jakee 1,581 #601 February 21, 2010 Quote I may not be an engineer, but I have a good understanding of 'Basic physics' and it is 'very simple' to see that many anomalies occurred on 9/11. Are you joking? Do you know how absolutely ludicrous it sounds for you to say that high school physics allows you to interpret the collapses of some of the most massive skyscrapers in the world? Do you honestly think that high school physics is enough for you to be able to understand the behaviours of all the different materials and elements of those structures, and how the forces through each element change as other parts of the structure fail? Honestly? Could you design a skyscraper, or any structural part of it? No, because you don't understand how they work. So how can you understand how they collapse? Quote As you are an engineer, claiming that one must also be an engineer to fathom the mechanics of gravity and it’s forces on an object is not only unprofessional, it is also arrogant, ignorant and misleading. It's unprofessional for a trained engineer to tell a layman that he doesn't understand an engineering problem, because said layman has no engineering background? Really? Just think of all those Civil Engineering firms paying big salaries to trained professionals when they could be getting by with Joe Bloggs and his high school physics diplomaDo you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #602 February 21, 2010 I think I'll add a bit to what jakee was saying, which i agree with 100%. Even the best and brightest engineering students, who get straight A's in high school physics, calculus, and chemistry, spend another 4 years or more at University learning as much as can be crammed into their head. Then, after garduating, they can go on to grad school or enter the work force. Grad school is several more years of studying. Those who enter the workforce need considerable experience before they can apply for and take the PE exams, which must be passed before one can call his/her self a professional engineer. In comparison, high school classes cover the bare basics, i.e. just enough info to get yourself in trouble.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #603 February 21, 2010 QuoteI may not be an engineer, but I have a good understanding of 'Basic physics' and it is 'very simple' to see that many anomalies occurred on 9/11. I wouldn't cite having taken a high school biology class as sufficient background for bringing a case of malpractice against an orthopedic surgeon because a bone didn't heal quite how you thought it should. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pirana 0 #604 February 22, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteIt was a lie. Cellphones do work in airplanes; if anyone had asked an expert they could have told them that. They work until about 9k then they don't work anymore. Wow, I really wish someone would have told me that before I called baseops mid-flight a few months ago to report a change in our flight plan...on my cell phone...from 22k feet...and had a conversation with them. This has moved from making points to being humorous. (Probably happened a while back but I was holding out hope). It is documented fact that cell phones do work at altitude, but the evidence is ignored because it does not fit the opinion. Classic CT attitude towards evidence. If you are correct Mr Rhys, better hope nobody ever pokes holes in your tinfoil hat." . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites timmyfitz 0 #605 February 22, 2010 Quoteand have excelled in every activity that I have applied myself to. Until now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #606 February 23, 2010 QuoteUntil now. Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep is not an easy task and many can't be bothered to do so, even though their beliefs are in line with mine. More and more people are waking up, but those of your ilk are in too deep to allow yourself to. What is most humorous is the attempts to suggest that what I am saying is ridiculous, and that you guys have no interest. This thread and the plethora of others related to it would not have so many posts if this was the case, simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and inconsiderate, it is naïve. 500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, but you all cling on to these manufactured lies that have been fed to you but Rupert Murdoch (PANC) and his cronies. These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report, the report that Belgium guy admits is wrong, bilvon knows is wrong, yet won’t admit that this report is all you/we have to go on (from the authorities), we only have the word of our media and governments, you know those guys that you all mock in other threads for being corrupt… I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official story’ is correct, if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth, a weak story pushing a corrupt agenda, backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple that wish only to go with the flow to ‘conclude’ a deep intricate mystery for self comfort. Most are too busy being workers to even give it a passing thought. This spineless faith is the bane of our human race, we have not achieved such great feats by simply believing what we are told but buy pushing for further truth to know what is possible and what is not, it has taken great people with audacious suggestions and opposing popular belief to move us forward in life. This is true patriotism; Patriotism is word all to often used in America but not so often understood. Look it up! The denier mindset is akin to the mainstream belief that the world was flat, this is what the people were told, this is what the majority believed and it took people that were willing to be ridiculed and attacked to set the record straight. Faith is not enough for me, the facts speak for themselves, and you simply need to listen to them."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #607 February 23, 2010 QuoteIt is documented fact that cell phones do work at altitude, but the evidence is ignored because it does not fit the opinion. Classic CT attitude towards evidence. Then it should be easy for you to clear this one up, show me the documentation that makes you so sure that in September 2001 this was the case. please."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites matthewcline 0 #608 February 23, 2010 Did you see the show on TLC (is that on the telly down under?) where 4 "Truthers" (where did that name come from?) who all had different reasons why the towers fell (and all believed they where right) watched scientists try and PROVE them right but only proved ALL four where wrong? Those same four guys all refused to believe what they saw with their own two eyes, they where wrong, and science proved it, but they decided that their belief would better than truth. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #609 February 23, 2010 QuoteI wouldn't cite having taken a high school biology class as sufficient background for bringing a case of malpractice against an orthopedic surgeon because a bone didn't heal quite how you thought it should. If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it in laymans tearms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Then with your knowledge acquired you would have reasonable grounds to question the authenticity of the said orthopedic surgon."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,090 #610 February 23, 2010 >Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. > simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns >pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and >inconsiderate, it is naïve. 