Everybody seems to hate her, so lets kill her!

[Rookie120 0]

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We know Dick Lamm as the former Governor of Colorado. In that context his thoughts are particularly poignant. A while back, there was an immigration overpopulation conference in Washington, DC , filled to capacity by many of America's finest minds and leaders. A brilliant college professor by the name of Victor Hansen Davis talked about his latest book, 'Mexifornia,' explaining how immigration - both legal and illegal was destroying the entire state of California. He said it would march across the country until it destroyed all vestiges of The American Dream.



Moments later, former Colorado Governor Richard D. Lamm stood up and gave a stunning speech on how to destroy America.

<>
The audience sat spellbound as he described eight methods for the destruction of the United States . He said, 'If you believe that America is too smug, too self-satisfied, too rich, then let's destroy America .. It is not that hard to do. No nation in history has survived the ravages of time. Arnold Toynbee observed that all great civilizations rise and fall and that 'An autopsy of history would show that all great nations commit suicide.''


'Here is how they do it,' Lamm said:


'First, to destroy America, turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual and bicultural country. History shows that no nation can survive the tension, conflict, and antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures. It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse for a society to be bilingual. The historical scholar, Seymour Lipset, put it this way: 'The histories of bilingual and bicultural societies that do not assimilate are histories of turmoil, tension, and tragedy.' Canada, Belgium, Malaysia, and Lebanon all face crises of national existence in which minorities press for autonomy, if not independence. Pakistan and Cyprus have divided. Nigeria suppressed an ethnic rebellion. France faces difficulties with Basques, Bretons, Corsicans and Muslims.'


Lamm went on:


'Second, to destroy America, invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage immigrants to maintain their culture. Make it an article of belief that all cultures are equal; that there are no cultural differences. Make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are due solely to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other explanation is out of bounds.



'Third, we could make the United States an 'Hispanic Quebec' without much effort. The key is to celebrate diversity rather than unity. As Benjamin Schwarz said in the Atlantic Monthly recently: 'The apparent success of our own multi-ethnic and multicultural experiment might have been achieved not by tolerance but by hegemony. With out the dominance that once dictated ethnocentriy and what it meant to be an American, we are left with only tolerance and pluralism to hold us together.' Lamm said, 'I would encourage all immigrants to keep their own language and culture. I would replace the melting pot metaphor with the salad bowl metaphor. It is important to en sure that we have various cultural subgroups living in America enforcing their differences rather than as Americans, emphasizing their similarities.'



'Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high school.'



'My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations and business to give these efforts lots of money. I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of 'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think that their lack of success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry blaming all minority failure on the majority plation.'



'My sixth plan for America 's downfall would include dual citizenship, and promote divided loyalties. I would celebrate diversity over unity. I would stress differences rather than similarities. Diverse people worldwide are mostly engaged in hating each other - that is, when they are not killing each other. A diverse, peaceful, or stable society is against most historical precet. People undervalue the unity it takes to keep a nation together. Look at the ancient Greeks. The Greeks believed that they belonged to the same race; they possessed a common language and literature; and they worshipped the same gods. All Greece took part in the Olympic games. A common enemy, Persia, threatened their liberty. Yet all these bonds were not strong enough to overcome two factors: local patriotism and geographical conditions that nurtured political divisions. Greece fell. 'E. Pluribus Unum' -- From many, one. In that historical reality, if we put the emphasis on the 'pluribus' instead of the 'Unum,' we will 'Balkanize' America as surely as Kosovo..'



'Next to last, I would place all subjects off limits. Make it taboo to talk about anything against the cult of 'diversity.' I would find a word similar to 'heretic' in the 16th century - that stopped discussion and paralyzed thinking. Words like 'racist' or 'xenophobe' halt discussion and debate. Having made America a bilingual/bicultural country, having established multi-cultum, having the large foundations fund the doctrine of 'Victimology,' I would next make it impossible to enforce our immigration laws. I would devel op a mantra: That beca use immigration has been good for America , it must always be good. I would make every individual immigrant symmetric and ignore the cumulative impact of millions of them.'


In the last minute of his speech, Governor Lamm wiped his brow. Profound silence followed. Finally he said, 'Lastly, I would censor Victor Hanson Davis's book 'Mexifornia.' His book is dangerous. It exposes the plan to destroy America . If you feel America deserves to be destroyed, don't read that book.'



