birdlike 0 #26 August 27, 2008 QuoteQuoteWhat the fuck is wrong with you? You know, you really need to get a grip already. For most of us, this is just the Internet. All you see of me is on the Internet. You have no idea what I am like not on "just the Internet." Look at how wrapped up you are in what I say, and how. Would it not be fairer to say that we both should get a grip? Surely if you are this concerned with how I'm faring, it's not just me.Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #27 August 27, 2008 QuoteYou know, you really need to get a grip already. For most of us, this is just the Internet. You know, I've noticed, Andy, that all you ever do is make these discussions about the who, and you completely ignore the what. See, even when I pointed out, directly, that you neglected to say anything germane about the post that preceded yours, which was a very pithy post, you still are making this about what I need to do. Are you incapable of actually staying on point?Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #28 August 27, 2008 Whatever, dude. Rage on. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #29 August 27, 2008 Quote Quote What the fuck is wrong with you? You know, you really need to get a grip already. For most of us, this is just the Internet. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3311172#3311172 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote It is truely shameful not to honour a bet. Pay the man. (Birdlike): Who the fuck asked you? (Christelsabine): Jeffrey, slow down (if this is ever possible to you): It's the internet, you post here and have to expect replies. If wanted or not. Every poster at dizzycom is allowed to reply to your posts (or what you call post) Even I do not understand why they bother to do so ..... From everywhere in the world. You're like an open book: Visible. Jeez. How about an anger management (training)??? Even after 4 years of vacation, you're still like a cooking pot. (Skyrad): DAMN!!! Is Birdlike Peaceful Jeffery????? LMFAO... I didn't realise, now it all makes sense. Damn PJ good to have you back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #30 August 27, 2008 Quote- Person A commits the crime of theft, because he wants to install flat screens and DVD players in the headrests of his car. - Person B commits the crime of theft, because he lost his job and his kid needs insulin, and the rest of his family needs food and is in danger of malnutrition. Are both thefts equivalent? No they are not equivalent... I have No sympathy for Scumbag number one.... The second person would not exist if this country rose to the challenge of providing a basic level of healthcare to all its citzens. Most states have some form of medicaid. There are also FAR too many people who are working full time like Walmart employees who the scumbag company will not cover with benefits... and force them employees onto the state funded medical assistance.. THAT is unacceptable.. THEN we have the SCUMBAG insurance companies.. that want to deny you benefits... when they will not pay for "pre-existing" conditions.....ggggrrrr I hold them in as low of contempt as I do any other thief. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #31 August 27, 2008 QuoteOnce again, you are bringing up the idea of wrongful execution in the context of a case that is BEYOND DOUBT, INCLUDING A CONFESSION. Because it happens.. innocent people HAVE died. Given my training.. if I want a confession out of you.. given enough time.... I can get you to say anything I want.... trust me on this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
akarunway 1 #32 August 27, 2008 QuoteQuoteOnce again, you are bringing up the idea of wrongful execution in the context of a case that is BEYOND DOUBT, INCLUDING A CONFESSION. Because it happens.. innocent people HAVE died. Given my training.. if I want a confession out of you.. given enough time.... I can get you to say anything I want.... trust me on thisLOL. Something out of Pulp Fiction or Gitmo? Damn. I HAVE to jump w/ you one day.I hold it true, whate'er befall; I feel it, when I sorrow most; 'Tis better to have loved and lost Than never to have loved at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #33 August 27, 2008 PJ's back in town! LOL When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pirana 0 #34 August 27, 2008 QuoteOh. Another "fry the scumbag criminal" thread. Not to be confused with all the other "fry the scumbag criminal" threads. On the bright side, at least it's not the usual push-poll: ___Yes, society is better off without this vermin. ___No, I'm a liberal, flag-burning puke who thinks this misunderstood soul should be offered milk and cookies. I'll admit to sometimes getting caught up in emotion and feeding the "fry the scumbag" discussion. But I was really hoping to understand what is behind what appears to me to be a huge inconsistency in the attitudes towards society sending people to their death. True, in a capital punishment execution we are sending specific individuals one at a time, where as in war we send a bunch without any idea of which ones will die (but we know some portion of them will). Is that it? Does the uncertainty of who is going to die let us off the hook? Is it cool to say x number of you hundred will die, but uncool to say you John Doe will die? Is it because of emotive based biases? Does the nationalism whipped up by politicians cause us to be OK with sending thousands or even millions of young men to die; while singling people out makes us feel guilty?" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #35 August 27, 2008 >What the fuck is wrong with you? Your one warning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #36 August 27, 2008 QuoteLOL. Something out of Pulp Fiction or Gitmo? Damn. I HAVE to jump w/ you one day. There are just some people... who really do need someone to get medieval on their ass. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #37 August 27, 2008 QuoteQuoteBird -I'm not sure the point of this example. The problem here seems to be with Memphis giving a plea bargain with a short sentence. Lack of evidence? He was going to be released anyway, was never a candidate for the death penalty on the first pass. See, this is why you mistakenly think there's no "quality" to my posts -- you just don't fuckin' get it. IF you did, you'd know that the point was that this fucker was a murderer already, and if he had been executed rather than given some pissant short sentence, he would not have lived to murder his BROTHER, three other adults, and his two NEPHEWS (children, I might add. Won't you think of the children?!). He not only didn't get a death sentence for the first murder, HE DIDN'T EVEN GET THE "LIFE IN PRISON" THAT YOU FOLKS KEEP SAYING WE SHOULD COMPROMISE ON. Are you suggesting the death penalty for second degree murder convictions? What do we do with first degree convictions - kill them twice? The reason the guy was released was because the DA couldn't get a 1st degree conviction. Even if he wasn't paroled, he would have be released shortly thereafter. This case has nothing to do with the death penalty versus life sentence debate. In short, you're the one not getting it. Your beef is with the DA here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #38 August 28, 2008 Quote Quote - Person A commits the crime of theft, because he wants to install flat screens and DVD players in the headrests of his car. - Person B commits the crime of theft, because he lost his job and his kid needs insulin, and the rest of his family needs food and is in danger of malnutrition. Are both thefts equivalent? No they are not equivalent... I have No sympathy for Scumbag number one.... The second person would not exist if this country rose to the challenge of providing a basic level of healthcare to all its citzens. But then we're right back to the basic problem -- and you yourself have been bemoaning this problem: we'd be PROVIDING things to people who didn't earn them! We'd be further encouraging the entitlement and welfare mentalities. Quote THEN we have the SCUMBAG insurance companies.. that want to deny you benefits... when they will not pay for "pre-existing" conditions.....ggggrrrr I take it they won't cover your anger management treatment and anti-psychotic medications? Seriously, I heard a guy talking on the radio once and he made a really good point: we are making a huge mistake in the way we regard the purpose of medical insurance. It is supposed to be insurance. It is supposed to cover unforeseen things. It is not really reasonable to expect it to cover routine or scheduled medical treatment! Face it, if EVERY SINGLE PERSON had medical insurance coverage, and was making the typical, expected claims, there would be no point to having coverage. The companies would be essentially paying out almost all (maybe more than all) of what they'd take in! I mean, come on, the point of having insurance in the first place is to pay less in premium than the insurance pays you in benefits. That can happen only if the company is not hemhorraging claim payments. The system works because (as a very rough example) 1000 people each pay $100 in premiums. There's a pot of $100,000. Only twenty people get sick, and each person's illness costs the company $1000 in claims. The company made $80,000. Quote I hold them in as low of contempt as I do any other thief. You've stolen my heart, but I don't hold you in contempt! Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #39 August 28, 2008 QuoteQuoteOnce again, you are bringing up the idea of wrongful execution in the context of a case that is BEYOND DOUBT, INCLUDING A CONFESSION. Because it happens.. innocent people HAVE died. Given my training.. if I want a confession out of you.. given enough time.... I can get you to say anything I want.... trust me on this Financial planners HAVE ripped off clients. Should I not employ one? So what if innocent people HAVE died? They are NOT RELEVANT in a case where a person is certain NOT to be innocent. What is so hard about acknowledging that?Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #40 August 28, 2008 QuoteQuoteOnce again, you are bringing up the idea of wrongful execution in the context of a case that is BEYOND DOUBT, INCLUDING A CONFESSION. Because it happens.. innocent people HAVE died. Given my training.. if I want a confession out of you.. given enough time.... I can get you to say anything I want.... trust me on this Now you're allowing that an appreciable percentage of murderers who have confessed did so because they were TORTURED? Holy shit. Is NO confession worth a goddamned thing? We might as well clear the jails of ANYONE who has EVER CONFESSED! Your implication is that they must have been TORTURED into doing so! By the way, what is this "training" of which you speak?Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #41 August 28, 2008 Quote>What the fuck is wrong with you? Your one warning. OK. Sorry.Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #42 August 28, 2008 QuoteIs it because of emotive based biases? Does the nationalism whipped up by politicians cause us to be OK with sending thousands or even millions of young men to die; while singling people out makes us feel guilty? Good, thoughtful question. I myself have NO guilt feelings when someone I feel confident is guilty of a murder is executed. None whatsoever. I don't even really feel all that much for the family he/she leaves behind. That's life folks. Sorry for your bad luck that you happen to love a guy who could commit murder. But he has to die. It sets things right. (Oh, I know I'm gonna catch it for that last sentence, boy...)Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #43 August 28, 2008 QuoteTHEN we have the SCUMBAG insurance companies.. that want to deny you benefits... when they will not pay for "pre-existing" conditions.....ggggrrrr I forgot to add this point: Why is it wrong for an INSURANCE company to not pay for "pre-existing conditions"?? A person who goes to an insurance company and asks to buy a policy, and knows that he/she WILL need to make claims of X amount of dollars, is essentially saying to the company, "Hi. I have cancer. Would you please take my $12,000 in annual premiums and somehow magically turn it into $350,000 worth of radiation, chemotherapy, hospital stays and in-home care?" Can you see how ridiculous that would be? The insurance company exists to earn a profit by providing a service. That service DEPENDS, in the most FUNDAMENTAL WAY, on the GAMBLE that NOT EVERY INSURED is going to need to make claims! It sure as hell is not reasonable to expect the company to just write off X amount of money because someone walks into the sales office and everyone KNOWS he will need the company's money.Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterblaster72 0 #44 August 28, 2008 Quote I forgot to add this point: Thanks for that. Because it's not like you're already posting enough as it is. Not at all. Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #45 August 28, 2008 Quote Quote I forgot to add this point: Thanks for that. Because it's not like you're already posting enough as it is. Not at all. Yet another pithy, salient contribution! Boy, fella, you're on a ROLL!! Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #46 August 28, 2008 QuoteQuoteOh. Another "fry the scumbag criminal" thread. Not to be confused with all the other "fry the scumbag criminal" threads. On the bright side, at least it's not the usual push-poll: ___Yes, society is better off without this vermin. ___No, I'm a liberal, flag-burning puke who thinks this misunderstood soul should be offered milk and cookies. I'll admit to sometimes getting caught up in emotion and feeding the "fry the scumbag" discussion. But I was really hoping to understand what is behind what appears to me to be a huge inconsistency in the attitudes towards society sending people to their death. True, in a capital punishment execution we are sending specific individuals one at a time, where as in war we send a bunch without any idea of which ones will die (but we know some portion of them will). Is that it? Does the uncertainty of who is going to die let us off the hook? Is it cool to say x number of you hundred will die, but uncool to say you John Doe will die? Is it because of emotive based biases? Does the nationalism whipped up by politicians cause us to be OK with sending thousands or even millions of young men to die; while singling people out makes us feel guilty? You raise excellent points: the moral and intellectual dishonesty of it all. All killing is an abomination. That's the starting premise. Now all that's left is to parse out permutations and exceptions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #47 August 29, 2008 QuoteYou raise excellent points: the moral and intellectual dishonesty of it all. All killing is an abomination. That's the starting premise. Now all that's left is to parse out permutations and exceptions. If "all" killing could be stopped, that would probably be a good thing. But do you really feel that killing in self defense, when it is kill-or-be-killed, is also an abomination?Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pirana 0 #48 August 29, 2008 QuoteI mean, come on, the point of having insurance in the first place is to pay less in premium than the insurance pays you in benefits. No, the point of having insurance is for each individual to pay the average individual cost of care spread over a large group of people; plus an adminstrative fee of about 10% for whoever is running the program, be it a private or public entity." . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
birdlike 0 #49 August 29, 2008 QuoteQuoteI mean, come on, the point of having insurance in the first place is to pay less in premium than the insurance pays you in benefits. No, the point of having insurance is for each individual to pay the average individual cost of care spread over a large group of people; plus an adminstrative fee of about 10% for whoever is running the program, be it a private or public entity. That would seem to be the point of a wealth-redistribution scheme on the government's part. If that's what you want, say so. "Insurance" is indeed a way for a corporation to make money by doing that kind of redistribution. Are we both right? I dunno. I think we're splitting hairs. But the fact about insurance companies is that they would NOT INSURE someone if they knew that going in, he was going to cost them far in excess of how much he would ever pay them; and they would not be wrong to act that way.Spirits fly on dangerous missions Imaginations on fire Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #50 August 29, 2008 Quote Quote You raise excellent points: the moral and intellectual dishonesty of it all. All killing is an abomination. That's the starting premise. Now all that's left is to parse out permutations and exceptions. If "all" killing could be stopped, that would probably be a good thing. But do you really feel that killing in self defense, when it is kill-or-be-killed, is also an abomination? Who the fuck asked you??? Oh, wait. That's your line. Sorry. The answer is, those are the very permutations & exceptions to which I was referring. Then there needs to be a discussion as to whether a certain situation does or does not amount to self-defense - personal self-defense, societal self-defense, etc. But I think it's best to have a moral code in which the initial default position is that killing is an abomination- and then work one's way from there. I didn't know Christ or Buddha personally, but I've read some of their books, and I suspect they'd agree with my general premise. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
