Say Something "Nice" About the Opposition . . .

[NickDG 23]

Preface: When I read a newspaper these days (actually everyday since Newt Gingrich made hate fashionable in modern American politics) I sometimes despair our future prospects. Politics has always been derisive, bare knuckled, and ugly, but today's media saturation makes it harder to ignore.

When I read about T-baggers calling for a 2nd Revolution, I can't help but laugh. We already had the 2nd one. It occurred between the late 1950s and early 1970s and it was called the Cultural Revolution. That generation (my generation) addressed civil rights, marched against a war they didn't believe in, made sure the less fortunate among us weren't kicked to the curb, promoted woman's liberation, and many other social causes. In general we told the "establishment" to stick it you know where.

However back then the differences between people weren't so much liberal/conservative, democrat/republican, or pro/con on any particular issue. It was basically the young against the old. I'm not saying that was good or bad, I'm just saying that's how it was. Today's ideologies cross race, age, social standing, intelligence and monetary lines. In a way you'd think that should be better for debate, but somehow it doesn't seem so.

We really need to get away from exactly one way or the other. For instance while Obama is my guy I don't agree with everything he's doing. I'm not for the bank/Wall St. bailouts, I'm not for his health care program (in present form.) I'm also in general pro-gun, pro military (not pro-war) and anti abortion (although not to the point of forcing my view on anyone else or blowing some doctors brains out). And I consider myself a liberal democrat.

So what T-baggers are proposing today isn't so much a 2nd Revolution as it is a 2nd Civil War. And that's dangerous. It's dangerous because the lines seem to be drawn (and this is a very loose analogy) between the North and the South again. It seems to be between the people who realize a functioning government is fundamentally necessary (with all the good/bad that brings) and those who want to basically see government abolished. I used to think that way in the 1960s, but I grew up.

Besides I'm not too worried about a 2nd American Civil War, after all, we kicked your asses the first time.

Now I've probably blown the premise of this whole thing by over explaining the above which would prove my belief that most on the right aren't engaged enough to follow anything but sound bites (or is that bytes?)

So here's the deal. Say something good about someone on the other side of your political leanings. Effective debate (something we are taught America is built upon) just isn't possible without some mutual respect for each other. Without respect debate becomes a bar brawl. And I have a feeling most of us, on both sides, are more sick of that than anything else.

If I'm wrong about that, and I'm old enough to realize I've been wrong about a lot of things, this will prove we haven't (as a society) reached that point of enlightenment. And also reinforce my fear we are in a lot trouble.

I originally thought of keeping this limited to the living, but after a good deal of thought I'm making it any 20th Century figure. Now, of course, you don't have to agree with the person you name, it just has to be someone you can respect (or at least stomach) for whatever reason. This will take a few ground rules though. Please don't post, "No one, I hate you all!" Your silence will make your point more effectively. Just a name, a paragraph or two, a citation maybe, or a Youtube vid showing why you picked a particular person. You can put your digs in, but please keep it in the context of the premise. And don't post just to disagree with the last post. Pick a horse or stay out of the race . . .

Okay, here goes my pick . . .

William Buckley, Jr. I'm tempted to call him the Rush Limbaugh of my generation but that would be too unfair to the former and way too generous to the latter. I disagreed with him on just about everything but I could listen to him. He was eloquent to the point of making me say, "Wow!" He was a brilliant writer (I've read most of his books) and in any debate a more than worthy opponent. Your side should produce more like him and I think it's kind of telling that you seem not able to do so . . .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_F._Buckley,_Jr.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcB3t49Cd84

NickD

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[Andy9o8 2]

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Say something good about someone on the other side of your political leanings.

Fine. Palin has nice tits.

[rehmwa 2]

It's a nice thing to try, but it's been done before.

I'll get the obvious ones out of the way -

"They didn't do this stupid thing this time. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes"

they did something something completely at odds with that party's philosophy - nicely done

or "nice speech, Obama did a good job tying his ears back (conversely, GWB's eyes didn't look so creepily close together this time) - good spin on the PR machine"

or "this was a great proposal - they're really backed into a corner now"


hope that helps


anyway - in the spirit of the thread I'll pick a couple groups that I disagree with:

1 - I think Hitler kept his mustache neatly trimmed.