2. Double standards in the application of criticism. >500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST >report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you 11. Suggesting that unconvincing evidence is grounds for dismissing it >I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely 8. Assuming criticism requires no burden of proof. >These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report 7. Presenting insufficient evidence or proof. >only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official >story’ is correct 13. Asserting that claims which have not been proven false must be true, and vice versa (Argument from ignorance). >if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth 12. Use of vague, exaggerated or untestable claims. > backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >The denier mindset 6. Pejorative labeling of proponents as 'promoters', 'pseudoscientists' or practitioners of 'pathological science. >the facts speak for themselves 15. They put forward their assumptions as if they were universal truths. You only hit 9 of them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jakee 1,581 #611 February 23, 2010 Quote500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. Rhys, do you have no concept of the colour gray? Do you understand that it's not a choice between Bush/Cheney et al being either a) squeaky clean or b) responsible for 9/11? Who here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? QuoteIf any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, No, you won't. You lack the capacity to understand what is credible and what is not. You only differentiate between what supports you and what does not. How else do you explain your acceptance of a theory that would require a passenger jet to disappear in midair a hundred feet above the Washington beltway and your refusal to accept the opinion of a major demolitions firm operating in New York on 9/11 based solely on your own lay opinion of what seismometers can record, even though you know absolutely nothing about seismometers or seismic analysis? You disappeared from that discussion pretty quick, didn't you? QuoteI would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. Yes, you would think that, wouldn't you? By the way, what does your constant labelling of non-truthers as spineless, brainwashed lemming sheeple on the looney right fringe (even those who are blatantly liberal) blindly swallowing establishment propaganda say about you?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,090 #612 February 23, 2010 >If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it >in laymans tearms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Are you suggesting that a surgeon might understand more about orthopedic surgery than someone who took biology in high school, and had no medical training? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #613 February 23, 2010 QuoteAre you joking? Do you know how absolutely ludicrous it sounds for you to say that high school physics allows you to interpret the collapses of some of the most massive skyscrapers in the world? Do you honestly think that high school physics is enough for you to be able to understand the behaviours of all the different materials and elements of those structures, and how the forces through each element change as other parts of the structure fail? Honestly? Could you design a skyscraper, or any structural part of it? No, because you don't understand how they work. So how can you understand how they collapse? I really cannot believe you ask this question seriously but I’ll answer it (again) because you don't seem to be able to grasp how knowledge can be transferred from one to another. Citing my high school experience was simply proving Belgium guys assertions that I have “No Clue Whatsoever” about what we are talking about, that arrogant and unprofessional standpoint is simply an attempt to further belittle me and suggest that ‘everything I say is right’ and ‘everything he says is wrong’. Of course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could, I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things easily, not for keeping my socks up and having a nice tie knot. I may not be able to build a skyscraper but many of these guys do, and many of then have spent the last 5 years constructing detailed and complete journals and papers pertaining to the issue. These you ignore as ‘tin foil hat’ conspiracies and much like the NIST, unscientifically dismiss them without understanding or admitting to understand what they are suggesting."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Belgian_Draft 0 #614 February 23, 2010 Let's see..... You admit you are not an enigineer.... You admit you could not design a skyscpraper.... You admit your understanding of physics stops at a high school level.... yet you think you have the ability to say the truthers are right and everyone else is wrong? Even though the truthers have laws of physics, engineering, chemistry, and mathematics working against their every theory? Even though they are constantly proven wrong by the qualified experts who outnumber them 100-1 or 1000-1? Do you have any idea how stresses change within a steel structure when a section of that structure is heated to a point where the cubic structure changes from BCC to FCC? If you needed a broken leg operated on who would you trust....the 100 surgeons who say it will be fine with a plate and a couple screwws, or the 1 who says you need a transplant from a goat? All you have proven here is that you know how to parrot a bunch of idiots.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,090 #615 February 23, 2010 >Of course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on >this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could . . . . Then you don't even know what you don't know. At college we used to refer to sophomores as "wise fools" because they had learned just enough to think things were easy. It took them a few more years to realize that their superficial level of knowledge didn't really mean much (other than being a foundation on which to build.) You have a few years to go to get to even that level. >I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things >easily, not for keeping my socks up and having a nice tie knot. Getting awards doesn't mean much. Twice I was a finalist in the NASA/NSTA SSSIP; doesn't mean I can fly a space shuttle. Now, if you had actually designed a few buildings, and seen one or two of them fail, that might improve your credibility a bit. Until then, the angle of "I'm real smart because I got a blue ribbon in high school!" is about as credible as the whuffo who is sure that skydivers go up because they saw a DVD once. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #616 February 23, 2010 QuoteWho here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? All those that believe the NIST report is correct and believe that there is no need for another investigation into the buildings collapses. Not only to incriminate those that may be responsable, but to make sure that anything like this never happens again. This is all the truth movement wants. QuoteNo, you won't. You lack the capacity to understand what is credible and what is not. You only differentiate between what supports you and what does not. How else do you explain your acceptance of a theory that would require a passenger jet to disappear in midair a hundred feet above the Washington beltway and your refusal to accept the opinion of a major demolitions firm operating in New York on 9/11 based solely on your own lay opinion of what seismometers can record, even though you know absolutely nothing about seismometers or seismic analysis? You disappeared from that discussion pretty quick, didn't you? This assertion is incorrect, I do not have enough evidence available to me to suggest what happened at the pentagon, and I only have enough evidence to show what most likely did not happen. your suggestion that it is only my own interpretation in my own lay opinion of what seismometers can record that determines my position is a crude assumption. There is a wealth of information (and crap) the internet for me to study to consider all arguments and who may be telling the truth, who is gaining and who is not, and allowing me to make my own