There was no applause. A chilling fear quietly rose like an ominous cloud above every attendee at the conference. Every American in that room knew that everything Lamm enumerated was proceeding methodically, quietly, darkly, yet pervasively across the United State s today. Discussion is being suppressed. Over 100 languages are ripping the foundation of our educational system and national cohesiveness. Even barbaric cultures that practice female genital mutilation are growing as we celebrate 'diversity.' Ame rican jobs are vanishing into the Third World as corporations create a Third World in America. Take note of California and other states. To date, ten million illegal aliens and growing fast. It is reminiscent of George Orwell's book '1984.' In that story, three slogans are engraved in the Ministry of Truth building: 'War is peace,' 'Freedom is slavery,' and 'Ignorance is strength.'


Governor Lamm walked back to his seat. It dawned on everyone at the conference that our nation and the future of this great democracy is deeply in trouble and worsening fast. If we don't get this immigration monster stopped within three years, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path, especially The American Dream.

I thought it was BS what I was reading so I checked on Snopes and it said it was true. It kinda shoucking to see the things he mentions actually happening today.

If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

[warpedskydiver 0]

I seem to remember that being posted here, and people discounting it as BS because they disagreed, without actually finding out if it were true.

He was right, and it is happening in plain view.

[SpeedRacer 1]

from the title, I thought it was another thread about Hillary Clinton.

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[SpeedRacer 1]

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There was no applause. A chilling fear quietly rose like an ominous cloud above every attendee at the conference.

OH MY GOD!!! AMERICA IS GOING TO HELL IN A HANDBASKET!!! as different groups with different political agendas have been saying since the beginning.



Oh, and also: Hurricane Katrina & 9/11 happened because of homos & porn.

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[algboy 0]

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from the title, I thought it was another thread about Hillary Clinton.

Quick! Someone! What's the name of that reverse ace "hero" who is all for illegal alien amnesty? I keep forgetting . . . .

[skydyvr 0]

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OH MY GOD!!! AMERICA IS GOING TO HELL IN A HANDBASKET!!!

Uh, have you looked at any international stats lately? We ARE going downhill, and fast.

What do YOU think the cause(s) might be?

. . =(_8^(1)

[SpeedRacer 1]

Gravity. And also, we're skydivers.

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[diablopilot 2]

Bingo.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[algboy 0]

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Gravity. And also, we're skydivers.

Airborne militia anyone?

[skydyvr 0]

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Gravity. And also, we're skydivers.

Way to humor it up. Care to actually make a case that Lamm's words are off track? I'm guessing that you think so.

. . =(_8^(1)

[SpeedRacer 1]

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If we don't get this immigration monster stopped within three years, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path, especially The American Dream.

Well, Lamm actually said this in 2003.
So I guess America was already destroyed by 2006. (Hey, Bill Cole was right after all!!)

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[algboy 0]

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If we don't get this immigration monster stopped within three years, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path, especially The American Dream.

Well, Lamm actually said this in 2003.
So I guess America was already destroyed by 2006. (Hey, Bill Cole was right after all!!)

Personally, I think this "disaster" is self-correcting. Jobs are going away. Turn to crime? Get your @ss shot or go to prison. Gov't freebies and handouts? The well is running dry and they will be the first to see the spigot turned off. Backlash from legals will also make illegals in the U.S. personas non grata.

Keep your powder dry. Over and out.

“Keep your elbow up!"

[skydyvr 0]

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So I guess America was already destroyed by 2006. (Hey, Bill Cole was right after all!!)

I KNEW Bill was right, dammit!

My read of Lamm's words is that since we didn't get it stopped in 3 years, we should now be in the "wildfire" stage, with America well on the path to self-destruction, not that the destruction would be complete in 3 years.

. . =(_8^(1)

[skydyvr 0]

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Personally, I think this "disaster" is self-correcting. Jobs are going away. Turn to crime? Get your @ss shot or go to prison. Gov't freebies and handouts? The well is running dry and they will be the first to see the spigot turned off. Backlash from legals will also make illegals in the U.S. personas non grata.

Good, then you obviously disagree with granting illegals amnesty, and giving them free education and medical care, and driver's licenses. All of those things work against the scenario you described.

With you 100%.

. . =(_8^(1)

[billvon 3,088]

>Care to actually make a case that Lamm's words are off track?

OK.

>First, to destroy America, turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual
> and bicultural country.