2 - The Congresses of the last couple decades appears to have really nice furniture

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[quade 4]

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Say something good about someone on the other side of your political leanings.

Fine. Palin has nice tits.

Does she? I've seen no proof of that.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Surely just four years of these incompetent fuckers won't kill us

OK, OK-they appear to be very passionate about their beliefs.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[Andy9o8 2]

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Say something good about someone on the other side of your political leanings.

Fine. Palin has nice tits.

Does she? I've seen no proof of that.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=120114;

NSFW

[quade 4]

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Say something good about someone on the other side of your political leanings.

Fine. Palin has nice tits.

Does she? I've seen no proof of that.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=120114;
NSFW

If only it were true, but it's a mediocre Photoshop job.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Belgian_Draft 0]

They make me thankfull I have a brain.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[idrankwhat 0]

I tried very hard to write something about Bush or Cheney but I'm still suffering from their hangover and I just can't do it.

Ronald Reagan: I think he was a good communicator who really believed that his political philosophy was right for AMERICAN prosperity. I think he was statesman enough to be disappointed at the partisan hackery that has created the divisiveness that we're suffering from today. I believe that he would be one of the more moderate voices in the Washington arena if alive today.

[quade 4]

I admire the machine they've put together. The people that understand how to focus and control their message do a very good job. As much as the "talking points memos" are anathema to individual and original thought, they really do work at hammering the country with their message du jour. There's absolutely no denying that. They only don't work when somebody has video tape of virtually everyone saying the exact same thing in every media venue and play them back to back to point it out.

It takes real organization to pull that kind of stuff off and "they" win that game because the Democrats are simply too enamored with pleasing individual factions within their own party to be able to say anything without customizing their messages.

The Republicans REALLY have that "party unity" thing down.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[rehmwa 2]

so far, zero for nine in writing anything that wasn't backhanded - {{idrankwhat came close (if only the urge to write the first bit wasn't so overwhelming)}}

7 for 9 - subtle or obtuse slams in costume
2 for 9 - mockery

IMHO

we are so narcissistic, that we are becoming incapable of respectful disagreement


I think Paul Wellstone truly and unselfishly, believed in what he was trying to do. (stop here, right here, this is good and meets the intent of the thread....... don't say "even though he was dangerously wrong".....just don't add that bit.... c'mon, you can do it)

arrrrrghhh..... must control impulse....

and Dick Cheney certainly has improved in the last 6 months in his gun safety habits

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[muff528 3]

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I admire the machine they've put together. The people that understand how to focus and control their message do a very good job. As much as the "talking points memos" are anathema to individual and original thought, they really do work at hammering the country with their message du jour. There's absolutely no denying that. They only don't work when somebody has video tape of virtually everyone saying the exact same thing in every media venue and play them back to back to point it out.

It takes real organization to pull that kind of stuff off and "they" win that game because the Democrats are simply too enamored with pleasing individual factions within their own party to be able to say anything without customizing their messages.

The Republicans REALLY have that "party unity" thing down.

I can't disagree with that. If you posted that same message, swapping the words "Democrats" and "Republicans", I couldn't disagree with that either.

[quade 4]

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I can't disagree with that. If you posted that same message, swapping the words "Democrats" and "Republicans", I couldn't disagree with that either.

Oh I disagree entirely! Democrats have NEVER had the sort of "party unity" the Republicans have. There are numerous classic jokes about it.

"I am not a member of any organized party — I am a Democrat." -- Will Rogers.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[quade 4]

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so far, zero for nine in writing anything that wasn't backhanded -

Nothing "backhanded" about my statement at all. If the Democrats had half the party unity the Republicans did, they wouldn't have to worry so much about "only" having 59 Senators.