personal decision of what I believe and what I do not. i don't just listen to 1 person to gather my information, I listen to everybody, and hence my potential thousands of replies to you, and everybody that bothers to reply to these messages. You all seem frustrated that I don't conform to your suggestions, but instead I go off and study them with what information I have available to me, and further question until I am convinced. This is why I am not Islamic, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist... it is why I am agnostic and not atheist. To understand these philosophies there are far too many obvious inconsistencies, and Chinese whispers over 1000's of years that have been in the hands of the powerful, these make them far from close to credible. As much as the opinions of those that stand to gain millions, billions or trillions of dollars for their conclusions, is also not immediately credible, nobodies are. We must question everything and be satisfied that our movements are moving us all in the right direction. We can create what we want, so it is what we desire that determines what happens. We all have the same desires and intent. Whether we are in touch with these and know how to control them and know what is fair or not, determines our happiness, our satisfaction and the way we live our lives. I have done well for myself using this philosophy. I have the most beautiful wife, an awesome job, an unbelievable income from it ($150-200k combined), have travelled much of the world and I am happy, very happy! I already have much of what I ever desired, I have no need to try to prove myself to anyone, The only person I need to prove myself to, is me. I can see when someone is lying, and so can you. Shyam Sunder and John gross are quite clearly nervous, lying, inconsistent and contradictory in this presentation It clearly points out some of the prominent faults with the investigation. go and watch it again, be honest with yourself and ask yourself whether or not you are satisfied with the use of 20 million dollars to make these report. Look to see if you think if they are speaking from a script, or from the top of their heads using their comprehensive understanding of the multi million dollar investigation the are leading, and have done so for many years. Be honest with yourself while doing so. While you are at it, watch Part 2 and part 3 this stuff is very simple to comprehend, and has been put together by a high school teacher, it is being used to represent the voices of more than 1000 architects and engineers, as it is comprehensive yet concise in scope and easily understood by the layman. This further explains to our resident engineering guru, the illustrious Belgium guy,that one need not be a licenced and decreed engineer to understand what is false and what is not. Interpreting the skyscraper of bullshit that is the official NIST report is something that is not so easy to do, and that fact is completely on purpose."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,090 #617 February 23, 2010 >and has been put together by a high school teacher . . . Sometimes you need to be smarter than your typical high school teacher to understand civil engineering. >that one need not be a licenced and decreed engineer to understand >what is false and what is not. No. But sometimes you need more experience than you garner in a classroom full of teenagers. Stopping spitball fights may indeed be a useful life skill, but civil engineers who design large buildings have more relevant experience when it comes to understanding building collapses. I think this guy gets touted a lot because for most truthers, a high school teacher is the most intelligent, authoritative guy they've ever met. Which is fine - but is a poor substitute for real experience and education. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhys 0 #618 February 23, 2010 QuoteSometimes you need to be smarter than your typical high school teacher to understand civil engineering. This is going around in circles Bill, are you simply trying to frustrate me into a tantrum of negativity, or have you simply not taken the time to consider this discussion fairly and completely. In case you didn't notice, his work is being used to represent the 1000+ (and growing) engineering and architectural professionals, who are at the forefront of the exponential progress that is currently happening with the truth movement against all odds. Putting complicated, highly debatable subject matter into concise presentations that are easily understood by the layman, is no easy task. David Chandler knows his stuff, and is well spoken. He is quite obviously considerably more correctly educated in the subject than you. He has taken the time to present these findings in a professional manner, gain the respect of millions of people and have his work used to represent the most highly regarded truth movement faction in existence. The 20 million dollar report was amended directly due to his questions, and work. This action rendered many of your opinions incorrect; the moment NIST included freefall in their hypothesis. They failed to explain it, as have you, or anyone else. It is quite obvious you are still in denial of that. Then you have the audacity to dismiss his credibility in a whim to protect you own integrity? Your arrogance is outstanding! Be honest with yourself Bill, there is nothing typical about David Chandler. Your use of that word in your reply gave you an out because you were not necessarily describing him, but giving the impression that you were, without accountability. This is the type of phycological behaviour you are now destined to cling to, until you decide to be honest with yourself that is. Finding ways to lie without lying, instead of telling the truth. Quote No. But sometimes you need more experience than you garner in a classroom full of teenagers. Stopping spitball fights may indeed be a useful life skill, but civil engineers who design large buildings have more relevant experience when it comes to understanding building collapses. I think this guy gets touted a lot because for most Truthers, a high school teacher is the most intelligent, authoritative guy they've ever met. Which is fine - but is a poor substitute for real experience and education. Once again your naivety and arrogance in this subject is beyond comprehension. This is not very becoming of a moderator and questiones the integrety of anything you say."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,090 #619 February 23, 2010 >are you simply trying to frustrate me into a tantrum of negativity . . . No. Based on your comments and unending attacks against everyone who disagrees with you, I think you're already there. >In case you didn't notice, his work is being used to represent the 1000+ >(and growing) engineering and architectural professionals, who are at the >forefront of the exponential progress that is currently happening with the >truth movement against all odds. Yes, you've been posting that for several years now. But like Bill Cole's meteor, it seems to keep getting pushed further and further back, and is fading farther into obscurity every time another deadline is announced, breathlessly touted, then allowed to fade away. Remember how excited you were about Sept 11, 2009 "revelation" by the AE911 group? It was "only a matter of time" before we learned the truth. Then it got pushed back to October. And then it quietly faded away. And now your latest is: "The investigation to date is a farce that will unravel itself in the next year or two, GUARANTEED!" I have a feeling that when it doesn't unravel, you will hope that that prediction fades away as well. (At which point you will surely have another.) >Putting complicated, highly debatable subject matter into concise >presentations that are easily understood by the layman, is no easy task. Yep. Indeed, many complex subjects can be simplified into an explanation that is simple, concise, intuitive - and completely wrong. The 45 degree rule is a good example. >there is nothing typical about David Chandler. . . . >This is the type of phycological behaviour you are now destined to cling to . . . >Once again your naivety and arrogance in this subject . . . When all you have left is personal attacks (and defense of the authority of a high school teacher) you have basically conceded the argument. It doesn't surprise me that the truther movement is falling apart. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites philh 0 #620 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteUntil now. Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep is not an easy task and many can't be bothered to do so, even though their beliefs are in line with mine. More and more people are waking up, but those of your ilk are in too deep to allow yourself to. What is most humorous is the attempts to suggest that what I am saying is ridiculous, and that you guys have no interest. This thread and the plethora of others related to it would not have so many posts if this was the case, simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and inconsiderate, it is naïve. 500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, but you all cling on to these manufactured lies that have been fed to you but Rupert Murdoch (PANC) and his cronies. These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report, the report that Belgium guy admits is wrong, bilvon knows is wrong, yet won’t admit that this report is all you/we have to go on (from the authorities), we only have the word of our media and governments, you know those guys that you all mock in other threads for being corrupt… I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official story’ is correct, if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth, a weak story pushing a corrupt agenda, backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple that wish only to go with the flow to ‘conclude’ a deep intricate mystery for self comfort. Most are too busy being workers to even give it a passing thought. This spineless faith is the bane of our human race, we have not achieved such great feats by simply believing what we are told but buy pushing for further truth to know what is possible and what is not, it has taken great people with audacious suggestions and opposing popular belief to move us forward in life. This is true patriotism; Patriotism is word all to often used in America but not so often understood. Look it up! The denier mindset is akin to the mainstream belief that the world was flat, this is what the people were told, this is what the majority believed and it took people that were willing to be ridiculed and attacked to set the record straight. Faith is not enough for me, the facts speak for themselves, and you simply need to listen to them. You say more and more people are waking up, do you have any actualt stats to back this up or is yet another baselsss claim? We may be reapeting ourselves because you refuse to answer simple questions. Ill ask mine again, if the Bush administration planned 9/11 to support their plans for war in Iraq why did thhey not put one single Iraqi on the planes. Why did they not fake some evidence linking 9/11 to Iraq? You say the lies are fed to us by rupert Murdoch so why is that BBC and other media outlets also agree conspiracy theoriests are nonsese. Are they in the pay of Murdoch as well.? What on Earth has Christianity got to do with 9/11 conspiracies? If you look into the modern skeptical movement you will find that almsot all of them oppose 9/11 conspiracy nuts and alsmot all of them are atheists or agnostics. Your linking of Christianity and faith to those that doubt the vilidity of paranoid fantasies is ridculous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jakee 1,581 #621 February 23, 2010 QuoteCiting my high school experience was simply proving Belgium guys assertions that I have “No Clue Whatsoever” about what we are talking about, No, Rhys, you were citing it as proof that uou can understand what was happening inside those structures. I may not be an engineer, but I have a good understanding of 'Basic physics' and it is 'very simple' to see that many anomalies occurred on 9/11. As you are an engineer, claiming that one must also be an engineer to fathom the mechanics of gravity and it’s forces on an object is not only unprofessional, it is also arrogant, ignorant and misleading. You really, really do need to be an engineer to understand these things. QuoteOf course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could, I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things easily, I grasp things quickly too. I was advanced years ahead at school, and could get straight As in the sciences and maths throughout high school with very little effort. I also started an Engineering degree at university, and you know what? It's really fucking hard. and it contains a lot that is counter intuitive, and it involves a huge amount of precise technical knowledge that you simply cannot pick up as you go along. As Billvon said, that you think you are remotely up to speed on these matters only shows that you don't even know what you don't know.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jakee 1,581 #622 February 23, 2010 Quote Quote Who here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? All those that believe the NIST report is correct and believe that there is no need for another investigation into the buildings collapses. In other words, no, you don't have any concept of the colour gray. Quote This assertion is incorrect, I do not have enough evidence available to me to suggest what happened at the pentagon, and I only have enough evidence to show what most likely did not happen. And yet you have, twice now, posted an explanation that requires a passenger jet to disappear in midair low over DC, and you have reacted very angrily to any suggestion that the explanation is false. Quote your suggestion that it is only my own interpretation in my own lay opinion of what seismometers can record that determines my position is a crude assumption. There is a wealth of information (and crap) the internet for me to study to consider all arguments and who may be telling the truth, who is gaining and who is not, and allowing me to make my own personal decision of what I believe and what I do not. Jim Hoffman is a software engineer. What is his training in seismic analysis? What sources had you read back when you flat out stated that seismometers could not possibly be accurate enough to draw the conclusions that said demolitions firm had made? What's your source refuting them, Rhys? Why do you think they are lying? Quote We must question everything and be satisfied that our movements are moving us all in the right direction. You don't question everything, though, do you? You reject one side and believe the other. Where did the plane go? Have you questioned that? Have you emailed them and asked for their explanation of that glaring hole?