America has traditionally been a mixture of a great many cultures and languages. Ben Franklin claimed Pennsylvania was going to hell in a handbasket because of all the Dutch Germans:

"In short unless the stream of their importation could be turned from this to other colonies, as you very judiciously propose, they will soon so out number us, that all the advantages we have will not in My Opinion be able to preserve our language, and even our Government will become precarious."

This was in 1753. So if such fears means our country is collapsing, then it has been collapsing for hundreds of years. But given that it's survived as long as it has even with people like Franklin (and now Lamm) panicking, I'm not too worried.

>History shows that no nation can survive the tension, conflict, and
>antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures.

Again, people have been cowering before the fears of the evil outsiders for as long as the country has existed. The Irish are all penniless, unskilled drunks who are going to be a drain on our economy. The Italians are all criminals who will turn us into one big criminal enterprise - and most of em don't even speak English! The Germans refuse to learn English completely, and have their own schools and own printing presses just to keep their language alive. Heck, soon we'll have our government speaking German!

We survived those too.

>It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse
>for a society to be bilingual.

Yep. We can all recall how quickly Belgium and Canada collapsed.

>Second, to destroy America, invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage
>immigrants to maintain their culture.

I have this image of a bunch of people sitting in an Irish pub, drinking Guinness, margaritas and Pacifico, eating nachos and little frankfurters, complaining about how damaging all that multiculturalism is to America, and pledging to never support anything like that.

>Make it an article of belief that
>all cultures are equal; that there are no cultural differences.

No one claims "there are no cultural differences." Just compare an Irish pub to a Mexican cantina on March 17th.

>Make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are
>due solely to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other
>explanation is out of bounds.

?? It's also due to the economic conditions they grow up in, the influence of their parents and the expectations set for them by their friends, community and society at large. There are many other minor factors, and discussion of those is fine.

The explanation that "they're lazy stupid blacks" is indeed now out of bounds, which is a very good thing.

>'Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least
>educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated,
>undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this
>second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high school.'

This is a good point overall. Education _must_ be one of our top priorities if we hope for a future America that can compete in the world market.

>My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations
>and business to give these efforts lots of money.

What efforts? Education? Cultural preservation?

>I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of
>'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think that their lack of
>success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry
>blaming all minority failure on the majority plation.'

The conflation of victimology and race is sorta silly, given how many people have taken up that mantle now, from gun owners to christians to racists to the rich. (And sorta funny coming in a speech describing how americans are 'victims' of multiculturalism, bilingualism etc.)

>'My sixth plan for America 's downfall would include dual citizenship,
>and promote divided loyalties.

I think one of the biggest problems in the US today is that appalling ignorance that many americans have concerning the rest of the world. Dual citizenship is one way to combat that. The Peace Corps (and similar volunteer efforts) is another great way.

>I would celebrate diversity over unity. I would stress differences rather
>than similarities.

I'd do both, personally.

>Next to last, I would place all subjects off limits. Make it taboo to talk
>about anything against the cult of 'diversity.'

Which, of course, is a self-contradictory statement.

>I would devel op a mantra: That beca use immigration has been good
>for America , it must always be good. I would make every individual
>immigrant symmetric and ignore the cumulative impact of millions of
>them.'

Immigration hasn't just been good for America; it created America. It will continue and we will continue to benefit from it. We could certainly do a better job of controlling it than we do now - but that's our problem to solve.

>Lastly, I would censor Victor Hanson Davis's book 'Mexifornia.' His book
>is dangerous. It exposes the plan to destroy America . If you feel
>America deserves to be destroyed, don't read that book.'

It's available on Amazon. It is no more censored than "America Libre" is.

>Every American in that room knew that everything Lamm enumerated >was proceeding methodically, quietly, darkly, yet pervasively across
> the United State s today.

And every historian in the room knew that these exact same fears have been expressed over and over again for the past few hundred years - and the disasters predicted have never come to pass.

[algboy 0]

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Personally, I think this "disaster" is self-correcting. Jobs are going away. Turn to crime? Get your @ss shot or go to prison. Gov't freebies and handouts? The well is running dry and they will be the first to see the spigot turned off. Backlash from legals will also make illegals in the U.S. personas non grata.

Good, then you obviously disagree with granting illegals amnesty, and giving them free education and medical care, and driver's licenses. All of those things work against the scenario you described.

With you 100%.

You read me correctly.

“Keep your elbow up!"

[skydyvr 0]

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>Care to actually make a case that Lamm's words are off track?

