Shooting in Orlando office bldg

[Lucky... 0]

http://www.wesh.com/news/21541263/detail.html

What's this country coming to?

[normiss 898]

I (again and still) fully support my right to defend myself at all locations.
Someone should have killed this worthless fuck.


2 dead so far.

[downwardspiral 0]

Watch your backs people. It's getting ugly out there.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[Lucky... 0]

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I (again and still) fully support my right to defend myself at all locations.
Someone should have killed this worthless fuck.


2 dead so far.

Shooters have to be stopped by all means necc

I will get hammered for this, but it would be good to look upstream with individuals like this. What if he was truely railroaded out of a job? WHat if he then lost his family via divorce and he couldn't get reemployed, etc. The downward spiral scenario. We all (at least males) identified with Michael Douglas in, "Falling Down" but then we find it so easy to jump on the bandwagon and want to draw and quarter this guy. I'm not defending this guy and usually these workplace shooters kill and injure people for effect who weren't part of their demise, so that is just ugly in and of itself. I wonder if the worker were more empowered and wass less likely to get railroaded if we would have fewer incidents like this?

[normiss 898]

Not all of us identified with that idiot role in a movie.
We should be civilized, mature adults and accept the fact that society is not responsible for our own lives and the events in them.
It's NEVER ok to kill people because life sucks for you at some point.
Suck it up people, this aint always easy.
Killing people is NOT an acceptable form of dealing with shit in your life.
Business sucks sometimes and people lose their jobs.
GET OVER IT!

[billvon 3,120]

> I wonder if the worker were more empowered and wass less likely to
> get railroaded if we would have fewer incidents like this?

If he was more empowered he'd have more power to 'railroad' someone else, so no. Life is full of injustices, tragedies and failures; no amount of empowerment, regulation or control will change that.

[Lucky... 0]

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> I wonder if the worker were more empowered and wass less likely to
> get railroaded if we would have fewer incidents like this?

If he was more empowered he'd have more power to 'railroad' someone else, so no. Life is full of injustices, tragedies and failures; no amount of empowerment, regulation or control will change that.

But kinda like the addage: An armed society is a polite society, a society with everyone armed with equal rights is a polite society. The US is probably the worst indust country in regard to workplace rights, so people have choices:

- Lump it when the big corps run you and dispose of you

- Try to sue, which is usually futile, esp if you are not from a protected class

- Go shootin

There are adiministrative actions you can take, but most people don't know them or know when it's too late. The playing field is no where near level, and I think that is the root of some of these incidents. Now some people are just born shooters, but I think many are manufactured.

[Lucky... 0]

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Not all of us identified with that idiot role in a movie.

I bet of we poled 1000 males, esp white males, youi would get a 80% empathy rate.

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We should be civilized, mature adults and accept the fact that society is not responsible for our own lives and the events in them.

That's utopia, but I love your conservative endorsement in there. When you play pretty much by teh rules andd get hammered. you will go one of 3 ways.

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It's NEVER ok to kill people because life sucks for you at some point.

Of course. It's also never ok to make life suck for another for your own greed, amusement or whatever works.

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Killing people is NOT an acceptable form of dealing with shit in your life.

I think you already covered this above.

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Business sucks sometimes and people lose their jobs.

Thank you! Yes, business before people, money before people..... I think we've finally hit on the point I was making; American Capitalism MANUFACTURES THIS KIND OF BEHAVIOR WHERE THERE WOULDN'T OTHERWISE BE ANY.

[billvon 3,120]

> An armed society is a polite society, a society with everyone armed
>with equal rights is a polite society.

That would seem to indicate that being armed is the key, and that equal rights don't matter (i.e. in both cases they're still polite.)

>The US is probably the worst indust country in regard to workplace
>rights, so people have choices:

> Lump it when the big corps run you and dispose of you
> Try to sue, which is usually futile, esp if you are not from a protected class
> Go shootin

We don't know what happened here yet. But some of the most notorious killers of our time were not disadvantaged; indeed, they had positions of power, good jobs etc. Take Ted Kaczynski. PhD, good job at a very early age, fellowship, very intelligent by any measure. He went on to kill 3 and injure 23 people.

What additional "rights" could you have given him that would have made him happier, and less prone to violence?

[warpedskydiver 0]

You really need to examine your thoughts before you post such things.

I think you are in the minority that thinks employment or a lack thereof is a reason to kill.

What you quoted was a fairly stupid Hollywood movie, life is just not that way.

[Lucky... 0]

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What you quoted was a fairly stupid Hollywood movie, life is just not that way

Sort of a minor insult, congratulations, I knew you would break your pledge within the hour

A stupid movie and not real life? A guy loses his family, house, job, and drives a POS car and lives with his miom and now they won't serve breakfast 1 minute after 10:30? Seriously, I would spend all day here citing real-life examples of that movie, do I need to or will you take judicial notice of that?

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I think you are in the minority that thinks employment or a lack thereof is a reason to kill.

It's not the loss of a job, it's the way a person was railroaded; they trade 1 misjustice for another misjustice.

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You really need to examine your thoughts before you post such things.

I have and you have yet do anything but say you disagree. Perhaps you could put your thoughts more in a scientific realm.

[Lucky... 0]

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That would seem to indicate that being armed is the key, and that equal rights don't matter (i.e. in both cases they're still polite.)