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Belgian_Draft 0 #623 February 23, 2010 QuoteIt's really fucking hard +10HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites champu 1 #624 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteI wouldn't cite having taken a high school biology class as sufficient background for bringing a case of malpractice against an orthopedic surgeon because a bone didn't heal quite how you thought it should. If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it in laymans terms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Then with your knowledge acquired you would have reasonable grounds to question the authenticity of the said orthopedic surgon. Absolutely you'd have grounds to raise the question. But suppose the rest of the orthopedic surgeons (roughly 20,100 of them; you said "100s" so I'll give you 300 on your side) all reviewed the case and said, "No, the doc didn't do anything wrong." Do you think your biology class would help you decide who was right or do you think the fact that you had a limp you were pissed off about would help you decide who was right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pirana 0 #625 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteIt is documented fact that cell phones do work at altitude, but the evidence is ignored because it does not fit the opinion. Classic CT attitude towards evidence. Then it should be easy for you to clear this one up, show me the documentation that makes you so sure that in September 2001 this was the case. please. Do your own footwork. Google cell phone use, just takes a few keystrokes. Nothing special about being at altitude. Signals are weaker, calls get dropped easier, and they chew up capacity because they are hitting multiple stations at once - but there are plenty of people that have used them, and continue to use them. Basically, there is nothing to prevent their use, other than airline rules. Private pilots use their cells on a very regular basis. The seatback phones use the same technology - the only difference is that they are more reliable. You can find the details on why by doing a little reading on your own. Many sources indicate they do work - read them on your own. I can't find a single source that says they do not work, other than Loose Change - and even they retracted that claim in the revised edition of the tripe they peddle." . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 Next Page 25 of 41 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
timmyfitz 0 #605 February 22, 2010 Quoteand have excelled in every activity that I have applied myself to. Until now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #606 February 23, 2010 QuoteUntil now. Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep is not an easy task and many can't be bothered to do so, even though their beliefs are in line with mine. More and more people are waking up, but those of your ilk are in too deep to allow yourself to. What is most humorous is the attempts to suggest that what I am saying is ridiculous, and that you guys have no interest. This thread and the plethora of others related to it would not have so many posts if this was the case, simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and inconsiderate, it is naïve. 500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, but you all cling on to these manufactured lies that have been fed to you but Rupert Murdoch (PANC) and his cronies. These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report, the report that Belgium guy admits is wrong, bilvon knows is wrong, yet won’t admit that this report is all you/we have to go on (from the authorities), we only have the word of our media and governments, you know those guys that you all mock in other threads for being corrupt… I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official story’ is correct, if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth, a weak story pushing a corrupt agenda, backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple that wish only to go with the flow to ‘conclude’ a deep intricate mystery for self comfort. Most are too busy being workers to even give it a passing thought. This spineless faith is the bane of our human race, we have not achieved such great feats by simply believing what we are told but buy pushing for further truth to know what is possible and what is not, it has taken great people with audacious suggestions and opposing popular belief to move us forward in life. This is true patriotism; Patriotism is word all to often used in America but not so often understood. Look it up! The denier mindset is akin to the mainstream belief that the world was flat, this is what the people were told, this is what the majority believed and it took people that were willing to be ridiculed and attacked to set the record straight. Faith is not enough for me, the facts speak for themselves, and you simply need to listen to them."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #607 February 23, 2010 QuoteIt is documented fact that cell phones do work at altitude, but the evidence is ignored because it does not fit the opinion. Classic CT attitude towards evidence. Then it should be easy for you to clear this one up, show me the documentation that makes you so sure that in September 2001 this was the case. please."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #608 February 23, 2010 Did you see the show on TLC (is that on the telly down under?) where 4 "Truthers" (where did that name come from?) who all had different reasons why the towers fell (and all believed they where right) watched scientists try and PROVE them right but only proved ALL four where wrong? Those same four guys all refused to believe what they saw with their own two eyes, they where wrong, and science proved it, but they decided that their belief would better than truth. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #609 February 23, 2010 QuoteI wouldn't cite having taken a high school biology class as sufficient background for bringing a case of malpractice against an orthopedic surgeon because a bone didn't heal quite how you thought it should. If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it in laymans tearms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Then with your knowledge acquired you would have reasonable grounds to question the authenticity of the said orthopedic surgon."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #610 February 23, 2010 >Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. > simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns >pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and >inconsiderate, it is naïve. 2. Double standards in the application of criticism. >500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST >report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you 11. Suggesting that unconvincing evidence is grounds for dismissing it >I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely 8. Assuming criticism requires no burden of proof. >These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report 7. Presenting insufficient evidence or proof. >only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official >story’ is correct 13. Asserting that claims which have not been proven false must be true, and vice versa (Argument from ignorance). >if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth 12. Use of vague, exaggerated or untestable claims. > backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple 5. Use of ridicule or ad hominem attacks in lieu of arguments. >The denier mindset 6. Pejorative labeling of proponents as 'promoters', 'pseudoscientists' or practitioners of 'pathological science. >the facts speak for themselves 15. They put forward their assumptions as if they were universal truths. You only hit 9 of them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,581 #611 February 23, 2010 Quote500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. Rhys, do you have no concept of the colour gray? Do you understand that it's not a choice between Bush/Cheney et al being either a) squeaky clean or b) responsible for 9/11? Who here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? QuoteIf any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, No, you won't. You lack the capacity to understand what is credible and what is not. You only differentiate between what supports you and what does not. How else do you explain your acceptance of a theory that would require a passenger jet to disappear in midair a hundred feet above the Washington beltway and your refusal to accept the opinion of a major demolitions firm operating in New York on 9/11 based solely on your own lay opinion of what seismometers can record, even though you know absolutely nothing about seismometers or seismic analysis? You disappeared from that discussion pretty quick, didn't you? QuoteI would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. Yes, you would think that, wouldn't you? By the way, what does your constant labelling of non-truthers as spineless, brainwashed lemming sheeple on the looney right fringe (even those who are blatantly liberal) blindly swallowing establishment propaganda say about you?