Dutch to use full body scanners for US flights

[champu 1]

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_16026/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=oBFdwl3C

In light of the failed Detroit attack and word of a Somali man caught a month ago with the same components, it looks like the Dutch are going ahead with millimeter wave body scanners.

My question is, given the (largely human) problems with resolving alarms using metal detectors, their overall shortcomings at detecting bomb components, and the nature of the new software used in the scanners (discussed briefly in the article) that displays stylized images rather than detailed images of the body (potentially aleviating privacy concerns?), is there a downside to this?

I'm of the opinion that general complacency of the operators has made the walk-through detector -> wand -> pat down approach completely useless, and that this may remove some of the "theatre" aspect of airport security.

(written from my phone... sorry for the run-on sentences.)

[nigel99 620]

Quote

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_16026/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=oBFdwl3C

In light of the failed Detroit attack and word of a Somali man caught a month ago with the same components, it looks like the Dutch are going ahead with millimeter wave body scanners.

My question is, given the (largely human) problems with resolving alarms using metal detectors, their overall shortcomings at detecting bomb components, and the nature of the new software used in the scanners (discussed briefly in the article) that displays stylized images rather than detailed images of the body (potentially aleviating privacy concerns?), is there a downside to this?

I'm of the opinion that general complacency of the operators has made the walk-through detector -> wand -> pat down approach completely useless, and that this may remove some of the "theatre" aspect of airport security.

(written from my phone... sorry for the run-on sentences.)

I'd rather walk through a full body scanner where the operator is not touching me, than have some block feeling me up - and lets face it to do a proper body search they need to "touch" everywhere. Now if the choice is a hot woman then in all honesty it would put some fun back into travel.

I don't get the "privacy" concerns. Is a black and white image REALLY that indecent? Let's face it how erotic is a black and white image of a mans goods squished into a pair of under-rods, or a womens tits squished into a bra?

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[feuergnom 29]

fuck full body scans - the best way would be to make every pax strip down, get a complete search including the private parts and then dress in one-way clothes provided by the airlines

The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle

dudeist skydiver # 666

[Andrewwhyte 1]

Perhaps we will soon see men's and women's security lines with all the male flight attendants changing careers to work the scanners.

[ridestrong 1]

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Perhaps we will soon see men's and women's security lines with all the male flight attendants changing careers to work the scanners.

"male flight attendants changing careers to work the scanners" to see men or women?

I vote yes for full body scanners for all flights. If someone feels it is an invasion of their privacy than don't fly. Their personal insecurities are everyone else's invasion of security.

*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.*
----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.----

[champu 1]

...well, if that post doesn't draw the surrendering liberty for security quote that so many people love to throw out there...

While I agree with your conclusion, your reasoning is easily bypassed altogether if someone finds it offensive or in disagreement with their ideals. Given the newer image processing available it Is arguably less invasive to have a body scan than it is for a TSA person to pat you down. And if the former is actually more effective, why still put up with the latter?

...in any event... my flight is boarding... :)

[1969912 0]

I'm OK with those scanners, but they won't solve the problem. The terrorists will just use surgically implanted bombs. Full-body radiography and/or neutron activation schemes for detecting implanted explosives will never fly. Perhaps there are other technologies available, but I doubt it.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[cloudseeker2001 0]

I had no problem getting through to the secured loading area with a full bottle of water in my front jean pocket while leaving Amsterdamn a couple of months ago...............The Dutch are great people, they just need to pay a little more attention.

"Some call it heavenly in it's brilliance,
others mean and rueful of the western dream"

[georgerussia 0]

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In light of the failed Detroit attack and word of a Somali man caught a month ago with the same components, it looks like the Dutch are going ahead with millimeter wave body scanners.

I usually take one when flying out of SFO, as most people don't go there, so the line is much smaller. Have never seen one in AMS though, unless they installed them in last two months.

However I have to say that the terrorists now got a clue that they do not need to actually bomb anything to get fear and attention (which is what they wanted), and this is something I do not like.

* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. *

[DSE 5]

Hope you never have large amounts of metal in your body. Even with carrying a Stryker card (endorsed by Homeland Security), it still ensures a quick trip to a back room.

Otherwise, full body scanners are great for speed.
The puff scanners are very slow (we have two in SLC) and they slow the process down significantly.

