Bullet Spin...

[Amazon 7]

A lot of people do not realize that almost 10% of the male population of France was killed in WWI. Many of the Lebel and Berthier rifles are pretty friggin sad as far as condition goes. The MAS rifles were just starting to be issued and were still fairly rare when the french were so decisively overrun by the Germans in WWII. If they had not had their heads so firmly planted up their collective rectums in their belief that they were impervious behind the Maginot Line..... they might have prepared better for the war they faced rather than the War they fought 25 years before.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

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A lot of people do not realize that almost 10% of the male population of France was killed in WWI. Many of the Lebel and Berthier rifles are pretty friggin sad as far as condition goes. The MAS rifles were just starting to be issued and were still fairly rare when the french were so decisively overrun by the Germans in WWII. If they had not had their heads so firmly planted up their collective rectums in their belief that they were impervious behind the Maginot Line..... they might have prepared better for the war they faced rather than the War they fought 25 years before.

Very true. The casualties in WW 1 were truly horrific. And in many cases unnecessarily so. The incompetence of the French leaders was inexcusable.

But it's not the first time (or the last) that the generals lost this war fighting using the last war's tactics.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[rhaig 0]

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for sale: used French WWII rifle. Never fired. Dropped once.

ALthough that is the usual joke surrounding the Lebel Rifles... MANY of those same rifles had been used by several dead French soldiers from the trenches of WWI. You will find a lot of them with pretty lousy barrels. Do you have any idea how many young men died with those rifles?

Just shy of 1.5M if my memory serves. But that class was a long time ago.

--
Rob

[rehmwa 2]

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>hitting the target isn't about individual skill, as it is about eliminating
>all possible/controllable sources of ammo

That may well be true, but it would sure cut down on the number of people who target shoot.

I didn't finish that sentence apparently (add 'variation in' somewhere in there)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rehmwa 2]

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Coriolis drift is the one that always amazes me.

Yeah, but that's due to the spin of the Earth.

nonsense, Obama promised "openness" from now on, that means NO SPIN - don't make congress pass a law to eliminate the earth spin

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[steve1 5]

John,
I think your answer best answered the question pertaining to bullet spin. I've never shot at a 1,000 yards but I have shot a fair amount at longer ranges. To tell you the truth I haven't been able to see any variation due to bullet spin. I sight in at a hundred yards. I haven't seen any variation out to 500 yards (left or right). I was just wondering if bullet spin might be more visable at twice that far.

I glass bed the action of my rifles. Free float most barrels. Some I put a shim under the fore end of the barrel. I adjust the triggers carefully. Mount quality scopes. And use the best bench rest techniques that I can muster.

With all that you can match the best hand loads to your rifle. I also keep detailed notes. There is just too much to remember. There are many tricks to accuracy. I'm not a fanatic like some shooters, but little things can make a big difference.

After all that you can go to the range and test things out. It's surprising how inaccurate some rifles are. This inaccuracy really shows up at longer ranges.

Some of my rifles will group close to a 1/2 inch at a hundred yards, with five shot groups. Many rifles (off the shelf) will group closer to three inches at a hundred yards with factory ammo. Maybe that isn't much difference, but at long range that is a big difference. An inaccurate rifle can be almost worthless for a longer shot.

Many people think they have a hunting rifle that will drive tacks. After testing them out, they may not be pleased.

But just when I think I know it all, something new comes along. That's why I like asking questions from people on here, who know more than I do.....

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

A lot of people think that they need a hunting rifle that will drive tacks.

During sight-in season for deer hunting, I get a couple every year that want to see 1" groups at 100yd, and are frustrated when they can't.

I then ask how far they will realistically be shooting...

"Oh, 75 yards, 80 tops"

At a whitetail deer.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[Amazon 7]

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A lot of people think that they need a hunting rifle that will drive tacks.

During sight-in season for deer hunting, I get a couple every year that want to see 1" groups at 100yd, and are frustrated when they can't.

I then ask how far they will realistically be shooting...

"Oh, 75 yards, 80 tops"

At a whitetail deer.

I love the frekin morons who sight in their rifles on opening morning.. in their camps.. before piling into their trucks to cruise the logging roads all day in hopes that a deer will run across the road

[Belgian_Draft 0]

Hey, don't knock it. I've hit plenty of deer with my pickups.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[steve1 5]

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A lot of people think that they need a hunting rifle that will drive tacks.

During sight-in season for deer hunting, I get a couple every year that want to see 1" groups at 100yd, and are frustrated when they can't.

I then ask how far they will realistically be shooting...

"Oh, 75 yards, 80 tops"

At a whitetail deer.

.................................................
I guess it all boils down to the type of hunting a person does. I don't take a lot of long shots. Mainly because I don't want to risk wounding an animal. But I like knowing I can make a long shot if I need to.

I remember once when an antelope was getting away with a broken leg. Another hunter had wounded it. I wanted to put it out of it's misery. I used my duplex reticle to size it up and figure the range. It was a good 500 yards away. I took careful aim from a prone position, and killed it with one shot. I was glad I had an accurate rifle, and could make that shot. I was glad I had spent hours and hours fine tuning that gun and working up the right reload, plus spending all that time practicing shooting.

Another time a friend of mine broke the front leg on an antelope. It was an easy shot, and he blew it. He then missed several more shots at it, until it was out of his effective range. His rifle wasn't very accurate, and he didn't practice enough. As a result he lost that antelope. Worst of all, it probably had a slow miserable death.

Most of the time I don't need a super accurate rifle. But once in a while, they sure are worth having....