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #612 February 23, 2010 >If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it >in laymans tearms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Are you suggesting that a surgeon might understand more about orthopedic surgery than someone who took biology in high school, and had no medical training? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #613 February 23, 2010 QuoteAre you joking? Do you know how absolutely ludicrous it sounds for you to say that high school physics allows you to interpret the collapses of some of the most massive skyscrapers in the world? Do you honestly think that high school physics is enough for you to be able to understand the behaviours of all the different materials and elements of those structures, and how the forces through each element change as other parts of the structure fail? Honestly? Could you design a skyscraper, or any structural part of it? No, because you don't understand how they work. So how can you understand how they collapse? I really cannot believe you ask this question seriously but I’ll answer it (again) because you don't seem to be able to grasp how knowledge can be transferred from one to another. Citing my high school experience was simply proving Belgium guys assertions that I have “No Clue Whatsoever” about what we are talking about, that arrogant and unprofessional standpoint is simply an attempt to further belittle me and suggest that ‘everything I say is right’ and ‘everything he says is wrong’. Of course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could, I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things easily, not for keeping my socks up and having a nice tie knot. I may not be able to build a skyscraper but many of these guys do, and many of then have spent the last 5 years constructing detailed and complete journals and papers pertaining to the issue. These you ignore as ‘tin foil hat’ conspiracies and much like the NIST, unscientifically dismiss them without understanding or admitting to understand what they are suggesting."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #614 February 23, 2010 Let's see..... You admit you are not an enigineer.... You admit you could not design a skyscpraper.... You admit your understanding of physics stops at a high school level.... yet you think you have the ability to say the truthers are right and everyone else is wrong? Even though the truthers have laws of physics, engineering, chemistry, and mathematics working against their every theory? Even though they are constantly proven wrong by the qualified experts who outnumber them 100-1 or 1000-1? Do you have any idea how stresses change within a steel structure when a section of that structure is heated to a point where the cubic structure changes from BCC to FCC? If you needed a broken leg operated on who would you trust....the 100 surgeons who say it will be fine with a plate and a couple screwws, or the 1 who says you need a transplant from a goat? All you have proven here is that you know how to parrot a bunch of idiots.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #615 February 23, 2010 >Of course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on >this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could . . . . Then you don't even know what you don't know. At college we used to refer to sophomores as "wise fools" because they had learned just enough to think things were easy. It took them a few more years to realize that their superficial level of knowledge didn't really mean much (other than being a foundation on which to build.) You have a few years to go to get to even that level. >I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things >easily, not for keeping my socks up and having a nice tie knot. Getting awards doesn't mean much. Twice I was a finalist in the NASA/NSTA SSSIP; doesn't mean I can fly a space shuttle. Now, if you had actually designed a few buildings, and seen one or two of them fail, that might improve your credibility a bit. Until then, the angle of "I'm real smart because I got a blue ribbon in high school!" is about as credible as the whuffo who is sure that skydivers go up because they saw a DVD once. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #616 February 23, 2010 QuoteWho here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? All those that believe the NIST report is correct and believe that there is no need for another investigation into the buildings collapses. Not only to incriminate those that may be responsable, but to make sure that anything like this never happens again. This is all the truth movement wants. QuoteNo, you won't. You lack the capacity to understand what is credible and what is not. You only differentiate between what supports you and what does not. How else do you explain your acceptance of a theory that would require a passenger jet to disappear in midair a hundred feet above the Washington beltway and your refusal to accept the opinion of a major demolitions firm operating in New York on 9/11 based solely on your own lay opinion of what seismometers can record, even though you know absolutely nothing about seismometers or seismic analysis? You disappeared from that discussion pretty quick, didn't you? This assertion is incorrect, I do not have enough evidence available to me to suggest what happened at the pentagon, and I only have enough evidence to show what most likely did not happen. your suggestion that it is only my own interpretation in my own lay opinion of what seismometers can record that determines my position is a crude assumption. There is a wealth of information (and crap) the internet for me to study to consider all arguments and who may be telling the truth, who is gaining and who is not, and allowing me to make my own personal decision of what I believe and what I do not. i don't just listen to 1 person to gather my information, I listen to everybody, and hence my potential thousands of replies to you, and everybody that bothers to reply to these messages. You all seem frustrated that I don't conform to your suggestions, but instead I go off and study them with what information I have available to me, and further question until I am convinced. This is why I am not Islamic, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist... it is why I am agnostic and not atheist. To understand these philosophies there are far too many obvious inconsistencies, and Chinese whispers over 1000's of years that have been in the hands of the powerful, these make them far from close to credible. As much as the opinions of those that stand to gain millions, billions or trillions of dollars for their conclusions, is also not immediately credible, nobodies are. We must question everything and be satisfied that our movements are moving us all in the right direction. We can create what we want, so it is what we desire that determines what happens. We all have the same desires and intent. Whether we are in touch with these and know how to control them and know what is fair or not, determines our happiness, our satisfaction and the way we live our lives. I have done well for myself using this philosophy. I have the most beautiful wife, an awesome job, an unbelievable income from it ($150-200k combined), have travelled much of the world and I am happy, very happy! I already have much of what I ever desired, I have no need to try to prove myself to anyone, The only person I need to prove myself to, is me. I can see when someone is lying, and so can you. Shyam Sunder and John gross are quite clearly nervous, lying, inconsistent and contradictory in this presentation It clearly points out some of the prominent faults with the investigation. go and watch it again, be honest with yourself and ask yourself whether or not you are satisfied with the use of 20 million dollars to make these report. Look to see if you think if they are speaking from a script, or from the top of their heads using their comprehensive understanding of the multi million dollar investigation the are leading, and have done so for many years. Be honest with yourself while doing so. While you are at it, watch Part 2 and part 3 this stuff is very simple to comprehend, and has been put together by a high school teacher, it is being used to represent the voices of more than 1000 architects and engineers, as it is comprehensive yet concise in scope and easily understood by the layman. This further explains to our resident engineering guru, the illustrious Belgium guy,that one need not be a licenced and decreed engineer to understand what is false and what is not. Interpreting the skyscraper of bullshit that is the official NIST report is something that is not so easy to do, and that fact is completely on purpose."