Armed Revolt in the Obama Era? Right-Wing Gun Nuts Share Their Paranoid Worldview

[TomAiello 26]

When business and government are in each other's pockets (or more accurately, both in the pockets of a set of oligarchs) you don't have capitalism.

I think it was Benito Mussolini who described Fascism as the union of business and the state.

The fix here is to get the government out of the business world, and keep the business world off their corporate welfare.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[jcd11235 0]

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When business and government are in each other's pockets (or more accurately, both in the pockets of a set of oligarchs) you don't have capitalism.

I think it was Benito Mussolini who described Fascism as the union of business and the state.

Nice red herrings that have nothing to do with my post.

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The fix here is to get the government out of the business world, and keep the business world off their corporate welfare.

That will make Lincoln a capitalist?

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[dreamdancer 0]

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At some point the vaunted Republican noise machine stopped being about winning elections and became instead a feckless attempt at mass justification, popping out one lame excuse after another for the party's failures. And it was a short leap from there to simply hitting rewind on the rightwing's longtime romance with a Lost Cause. Like Southerners still waving the stars'n'bars 150 years after Appomattox, or Col. Custer blithely riding up that coulee into an overwhelming force of Sioux and Cheyenne warriors, today's Repub diehards will go to their graves muttering about the fascist-socialist-gun-snatching tyranny of Barack Osama, convincing themselves sotto voce that, by fighting for a lower tax-rate for the extremely wealthy, they're the true descendants of the American Revolution. As the teabag-besotted begillionaire Mitt Romney told a Republican crowd this weekend, with no apparent sense of his own absurdity, "We are the party of the revolutionaries, they [Democrats] are the party of the monarchists."

That new study indicating that conservatives might not quite understand that Stephen Colbert's wingnut rants are devastating mockery rings true. Because not understanding isn't just a failure to get the joke, it's a defense mechanism: Without a certain level of cluelessness, the whole party would be knocking around in an unstatesmanlike manner, blurting, "My God, what have I done?"

http://www.alternet.org/mediaculture/139807/gop_has_hit_the_dead-end_of_politics%3A_who%27s_going_to_buy_their_fear_and_hysteria_/?page=entire

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[TomAiello 26]

I found it!

There's an announcement here at the top of the AR15.com equipment exchange, that refers to dark skin.

The full text reads:

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5/02/2009
Added "dark" skin as a choice for users on the fly; will be incorporated under user preferences in the future. Also added main nav bar at top of page to navigate to the main sections of the site. Small number of behind the scenes bug fixes as well.

It's pretty racist to call the skin "dark," and doing it on a gun web site, with the current president is pretty conclusive. And that bit about "user preferences" is obviously some kind of code referring to a white supremacist agenda. And what about the "behind the scenes bug fixes"? Sounds to me like they're probably planning some kind of campaign of assassination and terror, most likely ending in a military coup.

Clearly, racism is rampant in the on-line gun sales community, and the firearms industry is blatantly using racism to induce panic and fear. It's high time we organize a boycott of these web sites.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[dreamdancer 0]

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I am eager to be educated here.

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The far right wing has been laying the groundwork for violent action for decades. Long before they turn dangerous, political and religious groups take their first steps down that road by adopting a worldview that justifies eventual violent action.

The particulars of the narrative vary, but the basic themes are always the same:

First: Their story is apocalyptic, insisting that the end of the world as we've known it is near.

Second: It divides the world into a Good-versus-Evil/Us-versus-Them dualism that encourages the group to interpret even small personal, social or political events as major battles in a Great Cosmic Struggle -- a habit of mind that leads the group to demonize anyone who disagrees with them.

This struggle also encourages members to invest everyday events with huge existential meaning, and as a result sometimes overreact wildly to very mundane stuff.

Third: This split allows for a major retreat from consensus reality and the mainstream culture. The group rejects the idea that it shares a common future with the rest of society, and curls up into its own insular worldview that's impervious to the outside culture's reasoning or facts.

Fourth: Insiders feel like they're a persecuted, prophetic elite who are being opposed by wicked, tyrannical forces. Left to fester, this paranoia will eventually drive the group to make concrete preparations for self-defense -- and perhaps go on the offense against their perceived persecutors.

Fifth: Communities following this logic will also advocate the elimination of their enemies by any means necessary in order to purify the world for their ideology.

All these ideas have been part of the discourse on the right for decades. You can trace their genesis all the way back to the 1950s, starting with the overheated apocalypticism of the anti-communist movement.

Over time, it came to include the dualism of the John Birch Society and assorted white supremacist groups; the persecution complex of Richard Nixon and his Silent Majority followers; the anti-liberal eliminationism that's been gathering force for the past decade; and the war on evidence-based science and reason that's always been at the heart of conservative arguments.

http://www.alternet.org/democracy/139825/the_far_right%27s_first_100_days%3A_getting_more_extreme_by_the_day/?page=entire

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[dreamdancer 0]

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A US radio shock jock barred from entering the UK said he would sue for defamation after his name appeared on the Home Office's list of 16 "least wanted".