OK.

No time to go toe to toe with you, and I do agree with many of your points.

However, the fears I have about this wave of immigration is:

- the fact that they're doing it illegally, which has lead to them not paying into a system from which they recieve benefits, which has become a back-breaking strain on our economy.

- the sheer numbers. Dig up all the "per-capita" comparisions you'd like, but the number of latinos pouring in here illegally is unprecedented. And some of them are indeed criminals.

- lack of assimilation. I am fully aware of the advantages of "diversity concepts", and in fact lecture on it at work. But what we are seeing is not going down the right road, again due to the huge numbers and their illegal status, and a lack of desire from many of them to be "multicultural" or show any appreciation for the culture of the land they came to.

. . =(_8^(1)

[kallend 2,115]

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OH MY GOD!!! AMERICA IS GOING TO HELL IN A HANDBASKET!!!

Uh, have you looked at any international stats lately? We ARE going downhill, and fast.

What do YOU think the cause(s) might be?

Debt. Corporate Greed. Debt. Greed. And more Debt.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[skydyvr 0]

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Debt. Corporate Greed. Debt. Greed. And more Debt.

Agreed, that is one cause.

Add an underfunded education system run by people with stupid ideas, an "all about me" materialistic, energy wasting shallow media driven culture, illegal immigration, and two political parties that are slowly sucking our rights away, and you've got it summed up pretty well.

. . =(_8^(1)

[kelpdiver 2]

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'Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high school.'

This is the only part with some signficant truth. The rapidly growing Latino population is not ascending the wealth ladder. There are enough people that the need to switch to English to survive is not there as it was for past immigrant waves, but it is still necessary to do so to advance into middle class.

This could stablize, or it could result in a significant minority (or majority) of the population all in the poor class. It is always striking when you travel to south to Latin America and see that there are the rich, and the poor, and very few in between. And I think it tends to keep those countries in the developing world in that developing state.

[billvon 3,088]

>the fact that they're doing it illegally . . .

Yes, I agree this is a big problem. We should solve the problem both by making it much easier for people who want to work legally to do so, and by making it much harder for people to immigrate illegally.

>the sheer numbers. Dig up all the "per-capita" comparisions you'd like . . .

OK.

In 1910, every year we were taking in one immigrant for every 11 people in the US.

In 2000, we were taking in one immigrant for every 100 people in the US.

I can't see any rational argument for the claim that 1910 was just fine, but now there are just so many immigrants that our culture is being overwhelmed. If we survived a 9% immigration rate, we can survive a 1% rate.

>lack of assimilation. I am fully aware of the advantages of "diversity
>concepts", and in fact lecture on it at work. But what we are seeing is not
>going down the right road, again due to the huge numbers and their illegal
>status, and a lack of desire from many of them to be "multicultural" or
>show any appreciation for the culture of the land they came to.

Again, this goes back to the 1700's - and we survived that. I'm not worried.

[jakee 1,569]

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In 1910, every year we were taking in one immigrant for every 11 people in the US.

And 7 years later was embroiled in a global conflict. Co-incidence?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[kelpdiver 2]

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In 1910, every year we were taking in one immigrant for every 11 people in the US.

In 2000, we were taking in one immigrant for every 100 people in the US.

I can't see any rational argument for the claim that 1910 was just fine, but now there are just so many immigrants that our culture is being overwhelmed. If we survived a 9% immigration rate, we can survive a 1% rate.

That's pretty simplistic thinking for you, Bill.

US Population in 1910 (census) was 92M. US Population in 2007 is estimated at 301M. Usable land mass of the country has increased far less than 200%.

The Colorado River wasn't running dry short of the Sea of Cortez back then. Infrastructure is quite stretched in many regions now, so just because immigration is now 1/3rd of what it is in 1911, doesn't make is easily sustainable. At some point we pass a tipping point. (SoCal may well have already done so)

[kelpdiver 2]

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In 1910, every year we were taking in one immigrant for every 11 people in the US.

And 7 years later was embroiled in a global conflict. Co-incidence?

In this case, quite.

US immigration levels had nothing to do with WWI. That war was going to happen.

[billvon 3,088]

>The Colorado River wasn't running dry . . . .

If your point is that our population is becoming too big for our resources, I agree. However, I disagree with the theory that "our culture is being destroyed" by having too many immigrants who refuse to become (culturally) like us. The problem was almost ten times worse in 1910, and we survived then.