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #617 February 23, 2010 >and has been put together by a high school teacher . . . Sometimes you need to be smarter than your typical high school teacher to understand civil engineering. >that one need not be a licenced and decreed engineer to understand >what is false and what is not. No. But sometimes you need more experience than you garner in a classroom full of teenagers. Stopping spitball fights may indeed be a useful life skill, but civil engineers who design large buildings have more relevant experience when it comes to understanding building collapses. I think this guy gets touted a lot because for most truthers, a high school teacher is the most intelligent, authoritative guy they've ever met. Which is fine - but is a poor substitute for real experience and education. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #618 February 23, 2010 QuoteSometimes you need to be smarter than your typical high school teacher to understand civil engineering. This is going around in circles Bill, are you simply trying to frustrate me into a tantrum of negativity, or have you simply not taken the time to consider this discussion fairly and completely. In case you didn't notice, his work is being used to represent the 1000+ (and growing) engineering and architectural professionals, who are at the forefront of the exponential progress that is currently happening with the truth movement against all odds. Putting complicated, highly debatable subject matter into concise presentations that are easily understood by the layman, is no easy task. David Chandler knows his stuff, and is well spoken. He is quite obviously considerably more correctly educated in the subject than you. He has taken the time to present these findings in a professional manner, gain the respect of millions of people and have his work used to represent the most highly regarded truth movement faction in existence. The 20 million dollar report was amended directly due to his questions, and work. This action rendered many of your opinions incorrect; the moment NIST included freefall in their hypothesis. They failed to explain it, as have you, or anyone else. It is quite obvious you are still in denial of that. Then you have the audacity to dismiss his credibility in a whim to protect you own integrity? Your arrogance is outstanding! Be honest with yourself Bill, there is nothing typical about David Chandler. Your use of that word in your reply gave you an out because you were not necessarily describing him, but giving the impression that you were, without accountability. This is the type of phycological behaviour you are now destined to cling to, until you decide to be honest with yourself that is. Finding ways to lie without lying, instead of telling the truth. Quote No. But sometimes you need more experience than you garner in a classroom full of teenagers. Stopping spitball fights may indeed be a useful life skill, but civil engineers who design large buildings have more relevant experience when it comes to understanding building collapses. I think this guy gets touted a lot because for most Truthers, a high school teacher is the most intelligent, authoritative guy they've ever met. Which is fine - but is a poor substitute for real experience and education. Once again your naivety and arrogance in this subject is beyond comprehension. This is not very becoming of a moderator and questiones the integrety of anything you say."When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,090 #619 February 23, 2010 >are you simply trying to frustrate me into a tantrum of negativity . . . No. Based on your comments and unending attacks against everyone who disagrees with you, I think you're already there. >In case you didn't notice, his work is being used to represent the 1000+ >(and growing) engineering and architectural professionals, who are at the >forefront of the exponential progress that is currently happening with the >truth movement against all odds. Yes, you've been posting that for several years now. But like Bill Cole's meteor, it seems to keep getting pushed further and further back, and is fading farther into obscurity every time another deadline is announced, breathlessly touted, then allowed to fade away. Remember how excited you were about Sept 11, 2009 "revelation" by the AE911 group? It was "only a matter of time" before we learned the truth. Then it got pushed back to October. And then it quietly faded away. And now your latest is: "The investigation to date is a farce that will unravel itself in the next year or two, GUARANTEED!" I have a feeling that when it doesn't unravel, you will hope that that prediction fades away as well. (At which point you will surely have another.) >Putting complicated, highly debatable subject matter into concise >presentations that are easily understood by the layman, is no easy task. Yep. Indeed, many complex subjects can be simplified into an explanation that is simple, concise, intuitive - and completely wrong. The 45 degree rule is a good example. >there is nothing typical about David Chandler. . . . >This is the type of phycological behaviour you are now destined to cling to . . . >Once again your naivety and arrogance in this subject . . . When all you have left is personal attacks (and defense of the authority of a high school teacher) you have basically conceded the argument. It doesn't surprise me that the truther movement is falling apart. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
philh 0 #620 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteUntil now. Opposing ridicule from the mainstream sheep is not an easy task and many can't be bothered to do so, even though their beliefs are in line with mine. More and more people are waking up, but those of your ilk are in too deep to allow yourself to. What is most humorous is the attempts to suggest that what I am saying is ridiculous, and that you guys have no interest. This thread and the plethora of others related to it would not have so many posts if this was the case, simply visiting and posting to make fun of someone’s serious concerns pertaining to all of our welfare on a global scale is not only shallow and inconsiderate, it is naïve. 