The Republicans "only" have 41 and they're successfully able to prevent the Democrats from doing just about anything. Now, admittedly, part of that is due to the silly filibuster rules currently in place, but I still think that's impressive even if I don't agree with it.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kelpdiver 2]

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I can't disagree with that. If you posted that same message, swapping the words "Democrats" and "Republicans", I couldn't disagree with that either.

Oh I disagree entirely! Democrats have NEVER had the sort of "party unity" the Republicans have. There are numerous classic jokes about it.

Comparing the California and Texas delegations is an illustration of this. (though for Texas, it seems like state unity is even stronger than party)

So who can say something nice about Joe Lieberman?

'he's a funny motherfucker?'

[billvon 3,120]

While both parties have extremists, I think most people in both parties really do mean well. Most people who are opposed to gay marriage, for example, don't hate gays - they really do think that banning such unions will help families survive or help prevent something they see as a "malfunction" from propagating. Most people who are staunch anti-environmentalists don't really want to destroy the environment, they just don't think it's at much risk - and they think the risks posed by conservation/clean technologies/mitigation are just plain higher. Most pro-welfare types don't really want people to live on welfare forever - they see welfare helping people out until they're back on their feet.

All too often we see only the extremes of these positions, because they are out there. For example, I know people who really do want to live on welfare forever ("why should other people get it if I don't?") and people who really do just plain hate environmentalists ("I'm not some smug hippy treehugger" etc) But most people aren't like that, on either side of any issue.

[quade 4]

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So who can say something nice about Joe Lieberman?

The guy always knows which side his bread is buttered on.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[loumeinhart 0]

I'll step up and say Dennis Kucinich, from my home state here in Ohio.

Congressman Kucinich doesn't need an introduction from me. He takes a very liberal position on almost every issue and I happen to disagree wtih his policies.

Kucinich is no stranger to local radio. And mind you since AirAmerica left 1350, the only left-leaning talk is NPR. Otherwise your choices are the townhall.com crew on 1420, or Beck, Rush, Trivisonno, and Bob France on 1100, of which the latter 2 are locals.

I've heard Dennis answer some tough questions during a brow-beating session fromTrivisonno or France. Sometimes even one-worded answers that you would not expect from a politician.

So I think the man is pretty much wrong on everything, but I respect him for never trying to change his answer, backpeddle, or answer a question with another question. The guy has conviction.

[Bolas 5]

I think alot of the "hate" is just that those that are the loudest getting the attention.

As they've polarized things in their and their follower's minds, it's easy to agree or disagree with them, especially for the media which in turn gets it's ratings from the supporters or the disagreeers. The more of a fringe or angrier they are, the better for profits. Much easier to get a quote or a sound byte that they can add music and a graphic too.

Most issues at the surface aren't just black and white and while hopefully cooler heads prevail, that just isn't all that exciting to write about or watch.
Something nice:
Rush Limbaugh can be quite entertaining.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[loumeinhart 0]

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Most issues at the surface aren't just black and white and while hopefully cooler heads prevail, that just isn't all that exciting to write about or watch.

well said. On c-span the CBO was questioning an Economics professor named DR Reinhart. commitee members from both sides were civily discussing budget issues with respect to healthcare and debt. Sounded like Kent Conrad(D) doesn't want to spend any more money than the republicans!

[idrankwhat 0]

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so far, zero for nine in writing anything that wasn't backhanded - {{idrankwhat came close (if only the urge to write the first bit wasn't so overwhelming)}}

C'mon man. I was aiming high and I failed. Even Republicans don't have nice things to say about that pair. That's not a (really) jab, just (mostly) an observation.


edited to add: WAIT! It was great that Bush got involved in the Haiti relief effort.

[mnealtx 0]

Obama is articulate and bright and clean and a nice looking guy.

Seriously, though - I think he *does* believe he's doing what he thinks is right for the country.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[livendive 8]

While they may not demonstrate any actual belief in the concepts of freedom and smaller government, at least they say things about them often enough to keep them on the table.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[loumeinhart 0]

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The guy has conviction.

I take that back

[winsor 236]

Well, at least they won't live forever.