Michael Savage, who hosts far-right talk show The Savage Nation, called Jacqui Smith, the home secretary, a "lunatic" and said he was outraged that he had been named alongside hate preachers and a member of Hamas.

Smith said yesterday she had decided to make public the names of 16 people banned since October so others could better understand what sort of behaviour Britain was not prepared to tolerate.

Smith told BBC Breakfast that Savage was "someone who has fallen into the category of fomenting hatred, of such extreme views and expressing them in such a way that it is actually likely to cause inter-community tension or even violence if that person were allowed into the country".

But Savage, whose real name is Michael Weiner, insisted he had never advocated violence.

He said: "For this lunatic Jacqui Smith, the home secretary of England [sic], to link me up with skinheads who are killing people in Russia, to put me in [the same] league with mass murderers who kill Jews on buses, is defamation.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/may/06/michael-savage-sue-jacqui-smith

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[rushmc 23]

Nice government you got going on over there

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/philip_johnston/blog/2009/05/05/should_we_be_banning_this_us_shock_jock

....just to follow your post......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[TomAiello 26]

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The far right wing has been laying the groundwork for violent action for decades....

You could easily substitute "far left" or "Islamic terrorists" or "those 4 guys in Miami" or even "those two dudes in their mom's basement."

That doesn't make it any more (or less--I do realize there are a few wackos out there really thinking that way) real, nor does it make it something that's likely to have any real effect.

Honestly, the writing you quoted seems a heck of a lot more paranoid than those guys at the gun show.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[lawrocket 3]

Ah! My two favorite political words in one sentence: "consensus" and "mainstream."

there's another word for that - "bandwagon." More specifically, "clique." For a person whose writing is "us versus them" and railing on "prophetic elite being opposed by wicked tyranicalforces" a mirror would be useful.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[steve1 5]

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I am eager to be educated here.

***The far right wing has been laying the groundwork for violent action for decades. Long before they turn dangerous, political and religious groups take their first steps down that road by adopting a worldview that justifies eventual violent action.

The particulars of the narrative vary, but the basic themes are always the same:

First: Their story is apocalyptic, end ]

Is this really factual. It seems like someone from the far left is trying hard to sound intelligent. There is more to this than just saying that people on the right are a bunch of crazed, ignorant, idiots who want violence. That is more or less what these words are saying.....

Sometimes violence is used to bring about change. Sometimes the only way left to affect a corrupt government, is for revolution. This is hardly a new idea conjured up by the far right. It is going on in many parts of the world right now.

Isn't that how our country started. Isn't that why our constitution was written. I hate war and violence. I think every other means should be exhausted first. Some countries are left with little choice in that.....

I don't think of myself as being a member of the far right. I even voted for Obama. But I also believe in the right to gun ownership without more rediculous laws that only punish honest gun owners. I'm sure more gun laws do make people on the far left feel safer, but what else do they do?

I own guns for a lot of different reasons. I hunt with them, and I use them as a tool for many other purposes that people in the city may not understand. Am I plotting to overthrow the government. The answer is no. But who knows what the future may hold.

As poplulations continues to grow, as economies become weaker, possibly even climate change may factor into this, What do you think the future holds? You don't have to be crazy to realize that a gun might be a good thing to have even then.

It's also not too far fetched to think that our own government could one day become corrupt. Wasn't that a real concern when our country started. You don't have to be a member of the far right to understand that!.....

[dreamdancer 0]

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The far right wing has been laying the groundwork for violent action for decades....

You could easily substitute "far left" or "Islamic terrorists" or "those 4 guys in Miami" or even "those two dudes in their mom's basement."

That doesn't make it any more (or less--I do realize there are a few wackos out there really thinking that way) real, nor does it make it something that's likely to have any real effect.

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There's No Ammo on the Shelves -- Is It the Gun Nuts' Fear of Obama-lypse?

"The chemistry out here is perfect for more and more racism," said Tom Metzger, the infamous leader of the white supremacist hate group White Aryan Resistance who lives in Southern California, about the Inland Empire back in 2005. "You've got all these nonwhites moving here from Orange County and Los Angeles trying to flee the crime perpetrated on them by their own kind in their ghettos, and when they come out here, they're basically shoving forced integration down the throats of the whites who have traditional claim to this area, and that is provoking a negative racist reaction among whites, as it damn well should. It's great!"

What has been simmering conflict may soon be bubbling over the edge. There is almost a sense of inevitability of a spike in hate crimes.