500 posts later you are still repeating yourselves like a scratched record, and defending corruption and suggesting that your leaders are all squeaky clean, yet in the next thread you might visit you bash them for being corrupt. If any of you could show me some credible evidence to prove that the NIST report is correct and I am simply talking shit, then I will agree with you, but you all cling on to these manufactured lies that have been fed to you but Rupert Murdoch (PANC) and his cronies. These all use the statistics of the fraudulent NIST report, the report that Belgium guy admits is wrong, bilvon knows is wrong, yet won’t admit that this report is all you/we have to go on (from the authorities), we only have the word of our media and governments, you know those guys that you all mock in other threads for being corrupt… I would say I’m holding my own quite nicely, the ample attempts to belittle me and suggest that I am a radiophobe, only further incriminates the attacker as fraudulent and inconsistent. How about you suggest what it is that makes you so sure that the ‘official story’ is correct, if you cannot I can only suggest your thinking is in line with the feeble Christianity myth, a weak story pushing a corrupt agenda, backed by the faith of feeble minded sheeple that wish only to go with the flow to ‘conclude’ a deep intricate mystery for self comfort. Most are too busy being workers to even give it a passing thought. This spineless faith is the bane of our human race, we have not achieved such great feats by simply believing what we are told but buy pushing for further truth to know what is possible and what is not, it has taken great people with audacious suggestions and opposing popular belief to move us forward in life. This is true patriotism; Patriotism is word all to often used in America but not so often understood. Look it up! The denier mindset is akin to the mainstream belief that the world was flat, this is what the people were told, this is what the majority believed and it took people that were willing to be ridiculed and attacked to set the record straight. Faith is not enough for me, the facts speak for themselves, and you simply need to listen to them. You say more and more people are waking up, do you have any actualt stats to back this up or is yet another baselsss claim? We may be reapeting ourselves because you refuse to answer simple questions. Ill ask mine again, if the Bush administration planned 9/11 to support their plans for war in Iraq why did thhey not put one single Iraqi on the planes. Why did they not fake some evidence linking 9/11 to Iraq? You say the lies are fed to us by rupert Murdoch so why is that BBC and other media outlets also agree conspiracy theoriests are nonsese. Are they in the pay of Murdoch as well.? What on Earth has Christianity got to do with 9/11 conspiracies? If you look into the modern skeptical movement you will find that almsot all of them oppose 9/11 conspiracy nuts and alsmot all of them are atheists or agnostics. Your linking of Christianity and faith to those that doubt the vilidity of paranoid fantasies is ridculous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,581 #621 February 23, 2010 QuoteCiting my high school experience was simply proving Belgium guys assertions that I have “No Clue Whatsoever” about what we are talking about, No, Rhys, you were citing it as proof that uou can understand what was happening inside those structures. I may not be an engineer, but I have a good understanding of 'Basic physics' and it is 'very simple' to see that many anomalies occurred on 9/11. As you are an engineer, claiming that one must also be an engineer to fathom the mechanics of gravity and it’s forces on an object is not only unprofessional, it is also arrogant, ignorant and misleading. You really, really do need to be an engineer to understand these things. QuoteOf course I cannot design a skyscraper; I have not focused my energy on this. If I had then I have no doubt that I could, I achieved my general excellence award for my ability to grasp things easily, I grasp things quickly too. I was advanced years ahead at school, and could get straight As in the sciences and maths throughout high school with very little effort. I also started an Engineering degree at university, and you know what? It's really fucking hard. and it contains a lot that is counter intuitive, and it involves a huge amount of precise technical knowledge that you simply cannot pick up as you go along. As Billvon said, that you think you are remotely up to speed on these matters only shows that you don't even know what you don't know.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,581 #622 February 23, 2010 Quote Quote Who here do you think has ever said that our leading politicians are all squeaky clean? All those that believe the NIST report is correct and believe that there is no need for another investigation into the buildings collapses. In other words, no, you don't have any concept of the colour gray. Quote This assertion is incorrect, I do not have enough evidence available to me to suggest what happened at the pentagon, and I only have enough evidence to show what most likely did not happen. And yet you have, twice now, posted an explanation that requires a passenger jet to disappear in midair low over DC, and you have reacted very angrily to any suggestion that the explanation is false. Quote your suggestion that it is only my own interpretation in my own lay opinion of what seismometers can record that determines my position is a crude assumption. There is a wealth of information (and crap) the internet for me to study to consider all arguments and who may be telling the truth, who is gaining and who is not, and allowing me to make my own personal decision of what I believe and what I do not. Jim Hoffman is a software engineer. What is his training in seismic analysis? What sources had you read back when you flat out stated that seismometers could not possibly be accurate enough to draw the conclusions that said demolitions firm had made? What's your source refuting them, Rhys? Why do you think they are lying? Quote We must question everything and be satisfied that our movements are moving us all in the right direction. You don't question everything, though, do you? You reject one side and believe the other. Where did the plane go? Have you questioned that? Have you emailed them and asked for their explanation of that glaring hole?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #623 February 23, 2010 QuoteIt's really fucking hard +10HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #624 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteI wouldn't cite having taken a high school biology class as sufficient background for bringing a case of malpractice against an orthopedic surgeon because a bone didn't heal quite how you thought it should. If 100's of other orthopedic surgons would suggest so, and document it in laymans terms and cite the rules, regulations and evidence. Then with your knowledge acquired you would have reasonable grounds to question the authenticity of the said orthopedic surgon. Absolutely you'd have grounds to raise the question. But suppose the rest of the orthopedic surgeons (roughly 20,100 of them; you said "100s" so I'll give you 300 on your side) all reviewed the case and said, "No, the doc didn't do anything wrong." Do you think your biology class would help you decide who was right or do you think the fact that you had a limp you were pissed off about would help you decide who was right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pirana 0 #625 February 23, 2010 QuoteQuoteIt is documented fact that cell phones do work at altitude, but the evidence is ignored because it does not fit the opinion. Classic CT attitude towards evidence. Then it should be easy for you to clear this one up, show me the documentation that makes you so sure that in September 2001 this was the case. please. Do your own footwork. Google cell phone use, just takes a few keystrokes. Nothing special about being at altitude. Signals are weaker, calls get dropped easier, and they chew up capacity because they are hitting multiple stations at once - but there are plenty of people that have used them, and continue to use them. Basically, there is nothing to prevent their use, other than airline rules. Private pilots use their cells on a very regular basis. The seatback phones use the same technology - the only difference is that they are more reliable. You can find the details on why by doing a little reading on your own. Many sources indicate they do work - read them on your own. I can't find a single source that says they do not work, other than Loose Change - and even they retracted that claim in the revised edition of the tripe they peddle." . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
