kallend 2,184 #1 June 2, 2008 www.foxbusiness.com/story/markets/industries/transportation/survey-americans-skip-flying/ Is this a surprise to anyone?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,133 #2 June 2, 2008 High speed trains baby! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
happythoughts 0 #3 June 2, 2008 I try to avoid flying because of the theft problem at Tampa and Miami. I carry on everything of value (including my rig). I just put clothes in my luggage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #4 June 2, 2008 Quote High speed trains baby! Absolutely!!! I was watching a PBS special about the history of the railroad, and when it started telling about the California Zephyr, I found myself thinking: "That sounds so cool; Why the hell can't we do that today?""There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #5 June 2, 2008 Quote Quote High speed trains baby! Absolutely!!! I was watching a PBS special about the history of the railroad, and when it started telling about the California Zephyr, I found myself thinking: "That sounds so cool; Why the hell can't we do that today?" Right of way issues and NIMBYism.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,133 #6 June 2, 2008 >Why the hell can't we do that today? We can; we just need the national will to do so. If there is a bright side to $130 a barrel oil, it may be that such prices give us the will to make such things happen. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #7 June 2, 2008 This is part of the reason that high fuel prices are a mixed curse: It sucks, but until it happened, so many Americans were driving around in cars that were like huge Motorized Living Rooms. In the last decade I was always losing my little Mazda Protege in parking lots, because it would be lost in the canyon between two SUVs. It took $4/gallon gasoline to make people finally go for small cars & hybrids. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,603 #8 June 2, 2008 QuoteIn the last decade I was always losing my little Mazda Protege in parking lots, because it would be lost in the canyon between two SUVs.In Houston, at least, that means that my car gets more shade. In the summer, that can be an advantage... Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mdrejhon 8 #9 June 2, 2008 Quote High speed trains baby! More of that, please! I don't own a car anymore, I usually use carsharing these days. I use VRTUCAR in Ottawa, which is similiar to Zipcar (but at about half the price). I pay approx $3 per hour, plus about 20 cents per km (gas/insurance included). Sometimes I even use it for long roadtrips, as it results in $100 all-inclusive weekends that includes the cost of gas, insurance and approximately 400 kilometers and about 48 hours of use. It's an agentless system that's post-billed at the end of the month, giving me flexibility in payment. I just reserve online, walk up to one of 45 cars parked individually city-wide, and drive away using my universal key. I'm a driver that typically use only about 6000-7000km per year these days, so it's cheaper for me to use carsharing: Monthly bills, approximately $100 to $500 and I use the cars frequently. The $500 bill came from a month where I had two big roadtrips and about 3000km of use in one month - that's all inclusive, gas and insurance - still cheaper than car rental + gas + insurance. When I total all my 12 monthly bill payments, I see about $4000 annual cost where I'd be paying $10,000 per year for a leased recent car. In my city, there are choice of recent cars including Matrix, Yaris, Civic Hybrid. I don't need to worry about paying for gas, insurance, maintenance. It's almost like leasing a car, with the additional inconvenience of having to reserve online. Sometimes I can do it spontaneously, during off hours -- if 1 car is already used, I go to one of the other 44 cars -- but for a 2 day roadtrip, I definitely need to reserve in advance so it's not taken when I need to do the roadtrip. A nice convenience is that my city offers reduced rates for nighttime use; Sometimes I can often walk up to the car, reserve in my cellphone's browser, and then drive it away -- and stay at a friend's overnight for less than the price of taxi as a result, typically only $10 for that particular night's car use - where can you rent a car for $10 including insurance and gas? For combined use, some people pay only $50 per month; using it only to haul stuff or go to job interviews as well as areas that's outside of bus service or in a hurry to make it between multiple errands. However, I'm a more frequent user of the carshare. More convenient than car rental, less convenient than owernship. It's a good compromise for me. For the rest of the time, I try to use the train or bus. I also got lucky with a rare discount airfare from Ottawa to Los Angeles for Perris P3. I may find some economy compact, like a used Geo Metro, that has a low cost of ownership -- or if I can somehow keep insurance premiums low enough to make the gas savings worth it -- maybe a motorcycle. I'd still keep my membership in Vrtucar, as there's a wide variety of cars when I need to haul stuff or a bigger group of friends. Currently, I am ready for $200 barrel oil and $2+ per liter gas ($8 per gallon) - even if it means $50 jump tickets in Canada - but I feel sad for many people who aren't going to be ready, all the families who are going to be hurt by this. It may not happen soon, but it definitely is giving me pause when I get the urge to get back into car ownership. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #10 June 2, 2008 QuoteHigh speed trains baby! will those remove the hassle factor much? They're nearly as vunerable to bombs brought on, and more so to people outside of the train, so won't the TSA screening be about as ridiculous? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #11 June 2, 2008 According to the article in the first post, the TSA screening process was not the major concern. It was the unreliability of the airlines (late/cancelled flights, etc.) Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpin_Jan 1 #12 June 2, 2008 Quote Quote High speed trains baby! Absolutely!!! I was watching a PBS special about the history of the railroad, and when it started telling about the California Zephyr, I found myself thinking: "That sounds so cool; Why the hell can't we do that today?" The California Zephyr is still running. http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Amtrak/am2Route/Horizontal_Route_Page&c=am2Route&cid=1081256321209&ssid=10975 I wanna time a trip with a snowstorm on Bonner Pass for the added chance of chaos. Amtrak is going in the same direction as the airports as far as hoops to jump thru though. I made my last commercial flight in April 2004 from Chicago to Halifax NS and back. Traveling via air sucked! NS was a gassssss though! :) I vowed then and there, never again if I could avoid it. YMMV PULL! jumpin_Jan"Dangerous toys are fun but ya could get hurt" -- Vash The Stampede Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #13 June 2, 2008 A few years ago, I was all over the idea of flying from SoCal to Washington, and driving to Prairie from there. This year, I'm all for driving all the way, solely to avoid airport hassle. I'd rather pay more in gas and time than deal with airlines, and if I drive, my dog gets to go too, which will save me on kennel costs. Flying with an animal is a hassle! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mdrejhon 8 #14 June 2, 2008 QuoteTraveling via air sucked! NS was a gassssss though! :) I vowed then and there, never again if I could avoid it. YMMVYou can avoid it by being a little creative. For example, drive Chicago to Toronto instead, have fun in Toronto. Then, catch Porter Airlines from Toronto downtown Island Airport to Halifax. Porter Airlines is an amazing experience -- first class for the price of economy, without the security hassles at all. From a small-town-style airport minutes from a megacity downtown core. It avoids the crowded Toronto airport too, that's far away from Toronto downtown, and you fly from a tiny municipal airport. The waiting lounge is better there than many of the "Captian's Clubs" at big airports; free Wifi, and you don't even need to have airplane tickets to enjoy the lounge -- waiting family members can wait in the lounge too, as it's walk in and walk out with screening at the airplane boarding point. Good seat pitch too, North America's friendliest airline staff. Try this airline sometime if you plan to travel to Halifax again. (flyporter.com) Also, if you visit Ottawa, the new Ottawa International airport is believed to be North America's 2nd most efficient big-city airport from what I last heard two years ago. The main thing that travellers raved about Ottawa's new airport was how quick it was to leave: To disembark and reach the taxi. The bags beat me to the baggage carousel, and I was in the taxi less than 10 minutes after I disembarked the plane. Yes, this was 2008 - my return from my Argentina vacation. The longest delay was 5 minutes at the customs lineup which helped the bags beat me in an already quick baggage system, but that wasn't painful compared to my experience at other airports. Also, recently during a vacation, I flew between two points in Argentina (Bueno Aires to Bariloche, Patagonia) using Argentina's flag airline and the hassles was minimal. Screening was pretty lightweight; similiar to America 10 years ago and not terribly much of a hassle. Granted, it was purely a domestic route, and granted being a mere low-risk Canadian tourist, seemed to help a lot. My biggest complaint is the tight seat pitch of the Air Canada 767-300 going to Bueno Aires, Argentina, but there were power sockets at every seat, so I was able to plug in my laptop and other things, as well as use the IFE. Funky rainbow-color-wash LED lighting now installed in the newer planes, kept things a tad more interesting. The most painful of this trip was the connection in Toronto's big old airport, which I'm not that terribly fond of, but I'm a guy capable of sleeping nonstop in a seat of 31" pitch... Though my companion who is much taller than I, had more difficulty with the seat pitch than I. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,133 #15 June 2, 2008 >will those remove the hassle factor much? Much lighter security requirements; it was only recently that Amtrak announced it would screen some people's bags at all. Fewer delays due to weather (but still occasionally a factor) More fuel efficient = less vulnerable to increased fuel prices More "distributed" form of transportation = larger number of smaller terminals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #16 June 2, 2008 in the Bay Area we have frequent failures in the Caltrain system when someone decides to either kill themselves intentionally, or fails to jaywalk intelligently. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #17 June 3, 2008 Quote Quote Quote High speed trains baby! Absolutely!!! I was watching a PBS special about the history of the railroad, and when it started telling about the California Zephyr, I found myself thinking: "That sounds so cool; Why the hell can't we do that today?" Right of way issues and NIMBYism. Oh, it's all NIMBY....ding ding ding... That, and the design that would have to go into running a commercial enterprise on private rail routes. The Amtrak solution isn't working so well.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #18 June 3, 2008 QuoteThat, and the design that would have to go into running a commercial enterprise on private rail routes. The Amtrak solution isn't working so well. It would if the government wanted it to. Instead it's 3rd fiddle to commercial interests on the rails. The Bay Area to LA/SD bullet train has been in planning phases for 3 or 4 decades now. If done well, it would be wildly successful. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #19 June 3, 2008 QuoteQuoteThat, and the design that would have to go into running a commercial enterprise on private rail routes. The Amtrak solution isn't working so well. It would if the government wanted it to. Instead it's 3rd fiddle to commercial interests on the rails. The Bay Area to LA/SD bullet train has been in planning phases for 3 or 4 decades now. If done well, it would be wildly successful. Is there sufficient local mass-transit in place in both those locations to support it, though? I would think that would need to be in place before any "long-haul mass transit" (for lack of a better term) would be viable.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,133 #20 June 3, 2008 >The Amtrak solution isn't working so well. Gas prices send travelers to Amtrak ============================ Jun 2, 2008 3:00 AM (23 hrs ago) by Taryn Luntz WASHINGTON (Map, News) - Amtrak has seen a windfall from ballooning gas prices that are sending increasing numbers of Northeast travelers from cars to trains. The government-owned company served 6,333,027 riders in the Northeast corridor between October and April, 11.2 percent more than during the same months the year before, Amtrak spokeswoman Tracy Connell said. Nationally, the company had a 10.6 percent ridership increase during that period. “We’re attributing about half of that to gas prices — that’s what our surveys show,” Connell said. . . . The numbers have local transit officials scrambling to prepare for the possibility that swarms of commuters will switch from driving to public transportation, overwhelming already crowded systems. Metro has had ridership increases every month this year despite a fare hike in January — a phenomenon planners partially attribute to budget-breaking gas prices. Commuter rail service Virginia Railway Express had a 12 percent increase in riders in April, and officials are also attributing that to the price of gas. Although Amtrak’s October-to-April increase in ridership was particularly dramatic, the company has seen moderate ridership growth over the past five years. “It may have something to do with airline delays and security hassles, but we don’t really have data on that,” Connell said. In the Northeast corridor, ridership jumped 6.4 percent in 2004, dropped 1.6 percent in 2005, increased 1.2 percent in 2006 and leapt 5.2 percent in 2007. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #21 June 3, 2008 QuoteIt would if the government wanted it to. Instead it's 3rd fiddle to commercial interests on the rails. The Bay Area to LA/SD bullet train has been in planning phases for 3 or 4 decades now. If done well, it would be wildly successful. Concur. Also along the Colorado Front Range/I-25 corridor (locally-led initiative and the tracks already there). Central Florida "Bullet Train." The biggest anecodotal problem with rail that I used to encounter (Chicago to Champaign IL) was unpredictability. The majority of rail is now owned by private sector. Passenger rail (e.g., Amtrak) is required to slow down, stop, and wait for (sometimes) slower freight trains. Sensible sharing or prioiritized commuter rail sharing is fantastic, e.g., the DC to NYC & NYC to Boston trains (altho' not cheap), and "wildly successful" economically. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georgerussia 0 #22 June 5, 2008 Quotewill those remove the hassle factor much? They're nearly as vunerable to bombs brought on Not really. The bomb explosion in a plane has a good chance to crash the plane, killing everyone there. The same explosion in a train car wouldn't probably kill even everyone in this car, not to mention the whole train. If you look on recent terrorist activity against trains, all of them blowed up the railroads to derail the trains, and it's useless to check passenger bags to prevent that. Even in those cases the number of wounded/killed people rarely was significant. The railroad system, however, is very expensive to build nowadays comparing to 19 century. Just take a look how much money and time it takes the Santa Clara county to complete the Bart extension from Fremont to San Jose - and that's only 17 miles of railroad!* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. * Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrophyHusband 0 #23 June 5, 2008 flying fucking sucks. i recently went to new york for a weekend and had four out of four of my flights delayed, causing me to miss an event and return home extremely late. two delays were mechanical problems, 1 was a late crew member, and only one was due to weather. fuck the airline industry. "Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama www.kjandmegan.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
