ChileRelleno 0 #1 April 12, 2009 I bought a Saiga-12, it is a semi auto, 12g, smoothbore shotgun, it is of Russian manufacture, on the famous/infamous AK-47 platform. It is imported into the US in a sporting configuration, Monte carlo stock, no pistol grip, a shoddy trigger linkage due to the trigger being moved rearward several inches (adversely affecting balance) and mediocre iron sights. Many of these are purchased with the express intent of conversion back to their original configuration, Tactical/Combat. In order to legally convert to a non-sporting config, one must meet 922r requirements, namely, no more than 10 foreign parts allowed. Once met, one can mount any capacity magazine I am one of those, and these pictures show my conversion, before/after. It is not finished, I will be removing the OEM front bead sight after sighting in the Krebs combat sights, mount a forearm vertical grip and light/laser. I may also mount a Aimpoint red dot sight. I have installed the following US made parts. 1) TAPCO AK T6 Buttstock, six position collapsible. 2) Surefire Gen 1, tri-rail forearm. 3) SAW pistol grip. 4) Tromix FCG. 5) Tromix trigger guard. 6) Chaos gas piston (gas puck). 7) TAPCO gas piston (operating rod) 8 ) Gunfixer gas plug 9) Kreb's Custom, combat sights, FSB uses AR post, rear is a ghost ring with aperture insert. 10) TAPCO M4 rubber recoil pad 11) MD Arms, 20rnd drum magazine (pictured) 12) Surefire, 2, 8, 10 & 12 rnd stick magazines. Before http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/Saiga12.jpg http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/HomeDefense.jpg After http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/100_5959.jpg http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/100_5962.jpg ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lefty 0 #2 April 13, 2009 *sniff* So beautiful... *sniff* Excuse me. Really neat looking firearm. Good work! Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful. -Calvin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #3 April 13, 2009 Man, I was digging your pictures until I saw the XD. I really don't like those guns at all. The Saiga is something I've been looking at for a while, its a neat design. A mini iron dot would be a perfect fit on that shotgun. http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=65--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 0 #4 April 13, 2009 Quote Man, I was digging your pictures until I saw the XD. I really don't like those guns at all. The Saiga is something I've been looking at for a while, its a neat design. A mini iron dot would be a perfect fit on that shotgun. http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=65 And what is it, you, find wrong with the SA XD? Here, like it even less http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/SAXD9.jpg I don't suppose you find anything wrong with these either? http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/357and45.jpg I was actually going to buy a Aimpoint COMP C3 - 2 MOA for it... Just as soon as I get a aluminum quad rail forearm. Oh yeah... Dave... Go to the Gym! ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #5 April 13, 2009 Dude, worked out this morning before work. I don't like the grip on the XD and I don't like all the extra crap they put on the handgun. It would have been a good handgun with out the little "loaded" indicators. I like the 1911. I'm a big 1911 fan.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #6 April 13, 2009 It looks a lot like mine, except I've got a folding stock and a forward grip. Oh, and HK style sights How do you like the MD20? Mine has been flawless since I got it (but that's only been about a month now). Dave, I've been thinking of an irondot for mine for a while. As an aside, what do you not like about the XD? I don't have one, but I've been looking at them, and I'd be curious to hear your views.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #7 April 13, 2009 QuoteI don't like the grip on the XD and I don't like all the extra crap they put on the handgun. It would have been a good handgun with out the little "loaded" indicators. I don't mind the grip. I agree on the indicators, but I think they wanted something that could get into the restrictive markets, and some of them require the chamber indicator.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #8 April 13, 2009 QuoteJust as soon as I get a aluminum quad rail forearm. Where have you seen one? I've found aluminum tri-rails, and a separate top rail, but I'd prefer a one piece quad rail.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #9 April 13, 2009 QuoteI don't mind the grip. I agree on the indicators, but I think they wanted something that could get into the restrictive markets, and some of them require the chamber indicator. I see it as stuff that isn't needed that will probably break and fall into the action at a really inopportune time. Same with plastic recoil buffers things and accu-wedges.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveJack 1 #10 April 13, 2009 Quote Quote Man, I was digging your pictures until I saw the XD. I really don't like those guns at all. The Saiga is something I've been looking at for a while, its a neat design. A mini iron dot would be a perfect fit on that shotgun. http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=65 And what is it, you, find wrong with the SA XD? Here, like it even less http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/SAXD9.jpg I don't suppose you find anything wrong with these either? http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s190/ChileRelleno/357and45.jpg I was actually going to buy a Aimpoint COMP C3 - 2 MOA for it... Just as soon as I get a aluminum quad rail forearm. Oh yeah... Dave... Go to the Gym! I have a SA XD 40 Subcompact. I love it. I added a Crimson Tide laser. It's the perfect carry weapon for me. I don't know why AggieDave says he doesn't like them. But different people have different opinions and I respect that. Sweet job with the Saiga-12 Chile!!! But don't you think the aimpoint is overdoing it a bit for a shotgun? I have one for my AR-15 but for the range of a shotgun I would think a laser would be a better match. I would appreciate your thoughts on this. You sure as hell seem to know what your doing with your Saiga-12 project. