however"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #23 February 11, 2010 Quote There are many flame throwers on this site however Say what you want. I did not know much about this firearm only that a friend told me about it, I looked it up and saw how potent it could be in a confined urban environment (especially when it is configured to fire rocket propelled grenades). But others have corrected me, others have told me that there are comparable firearms out there and even more potent ones (but the more potent ones are less maneuverable). This is one bad ass shotgun. I hope I never am standing on the wrong side of the barrel. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #24 February 11, 2010 Quote What exactly is your problem with keeping it out of the hands of criminals? I didn't say I had a problem with that. There's that tendency again, of a gun-control guy trying to put words in my mouth that don't belong there. I'm asking you what changes would have to be made to the shotgun before you would consider it acceptable for civilian ownership. Would a semi-auto with 5-round capacity do it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #25 February 11, 2010 Quote Quote If I had a rocket launcher ... There are many flame throwers on this site however Joke . . . too . . . easy. Must . . . control . . . self.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