The first was a metaphore for teh second. The point I'm making is that if we have more equity we would likely have fewer of these incidents.

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We don't know what happened here yet. But some of the most notorious killers of our time were not disadvantaged; indeed, they had positions of power, good jobs etc.

Absolutely, Bill, I'm not saying the key to all peace everywhere is to actually give American workers any rights, I'm saying this section of violence, workplace violence could be greatly reduced by allowing the workers to be administratively empowered, hence have no reason to do bad things and are motivated to do positive things.

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Take Ted Kaczynski. PhD, good job at a very early age, fellowship, very intelligent by any measure. He went on to kill 3 and injure 23 people.

His beef was with a given university and a hate for technology, so either he is brillaint and ahead of his time or just a delluded nut. But that wasn't a classic workplace grudge.

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What additional "rights" could you have given him that would have made him happier, and less prone to violence?

Unionize most workplaces. The downside is that it's harder to fire lazy people, upside is that it's harder to railroad people. Take your pick, total free-run for employers or more equity and safety in our workplaces and economic security as well.

[wmw999 2,589]

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The US is probably the worst indust country in regard to workplace rights

Bullshit. You'd have to define things very, very narrowly for that to be true.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andy9o8 2]

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I bet of we poled 1000 males

Not that there's anything wrong with that; but I'll pass.

[normiss 898]

You're right, we should employ everyone on the planet, no matter what the financial circumstances are seeing we're all entitled to someone else's money.

I simply call bull shit on all of your comments.

Also rather presumptuous of you to call me a conservative simply because I believe in defending myself. Many here will tell you how few of my beliefs are in fact conservative.

[Lucky... 0]

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I bet of we poled 1000 males

Not that there's anything wrong with that; but I'll pass.

Perhaps it's better like this: I bet if we polled 1000 males.

[Lucky... 0]

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The US is probably the worst indust country in regard to workplace rights

Bullshit. You'd have to define things very, very narrowly for that to be true.

Wendy P.

Industrialized nations, not all nations. Oh yea, we are waaaaay down there.

[Lucky... 0]

Caught him.

[Lucky... 0]

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You're right, we should employ everyone on the planet, no matter what the financial circumstances are seeing we're all entitled to someone else's money.

Here we go with the conservative rheotoric. I'm referring to the US, you the world, but you have to exaggerate to *attempt* to make a point. And we don't have to employ anyone, we have to balance the playing field.

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I simply call bull shit on all of your comments.

Keyword here: Simply.

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Also rather presumptuous of you to call me a conservative simply because I believe in defending myself. Many here will tell you how few of my beliefs are in fact conservative.

I've read plenty, quit trying to backpedddal from your beliefs; wear them like a bdage.

[Andy9o8 2]

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I bet of we poled 1000 males

Not that there's anything wrong with that; but I'll pass.

Perhaps it's better like this: I bet if we polled 1000 males.

Statistically, I imagine roughly 96% of those polled would say they'd rather not be poled.

[champu 1]

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The downward spiral scenario. We all (at least males) identified with Michael Douglas in, "Falling Down" but then we find it so easy to jump on the bandwagon and want to draw and quarter this guy.

It's probably worth noting that his character never actually shoots and kills anyone in that movie. He chases off the gang members at the begining with a bat, after they crash during the driveby he shoots one of them in the leg and leaves them there, and he ends up stabbing the racist surplus store owner in a struggle for his life.

[Lucky... 0]

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I bet of we poled 1000 males

Not that there's anything wrong with that; but I'll pass.

Perhaps it's better like this: I bet if we polled 1000 males.

Statistically, I imagine roughly 96% of those polled would say they'd rather not be poled.

.....

[billvon 3,120]

>Unionize most workplaces. The downside is that it's harder to fire
>lazy people, upside is that it's harder to railroad people.

Other downsides is that it's harder to get a job to begin with, and labor costs then drive jobs overseas. So you move your workplace shootings out of the workplace by ensuring more people are unemployed; I don't know if that's really a net gain though.

>Take your pick, total free-run for employers or more equity and
>safety in our workplaces and economic security as well.

Neither is close to a realistic scenario.

[Lucky... 0]

They caught him as he went to his mom's and turned himself in. The media was interviewing him as the cops were taking him in. They asked him why he did it and he replied, "They left me to rot." Reportedly he was fired for performance issues 2 years ago. So he felt his termination was unjustified, just as we all kind of thought. That doesn't justify his action in any way, but getting fired and then not being able to get a job are his reasons. We will never know if he was dead weight or if he was railroaded.

[Lucky... 0]

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Other downsides is that it's harder to get a job to begin with, and labor costs then drive jobs overseas.

And you can control that with tariffs and taxes for American based corps using foreign labor.

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So you move your workplace shootings out of the workplace by ensuring more people are unemployed; I don't know if that's really a net gain though.

But the rate wouldn't change by that process if workers rules/rights as the 1938 FLSA that Bush murdered as well as tweaks each president unilatterally does to the US Dept of Labor. Tell me how W.E. gives workers more rights and is still able to produce products.

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Neither is close to a realistic scenario.

Sure, but we are much closer to employer free-run than we are to worker's rights.

Here's an interesting factoid: http://www.dvinitiative.com/resources/wpstats_gunsinworkplace.asp California and Florida were the most dangerous states when it comes to workplace shootings