ridestrong 1 #76 December 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteIf I asked you to post a picture of someone most resembling the following groups of people do you think you would be able to do it. -Orthodox Jew Here's one. Boy, does he look typical. Keep it up. You're digging yourself deeper. Sorry Andy... you failed. Move to Brooklyn NY and you will likely soon be able to effectively answer this question. Better luck next time.*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.* ----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.---- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #77 December 30, 2009 QuoteUgh.... My point is this: I will make this as simple as I can for you, and you, and you. If I asked you to post a picture of someone most resembling the following groups of people do you think you would be able to do it. -Orthodox Jew -Rastafarian -Cowboy -Muslim -Buddhist Monk Feel free to use 'Google Images'. I think it will help you out. The fact is, as I stated in my initial post that although these are generalizations and not representative of ALL they are still descriptions. Now I'm sure those of you who are arguing against this point will dodge this challenge... and come back with one of your 'I know you are but what am I' reply's. So please give me a simple "yes or no" answer to this question: If I used 'Google Images' to find a picture representative of the aforementioned groups of people and showed them to the average person, do you think they would be able to identify which group the person in the picture most resembled? The answer to your question is "Yes". It's called a "stereotype". One of the best definitions of stereotype I've come across: That which is always said or believed by people who think only a little, or not at all"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ridestrong 1 #78 December 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote (And I fail to see how describing someone as "muslim" helps any more in a description than describing someone as "mormon" or "lutheran".) "Muslim" is a generalization true... but chances are if you put a muslim, a mormon and a lutheran in a line-up you would be able to pick out the muslim by that very description. The majority of muslims will fit a certain description just as the majority of mormons will also fit a certain description. So yes, even though it is a generalization it can be helpful in a description. Ummm - the majority of muslims are Indonesian. Can you tell an Indonesian muslim from, say, a Philippino catholic or a Singapore protestant by looking at him? I seriously doubt it. Ignorance and bigotry hand in hand, riding strongly as usual. Please... you cannot tell me that Muslims (men in particular) don't follow a general description. The Muslim culture usually follows certain customs set forth by the profit Muhammad. Muslim men TEND to have muslim names, they tend to wear customary clothing, they tend not to shave their beards, they tend to hold prayer 5 times a day. This does not go for all muslims but MOST muslim men follow these customs. Just like one can tend to spot a true hippie when you see one, you can spot a true Muslim when you see one. You don't believe this to be true???????? ETA: just because I know the basic differences between Muslims, mormons, jews, catholics, etc... does not make me a bigot and certainly not ignorant. But I know in your world ignorance is bliss. You just display ignorance. And... there it is.*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.* ----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.---- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ridestrong 1 #79 December 30, 2009 Quote QuoteUgh.... My point is this: I will make this as simple as I can for you, and you, and you. If I asked you to post a picture of someone most resembling the following groups of people do you think you would be able to do it. -Orthodox Jew -Rastafarian -Cowboy -Muslim -Buddhist Monk Feel free to use 'Google Images'. I think it will help you out. The fact is, as I stated in my initial post that although these are generalizations and not representative of ALL they are still descriptions. Now I'm sure those of you who are arguing against this point will dodge this challenge... and come back with one of your 'I know you are but what am I' reply's. So please give me a simple "yes or no" answer to this question: If I used 'Google Images' to find a picture representative of the aforementioned groups of people and showed them to the average person, do you think they would be able to identify which group the person in the picture most resembled? The answer to your question is "Yes". It's called a "stereotype". One of the best definitions of stereotype I've come across: That which is always said or believed by people who think only a little, or not at all I agree with you. Stereotyping is bad mmmmkay... I'm not advocating we stereotype, I also feel it is wrong to do. Stereotypes however right or wrong still describe a set of people. I agree with you.*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.* ----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.---- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #80 December 30, 2009 Quote If I asked you to post a picture of someone most resembling the following groups of people do you think you would be able to do it. -Orthodox Jew -Rastafarian -Cowboy -Muslim -Buddhist Monk The point, which you either don't get, or ignore, is that Muslim has a dramatically greater range than the others. The vast majority of Buddhist Monks in Thailand will be wearing very similar attire. The cowboy has a bit more variety in color and items, but the clothing will be functionally very similar, with the heavy pants, the boots, the hat. The Rasta has the dreadlocks, though I wouldn't be surprised if there are more posers than real ones. Profiling starts to slip badly with Orthodox Jew, though as some have pointed out, the genetic diversity is more limited, so there tend to be prominent physical features. But Muslim - how can you effectively generalize a billion people? You can't. Esp in America, where you have black Muslims who have always been American, as well as immigrants from all over the world. Just within the black muslims of the Bay Area, you have wide variation. Some are equivalent to the Mormon missionaries - always in the full black suit and tie. Others shave their head complete and wear a head covering. But you have many other black men who are not muslim that look exactly the same. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ridestrong 1 #81 December 30, 2009 I understand your point. There is a sub-set of Muslims that could be described as looking the same or similar in fashion. I hope this statement can be found as valid.*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.* ----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.---- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,121 #82 December 30, 2009 QuoteI understand your point. There is a sub-set of Muslims that could be described as looking the same or similar in fashion. I hope this statement can be found as valid. Nice bit of backpedaling there.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #83 December 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteI understand your point. There is a sub-set of Muslims that could be described as looking the same or similar in fashion. I hope this statement can be found as valid. Nice bit of backpedaling there. you don't have to be a dick about it. He noted that he understood your point and amended his original statement. You've done something rare. Made someone on the internet recognize an opinion different from their own and change their original statement. http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #84 December 30, 2009 QuoteI understand your point. There is a sub-set of Muslims that could be described as looking the same or similar in fashion. I hope this statement can be found as valid. Valid, sure. But in the context of improving security at airports, I don't see any value to generalizations as a rule, and esp for Muslims. If the TSA and others are obviously scrutinizing men with beards, the razors will quickly be put to use. Probably true already. and the person in question here has none of the characteristics you described. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ridestrong 1 #85 December 31, 2009 QuoteQuoteI understand your point. There is a sub-set of Muslims that could be described as looking the same or similar in fashion. I hope this statement can be found as valid. Valid, sure. But in the context of improving security at airports, I don't see any value to generalizations as a rule, and esp for Muslims. If the TSA and others are obviously scrutinizing men with beards, the razors will quickly be put to use. Probably true already. and the person in question here has none of the characteristics you described. That's cool... whatever I'm not even trying to relate this to airport security in any way. But since it keeps coming up... IMO I think we should screen every single man, woman and child that passes through airport security. It is the only fair way and also the most thorough.*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.* ----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.---- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
