diablopilot 2 #1 February 24, 2009 Ok, how about one for those douche bags that scream too loudly about what they are entitled to, or the bat shit crazies that want sumthin' fer nuthin'..... I'll start. http://www.azdailysun.com/articles/2009/02/20/news/opinion/20090220_opini_191224.txt QuoteTribal airspace dispute deserves quick resolution Claims by Hualapai officials of the right to control airspace and seize property off-reservation without a warrant seem dubious. Friday, February 20, 2009 As a test case of tribal airspace rights and how to enforce them, the facts are not ideal. The defendant has no fixed address in Arizona and flies a fan-powered paraglider. The Hualapai tribe has differed with the federal government for years over jurisdiction of boating and helicopter flights in the Grand Canyon on the reservation's edge. Nonetheless, the tribal case against Lionel De Antoni and his ultralight plane is proceeding, and it raises intriguing questions about the intersection of tribal sovereignty and federal oversight. De Antoni is a kind of freelance guide for European tourists -- his native language is French. He flies over scenic lands in the West, posts photos on his Web site, and books or leads tours based on the response. He lives in a motorhome, which he recently parked on federal land adjacent to the reservation. The Hualapai are interested in attracting tourists to their newly built Skywalk and want pilots to pay the tribe a fee for flying over their reservation. They assert that De Antoni was trespassing on a recent flight after not paying a fee and are seeking to fine him as much as $25,000. Further, tribal rangers went off the reservation to where De Antoni had parked his motorhome and confiscated it, along with his paraglider and some camera equipment. The motorhome has since been returned. Their attorney, former U.S. Attorney for Arizona Paul Charlton, told the Daily Sun's Cyndy Cole that the warrantless property seizure was justified because De Antoni had committed theft of tribal property by using airspace without paying for it. We're no lawyers, but that strikes us as a novel approach to prosecuting a theft case. Even if the aircraft and camera gear were regarded as evidence, the rangers would still need a warrant to go off tribal lands and seize it. We'd take the same position if a tribal member was accused of a theft off-reservation, then retreated to his home on tribal lands. There is due process involved in pursuing such criminal cases, and we don't see where De Antoni has been afforded it. As for the airspace issue, a Federal Aviation Administration spokesman told Cole that his agency has not given the Hualapai any special rights to control their airspace. Special flight rules do apply to an area above the national park that includes the reservation, but the Skywalk is not in that area and De Antoni is not accused of violating those rules or any of the general FAA rules that govern height above settled areas and other safety rules. If the Hualapai are asserting special airspace rights, the burden is on them to provide the documentation from the FAA that awards them such rights. If they think that De Antoni has been reckless or endangered others with his flights, they should file a complaint with the FAA. No one wants to see the Hualapai or any tribe subjected to buzzing aircraft that violate FAA rules. And if the Hualapai believe that culturally significant sites should be protected from aircraft, they should petition the FAA to amend the flight maps to account for them. Until then, though, the tribe needs to give way to the FAA on airspace rights in the interest of consistency that is vital to safety in the nation's skies. Ok everyone, lets all say it together...... "GO get BENT!"---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 February 24, 2009 In related news, an Arizona flight school just found a new practice area for ground reference maneuvers.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #3 February 25, 2009 Go get Bent? Who the indians or the Frenchmen.I suspect the indians will go the legal route and after numerous appeals will get approval from the Big white father to control the airspace over their land. To bad the lawyers on both sides will get paid. R.I.P. One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #4 February 25, 2009 QuoteI suspect the indians will go the legal route and after numerous appeals will get approval from the Big white father to control the airspace over their land. I -highly- doubt it. There simply is no precedent for it.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #5 February 25, 2009 The Tribe. Really, what are they thinking? Gonna go after any airliners too? This SkyWalk thing is a horrible scam and thy are just trying to get another penny.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #6 February 25, 2009 Quote Quote I suspect the indians will go the legal route and after numerous appeals will get approval from the Big white father to control the airspace over their land. I -highly- doubt it. There simply is no precedent for it. Precedent has nothing to do with it. I suspect a lawyer will take the case and if he loses so be it. The lawyer will still get paid. If he wins fines maybe retro active? FWIW back in the day when Ks was a dry state and they had a nut case for the head lawman. Amtrak and the airlines were prohibted from serving booze while traveling thru and over ks. One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #7 February 25, 2009 Do you have any idea how the national airspace system works?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #8 February 26, 2009 Quote Do you have any idea how the national airspace system works? Do you remenber/know what Ks was like in 1970-72,? We lived in KCMO at the time. The airlines and amtrak weren't happy about the state getting in their face about the booze. The issue was covered in the press. We're talking 1970 - 1972. Sorry dont remember the states head lawyer's name but we do remember he was quoted by the press. Some thing like "I don't make the laws I just enforce them. If the state has a problem with my enforcement then the state should change the law."During that same time period in Ks gambling including bingo was against the law and stores had to close on sundays. FWIW The folks in Ks were real nice, no farmer Mcnasty's that I recall. Gotta go and take a napOne Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