[kallend 2,150]

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I had no problem getting through to the secured loading area with a full bottle of water in my front jean pocket while leaving Amsterdamn a couple of months ago...............The Dutch are great people, they just need to pay a little more attention.

Ditto at San Diego. Forgot I had it, they never found it.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Hope you never have large amounts of metal in your body. Even with carrying a Stryker card (endorsed by Homeland Security), it still ensures a quick trip to a back room.

Otherwise, full body scanners are great for speed.
The puff scanners are very slow (we have two in SLC) and they slow the process down significantly.

so those scanners see the metal work? Great - I haven't had a single problem with the eifle tower in my shoulder, but they're going to just love seeing it.

[billvon 3,120]

>If someone feels it is an invasion of their privacy than don't fly. Their
> personal insecurities are everyone else's invasion of security.

Interesting. Do you feel the same way about (for example) gun registration? If it bothers you, don't get a gun. Your personal insecurities should not enable other people's violence, after all.

[ridestrong 1]

Quote

>If someone feels it is an invasion of their privacy than don't fly. Their
> personal insecurities are everyone else's invasion of security.

Interesting. Do you feel the same way about (for example) gun registration? If it bothers you, don't get a gun.

Yes...

*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.*
----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.----

[mnealtx 0]

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Your personal insecurities should not enable other people's violence, after all.

So, I'm justified in carrying a concealed weapon into a place that doesn't want me to, so that I don't enable a robber's violence?

Cool.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[champu 1]

Quote

>If someone feels it is an invasion of their privacy than don't fly. Their
> personal insecurities are everyone else's invasion of security.

Interesting. Do you feel the same way about (for example) gun registration? If it bothers you, don't get a gun. Your personal insecurities should not enable other people's violence, after all.

If it were as easy to get to the other side of a security checkpoint by completely circumventing it regardless of what type of screening was involved as it is to get a firearm by circumventing whatever registration and background checks are required by law, I would put off buying half-million dollar body scanning machines until I got some more walls put up and some more door locks installed.

[d16842 0]

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In light of the failed Detroit attack and word of a Somali man caught a month ago with the same components, it looks like the Dutch are going ahead with millimeter wave body scanners.

The last two times I went to Israel, about 7 years ago, they had said screw the luggage scanners, and required opeing and hand inspection of all purpuses, carryon, and checked baggage.

Tom B

[kallend 2,150]

Quote

Quote

In light of the failed Detroit attack and word of a Somali man caught a month ago with the same components, it looks like the Dutch are going ahead with millimeter wave body scanners.

The last two times I went to Israel, about 7 years ago, they had said screw the luggage scanners, and required opeing and hand inspection of all purpuses, carryon, and checked baggage.

They did that at Heathrow during the IRA terrorism years.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Andy9o8 2]

Our neighbor has a big dog who loves to shove his nose into people's crotches. Airports have come to that now, haven't they?

[mnealtx 0]

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Our neighbor has a big dog who loves to shove his nose into people's crotches. Airports have come to that now, haven't they?

My understanding is that dogs, 'puffer' machines or grope-downs are the only way to find things like that.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[kallend 2,150]

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Our neighbor has a big dog who loves to shove his nose into people's crotches. Airports have come to that now, haven't they?

Not the one where my plane is hangared.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[georgerussia 0]

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The last two times I went to Israel, about 7 years ago, they had said screw the luggage scanners, and required opeing and hand inspection of all purpuses, carryon, and checked baggage.

They do the same in Russia for all flights to U.S.

* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. *

[billvon 3,120]

>So, I'm justified in carrying a concealed weapon into a place that
>doesn't want me to, so that I don't enable a robber's violence?

Sure, if it's registered, insured and you've been trained on it. If that bothers you, don't carry a gun. Your own hangups shouldn't put other people at risk after all.

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

>So, I'm justified in carrying a concealed weapon into a place that
>doesn't want me to, so that I don't enable a robber's violence?

Sure, if it's registered, insured and you've been trained on it. If that bothers you, don't carry a gun. Your own hangups shouldn't put other people at risk after all.

Nope, sorry - I only have to be trained and have the concealed carry license. YOUR hangups about registration and insurance shouldn't put ME at risk.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Quote

Our neighbor has a big dog who loves to shove his nose into people's crotches. Airports have come to that now, haven't they?

Not the one where my plane is hangared.

Not yet.