Saiga-12, sporter goes tactical...

[LongWayToFall 0]

Ah, I see yours still has the original cocking handle.

Here is a bad ass saiga for your viewing pleasure:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUe4NWiOq5A

[ChileRelleno 0]

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Dude I am so stoked. I ordered a Saiga 12 a few months back and had it shipped to a company in Colorado to have a bullet button installed (prevents the mag from being released without a tool) and after a long wait due to being super busy, I should be expecting it in about a week. California law prevents detachable mag shotguns, so that just means its a free pass to convert it.
I was under the impression that you needed to weld the old trigger mechanism holes after you relocated them forward?
Which parts out of your list were the US parts in order to satisfy the 922r? I will probably be trying to do my conversion on the cheap. I just finished a FAL build, and went the whole 9 yards with parkerizing it myself and all. A fun project. On some of those pictures, there is a slide handle sticking up on the right side, do the saigas not have one to begin with? I have an ak parts kit and it has one on the right side, but sticking straight out.

P.S. you luck mofo, being able to mount the 20 round drum! Which are the cheapest 10 rounders available? What about 2 rounders? I plan on doing some hunting.

922r compliance parts, US Made, are bolded for you.
1) TAPCO AK T6 Buttstock, six position collapsible. = 1 part
2) Surefire Gen 1, tri-rail forearm. = 1part
3) SAW pistol grip. - (minus) 1 part, since it doesn't come with one.
4) Tromix FCG.= 3 parts
5) Tromix trigger guard.
6) Chaos gas piston (gas puck).= 1 part
7) TAPCO gas piston (operating rod)
8 ) Gunfixer gas plug
9) Kreb's Custom, combat sights, FSB uses AR post, rear is a ghost ring with aperture insert.
10) TAPCO M4 rubber recoil pad
11) MD Arms, 20rnd drum magazine (pictured) Mags count as 3 parts.
12) Surefire, 2, 8, 10 & 12 rnd stick magazines.
Mags count as 3 parts.
..........................................
Shop around, I found Surefire 10 rounders for $43.95 at Carolina Shooters Supply.
He has 2 rounders too, $34.95
Greg queen is the owner, great guy to do business with.

Mississippi Auto Arms also sells Saiga parts/accessories.
They too are excellent to do business with.

I didn't TIG/smooth the leftover holes, I used vinyl plugs, they look like the OEM rivets.

Charging handle, short horizontal is OEM, you can buy Galil style and mount it, there are a a few others I think. Some have made their own designs, welded/bolt on.
Tromix Arms, should be releasing a bolt on, that is pretty cool looking, very soon.

Did it all myself too, fun project.

Have you visited the forums at Saiga-12.com?
Great resource for anything you want to know.

ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414
Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868

[LongWayToFall 0]

So with the pistol grip, since you added it, and it is on the list, you need an extra part, and since the grip is US made, it cancels itself out?

So I count 9 parts you need, right?

I have gone to saiga12.com, it was awhile ago, I should refresh myself since my saiga is almost here!

[JohnRich 4]

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So I count 9 parts you need, right?

Aren't these import gun laws stupid?

A shotgun with only 9 American made parts is evil and banned.

But the same shotgun with 10 American made parts is okay.

This is the kind of stupid shit that gun-o-phobes dream up.

[Nelyubin 0]

http://www.izhmash.ru/rus/product/saiga12.shtml

The shot-gun is issued by the manufacturer in several updatings, at you not the most successful.
In any case it not the weapon for sports or rest. In Russia him get and farmers (for self-defense) and the private security enterprises use basically.

For the narrow purposes and in Russia alter. http://www.ohotniki.com/new/444.htm
The universal weapon does not exist.

[LongWayToFall 0]

You would never believe it, but Bush Sr. put that law in place. I about shit myself.

[ChileRelleno 0]

@ JohnRich, yes, incredibly ass'inine.

@ LongWayToFall,
Please note, the saiga with a threaded barrel has 14 counted parts.
You can use this worksheet to help you keep track.
If you add a pistol grip, whether foreign or US made, it counts against the list, since it is a non-sporting item.

http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/BuildSaigaVerifyCompliance

ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414
Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868

[ChileRelleno 0]

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So I count 9 parts you need, right?

Aren't these import gun laws stupid?

A shotgun with only 9 American made parts is evil and banned.

But the same shotgun with 10 American made parts is okay.

This is the kind of stupid shit that gun-o-phobes dream up.

A foreign made firearm, imported in a sporting configuration, can have as many foreign made parts as it needs.
It is only when you change it from sporting to non-sporting, i.e. tactical/combat, that you must observe 922r, and the firearm can only have a maximum 10 foreign made parts.
It is not the US made parts your counting, it is the foreign and non-sporting, e.g. pistol grip.

Check the link I provided, it is Saiga 12 specific for compliance, but it can be used for any foreign firearm.

ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414
Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868

[AggieDave 6]

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A foreign made firearm, imported in a sporting configuration, can have as many foreign made parts as it needs.
It is only when you change it from sporting to non-sporting, i.e. tactical/combat, that you must observe 922r, and the firearm can only have a maximum 10 foreign made parts.
It is not the US made parts your counting, it is the foreign and non-sporting, e.g. pistol grip.

.


I did not know this. So how does this effect things like the H&K UMC or the FN P90?

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[ChileRelleno 0]

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A foreign made firearm, imported in a sporting configuration, can have as many foreign made parts as it needs.
It is only when you change it from sporting to non-sporting, i.e. tactical/combat, that you must observe 922r, and the firearm can only have a maximum 10 foreign made parts.
It is not the US made parts your counting, it is the foreign and non-sporting, e.g. pistol grip.

.


I did not know this. So how does this effect things like the H&K UMC or the FN P90?

With the P90, your not going to be using it for sport, i.e. hunting, skeet or etc.
I do not think it is imported as a sporting firearm.
The only change you'd make to it is full auto/select fire, which opens up a whole nother can of worms

As for the HK UMC?
Do you mean the USC rifle or the USP pistol?
I'm not familiar with UMC, unless your talking el cheapo Remingtom ammo.
.............................

I do not believe the above weapons are imported in a sporting config.
They are not AKs, therefore not AS evil

The only way we could get the Saigas imported was to have them put in this sporting config and this was meant to skirt the ban on their import in their original tactical/combat config.

ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414
Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868

[TomAiello 26]

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I did not know this. So how does this effect things like the H&K UMC or the FN P90?

Aren't the US P90's made at the FNH-USA facility in Columbia, South Carolina?

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[LongWayToFall 0]

Sweet link, makes it really simple.

It is important to know that it is only illegal to assemble a non sporting rifle that is non 922r compliant, it is perfectly legal to own one. This means that if you buy a saiga 12 from your friend, a dealer, whoever, and it does not meet the parts count, it is not your problem. So about all of the foreign guns, if you can get your hands on what you want, you are fine.

It is important to know also, that just about never has someone been convicted solely on 922r non compliance, it almost always is in addition to other crimes such as armed robbery etc etc.

[LongWayToFall 0]

What length barrel do you have, btw? Is it threaded?

[ChileRelleno 0]

18", threaded.

Going to order a good brake, reduce some of that recoil.

ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414
Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868

[warpedskydiver 0]

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18", threaded.

Going to order a good brake, reduce some of that recoil.

It's a shotgun, port the bbl on the 10' and 2' with alternating rows of five each with a diameter of 1/8"

the recoil will be greatly reduced without added length on the bbl.

I make brakes so yes I do know something about them, but the shotgun does not need one because the bbl is so thin they are easily ported.

[warpedskydiver 0]

Unless you want the ability to remove the brake.

You can use the threads to attach a core sampler.

[LongWayToFall 0]

How bad will that slow slugs down?
I was thinking along the lines of something like this:

http://www.saiga-12.com/proddetail.asp?prod=S12-PolyChoke-II

[warpedskydiver 0]

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How bad will that slow slugs down?
I was thinking along the lines of something like this:

http://www.saiga-12.com/proddetail.asp?prod=S12-PolyChoke-II

It will not slow them down, it may even help out the speed if done correctly by eliminating the turbulence preceding the projectile.

[warpedskydiver 0]

That will work just fine.

I make Brakes for rifles and design other things as well.

If I were to choose a choke for that shotgun I would probably choose that one.

[LongWayToFall 0]

I have the parts kit for an underfolding yugo ak, and to meet the california length requirement of 30 inches, I need to build a muzzle brake somewhere around 4-5 inches. Any tips for 1. most effective reduction in recoil and muzzle reduction and most importantly 2. making it such that it cannot be defined as a flash hider? My plan was to take the original threaded bit that protects the muzzle threads and weld a tube over it, while I am at it I might as well drill a couple holes as well right?


P.S. Cool job!

[deibido 0]

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Lasers suck ass, unless you are designating something.

Or its night, and your laser is IR being viewed through NODs.

"User assumes all risk"

[warpedskydiver 0]

That would be true unless your opponent might have them as well, either captured or procured through one of many different countries making them available.

[LongWayToFall 0]

Well, it finally arrived. Taking his balls took quite some time, and it is sad to see the guy in such a condition. A well hung pistol grip should help the self esteem though!

Getting ready for a conversion.....

[AggieDave 6]

You know, its still a sweet looking shotgun in the stock form!

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[LongWayToFall 0]

Yeah it does have a cool look to it. That massive chunk of metal behind the magazine compliments of the state of california doesn't help though. I should probably put a handful of rounds through it before I rip it apart and let the metal shavings fly.