"In the past month, there was only one reported hate crime. But you have to wonder how many go unreported. I think a lot, " a local crime beat reporter told me. "Just go to our comments section and read what people are saying. There is definitely a perfect storm building."

In October 2008, two teenagers belonging to a local hate group shot a black man in a liquor store parking lot. Schools have been dealing with an uptick in race-based conflicts and shooting threats. Earlier this month, one of the cars of a Jewish family was trashed inside and out, its engine destroyed and swastikas painted on its doors and hood.

As I'm writing this, news is coming out that police arrested a group of six local skinheads from Hammerskin Nation for attempted murder, witness intimidation, conspiracy to commit murder and assault with a deadly weapon.

According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, Hammerskin Nation has been stepping up recruitment lately, as has every other known extremist group across the nation.

On April 15, about 200 people, mostly white, showed up at Victorville's Tea Party. Some were not hesitant to vow that they'll take violent action if "Osama's" socialist policies continued unabated.

To the protestors, the economic crisis had exposed what their government had become: a big, meddling bureaucracy that had little regard for personal liberty. Socialism was a'coming to the USA, and it was hell-bent on exploiting honest, hardworking people like themselves -- whether its being forced to bail out delinquent homeowners or having your jobs given to illegal immigrants.

http://www.alternet.org/story/139872/there%27s_no_ammo_on_the_shelves_--_is_it_the_gun_nuts%27_fear_of_obama-lypse/?page=entire

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[rushmc 23]

This loony web site you keep posting is radically funny! Keep it up
I wonder if they would link to a tin hat production/sales company?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[TomAiello 26]

I know people have asked this before, but given your location, what the heck do you care about politics in the USA?

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Amazon 7]

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I know people have asked this before, but given your location, what the heck do you care about politics in the USA?

Its a thing with JR and his multitude of threads about Ye Olde Englande

[TomAiello 26]

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I know people have asked this before, but given your location, what the heck do you care about politics in the USA?

Its a thing with JR and his multitude of threads about Ye Olde Englande

Maybe. I tend to think that John is trying to use the English experiences as a tool to argue about US policies, which is reasonable, since he lives in the US, and is a citizen.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[justinb138 0]

Hmm. In just a few sentences your article groups people looking to buy ammo in with white-supremacists, racists, murderers, extremist groups, and skinheads, and then goes even further and includes attendees of a local TEA party in there as well.

Gotta love unbiased reporting.

[TomAiello 26]

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Hmm. In just a few sentences your article groups people looking to buy ammo in with white-supremacists, racists, murderers, extremist groups, and skinheads, and then goes even further and includes attendees of a local TEA party in there as well.

Gotta love unbiased reporting.

The amazing thing to me is that the person posting that article is the one calling other people "paranoid."

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[rushmc 23]

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Hmm. In just a few sentences your article groups people looking to buy ammo in with white-supremacists, racists, murderers, extremist groups, and skinheads, and then goes even further and includes attendees of a local TEA party in there as well.

Gotta love unbiased reporting.

The amazing thing to me is that the person posting that article is the one calling other people "paranoid."

Have you went to the website he keeps linking too?

Explains a lot

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[steve1 5]

I may be bald, I may buy ammo, and I have a lot of guns. But I want to make one thing perfectly clear....I'm not a "skinhead"!

[steve1 5]

And I did not have sexual relations with that woman.

[Krip 2]

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Ok, I'll bite, what is feeding it?

Have you looked at any web sites that sell guns lately? Pretty much all of them have messages to the effect of "the scary black man is going to take away your guns." How about the NRA?

The quote about "the scary black man going to take away your guns" Reminds me of the book "The Turner Diaries".

The book was on of the things that imo set off Timathey McVeigh at oklahoma city Federal building.

In the turner diaries there's a chapter about the Gov't using blacks from the inner city to confisicate guns from liscensed gun owners that refused to turn in their guns when order by the gov't.

BTW after the thugs took away the guns they raped the defenseless women.

IMO Really far out stuff but a small portion of our society believes this crap. Tim Mcveigh acted on the propaganda. Too bad.

BTW the book "Turner diaries" was available at our local library. A person should be able to blow thru it in a few hours. It reads like a comic book but some folks

From what I'm reading here this story line in one form or another is making it's round on the net.

One Jump Wonder

[dreamdancer 0]

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I know people have asked this before, but given your location, what the heck do you care about politics in the USA?

Its a thing with JR and his multitude of threads about Ye Olde Englande

Maybe. I tend to think that John is trying to use the English experiences as a tool to argue about US policies, which is reasonable, since he lives in the US, and is a citizen.

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Arguably, the more conservative wing of the American political spectrum is correct: the old America they cling to no longer exists. And yet, the narrative that the more moderate council longs for -- one that views America as the beacon of the world, as the land of truth, freedom and liberty and justice for all -- is also a myth.