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 0 #11 April 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteJust as soon as I get a aluminum quad rail forearm. Where have you seen one? I've found aluminum tri-rails, and a separate top rail, but I'd prefer a one piece quad rail.They are around, problem is finding them in stock. I may get this one when it is available, http://www.mississippiautoarms.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=247 If not, then yeah, I was going to get the Tri with a top rail e.g. http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-105/SAIGA-12-ALUMINUM-TRI/Detail ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #12 April 13, 2009 Dude, the second link has the shotgun setup just like I was imagining, with an Iron Dot. I really agree with the previous who said that an Aimpoint is overkill for a shotgun.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 0 #13 April 13, 2009 Quote I have a SA XD 40 Subcompact. I love it. I added a Crimson Tide laser. It's the perfect carry weapon for me. I don't know why AggieDave says he doesn't like them. But different people have different opinions and I respect that. Sweet job with the Saiga-12 Chile!!! But don't you think the aimpoint is overdoing it a bit for a shotgun? I have one for my AR-15 but for the range of a shotgun I would think a laser would be a better match. I would appreciate your thoughts on this. You sure as hell seem to know what your doing with your Saiga-12 project. I plan a light/laser for home defense. As for the Red Dot, it all depends, slugs at 50+ yards in bright daylight, can't hurt, slugs at 100 yards, pushing the range, but damned skippy the Aimpoint would help. Best thing I put on her so far, was the Krebs Combat sights, they are very nice. Honestly tho, the Aimpoint would very likely spend most of it's time atop my new Smith & Wesson M&P 15X. She arrives next Friday. ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 0 #14 April 13, 2009 QuoteDude, the second link has the shotgun setup just like I was imagining, with an Iron Dot. I really agree with the previous who said that an Aimpoint is overkill for a shotgun.Sheeeez.... LaRue, BSA, Aimpoint or whatever, a red dot is a red dot, by any other name is a red dot. I can co witness on my FSB, just as easily as the little fold up ring. ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveJack 1 #15 April 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteDude, the second link has the shotgun setup just like I was imagining, with an Iron Dot. I really agree with the previous who said that an Aimpoint is overkill for a shotgun.Sheeeez.... LaRue, BSA, Aimpoint or whatever, a red dot is a red dot, by any other name is a red dot. I can co witness on my FSB, just as easily as the little fold up ring. I see your point considering slugs at 50+ yards. I was thinking more of a close range home defense situation with the laser. An Aimpoint would work in both situations where a laser might be limited in a long range or bright light situation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #16 April 13, 2009 Lasers suck ass, unless you are designating something. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #17 April 13, 2009 Quote a red dot is a red dot, by any other name is a red dot. There are advantages and disadvantages to each kind of optic. They're definitely not all the same.It doesn't matter, though, I have my own opinions and everyone has theirs. Even though everyone else has a wrong opinion.Ok, seriously, I could sit around and talk guns with someone like you for hours on end.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #18 April 13, 2009 An Aimpoint is probably the most rugged, Burris fast fire is really good too and VERY low profile. Anything can be broken. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #19 April 13, 2009 Check out this one, especially the camo paint job. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #20 April 13, 2009 Quote Check out this one, especially the camo paint job. That skull camo paint is pretty neat. He ought to do the magazine that way too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #21 April 13, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyp5we2ySDo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #22 April 13, 2009 I was unaware of this model, it has me really intrigued and I might have to look at a winter project this year. Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #23 April 13, 2009 They are easier to build than a bolt action Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 0 #24 April 14, 2009 Once you have the shotty, the conversion parts, a dremel and a few handtools, e.g. mallet, punches, screwdrivers. You can do the conversion in .5 hour. What takes time is if you take the time to refinish the gun (which you should). Strip, degrease, bead blast, parkerizing, baked on coatings, paint and such. .................................. I totaled everything up, gun, parts, refinishing, magazines and etc... Total investment, $1,821.34. Enjoyment... $Priceless. ChileRelleno-Rodriguez Bro#414 Hellfish#511,MuffBro#3532,AnvilBro#9, D24868 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LongWayToFall 0 #25 April 15, 2009 Dude I am so stoked. I ordered a Saiga 12 a few months back and had it shipped to a company in Colorado to have a bullet button installed (prevents the mag from being released without a tool) and after a long wait due to being super busy, I should be expecting it in about a week. California law prevents detachable mag shotguns, so that just means its a free pass to convert it. I was under the impression that you needed to weld the old trigger mechanism holes after you relocated them forward? Which parts out of your list were the US parts in order to satisfy the 922r? I will probably be trying to do my conversion on the cheap. I just finished a FAL build, and went the whole 9 yards with parkerizing it myself and all. A fun project. On some of those pictures, there is a slide handle sticking up on the right side, do the saigas not have one to begin with? I have an ak parts kit and it has one on the right side, but sticking straight out. P.S. you luck mofo, being able to mount the 20 round drum! Which are the cheapest 10 rounders available? What about 2 rounders? I plan on doing some hunting. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