That narrative has always downplayed genocide, land theft and removal, slavery, segregation and legalized discrimination. Nowadays, it downplays border walls, racial profiling and an ever-expanding racialized prison system. The narrative has also downplayed the notion of empire and militarism, instead converting these imperial projects with the notion of a God-given right to "civilize" or dominate the world. This is the idea of Manifest Destiny. It is what drove our recent president, George W. Bush in his war against the Arab and Islamic world; he was on a mission from God. This is why U.S. and international laws were easily ignored or discarded; he was answering to a higher authority.

In this sense, both wings of the Republican Party are similar; both want to promote great American mythologies. Ingrained into the national psyche is that this is a "nation of immigrants." With the browning of America, some within the GOP rightly fear that a Dobbs-immigration obsessed nation -- which clamors for 2,000 miles of militarized walls along the U.S.-Mexico border -- will drive moderates away from the Republican Party. This is where the struggle over image takes place, though it is difficult to discern a difference. The Dobbs wing is brazenly anti-immigrant, though it is always insistent that they are only anti-illegal immigrant -- not anti-immigrant.

Yet Romney's views are very similar to Dobbs. Even McCain, always touted as a moderate on immigration, buckled under extreme right-wing pressure during his 2008 presidential bid.

Whether they are conservative or moderate, Republicans seem to agree that the United States has the inherent right to wage war on the world. The only difference is that some believe that this right comes directly from God, whereas the others believe it is simply a cultural or even genetic right -- due to American exceptionalism.

http://www.alternet.org/story/139929/the_gop_clings_to_guns%2C_gays%2C_god%2C_and_%22go-home%22/

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[dmcoco84 5]

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Interesting how Lincoln predicted the dark side of capitalism so well.

Really jcd? Really…? This shows the dark side of capitalism?

No sir… Lincoln was speaking about the end of capitalism. There is no capitalism when private industry is run and/or subsidized by government. There is no capitalism when a private entity, like the Federal Reserve Bank, controls and issues the currency of a nation. There is no capitalism with Fannie and Freddie, or congressman like Dodd and Frank. Corruption breeds when big business, like AIG, can donate thousands to political campaigns. Top four in 2008? 1) Obama 2) Dodd 3) McCain 4) Clinton
Then they get billions in bailouts.

How about we listen to the Chairman of the Communist Party USA? He tried to say Hitler emerged out of Capitalism… Nope. Hitler killed Capitalism, using fear and propaganda, with the Nationalist Socialist Party. Nationalized…Socialism.

P.1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwYwSMW_fSI&feature=channel
P.2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2vrZBXgNxo&feature=channel

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered... I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies... The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." - Thomas Jefferson

More of the dark side of capitalism? Nah…

Nor do we have capitalism when government does things like this:

Does This Sound Reasonable?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8426710993455949146

Coco

[jcd11235 0]

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Interesting how Lincoln predicted the dark side of capitalism so well.

Really jcd? Really…? This shows the dark side of capitalism?

No sir… Lincoln was speaking about the end of capitalism.

No sir… Lincoln was speaking about the end of capitalism. There is no capitalism when private industry is run and/or subsidized by government.

Incorrect. The mid nineteenth century was when capitalism started making major ground in the US. Nothing about Lincoln's quote offers any indication that he is talking about the end of capitalism. He describes capitalism accurately. He offered absolutely no reference to government subsidization.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[dmcoco84 5]

Well… I’ve been busy. But I have been thinking about this. And its funny… cause we are both wrong. Lincoln was not speaking about the evils of capitalism, nor the end of it. I really need to get more sleep, and not post impulsively...

We are a nation of laws, not of men. Greed, corruption, and fraud will always exist. If laws are broken, prison is where those people should be. Capitalism, free markets… they are not evil. Those who abuse and manipulate them are… but by becoming informed and educated citizens, we can end their continuation… and stop the loss of our liberties.

The SEC was handed Madoff all wrapped up and pretty, and they did nothing. We have appropriate laws and regulation… the regulators did not do their jobs.

If you wish to take that quote as talking about the evils of capitalism… so be it. I don’t care, not worth the time to argue. But its not… It is solely about the end of our republic… at the hands those that wish to control every aspect of our lives, and others who hate everything this great nation stands for, the Progressives.

Interesting that you didn’t care to bring up anything I said regarding the Progressives… and it was the Progressives who gave us the Fed (Wilson) and the UN (FDR). Transnationalism will be the end of our nation... when they give our sovereignty to the UN. We will be forced to answer to them... but they won't answer to us.

Government subsidies... those were my words. Sorry, meant to hit enter. With them… we have no, free market I meant... government involvement fucks up the free market up. Just look at Hilary Clinton with her vaccines for children.

D