There Has Been a Lack of Bush Bashing Iraq Posts Lately

[lawrocket 3]

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and his administration were directly responsible for lowering the interest rates far beyond the point that the market would suggest they be.

http://www.homefinders.com/historical-interest-rates/images/Mortgage%20Rates%202-l.gif

Looks like during the clinton Presidency, Clinton took the interest rates from 8.12 to 9.33 and down to 6.9. You can see it fell further under Bush.

And, as I'm sure you know, Alan Greenspan was the Chairman of the fed from 1987-2006 - whihc spanned this period you discussed.

Note that the low-interest rates in 1998-1999 were designed to increase styart-up capital for the dot-com bubble. Over 1999-2000, the fed continued to increase the interest rate in order to slow the investment down. In March, 2000, the NASDAQ was at twice the value (yes, TWICE the value) of March, 1999.

Then the NASDAQ tanked. It was estimated that the dot-com market lost 5 trillion in its on-paper worth between March, 2000 and October, 2002 (6.7 Trillion market worth to 1.6 trillion).

5.1 TRILLION DOLLARS!!!

Note that the drop in the interest rates coincided with this. Greenspan, acting on behalf of the administration, lowered interest rates to spur borrowing for venture capital. Then, in order to slow down the mania, the interest rates were increased.

The rates were probably TOO low, and it spurred TOO much money movement. Lower than it should have been.

Then again, check when the fed makes huges cuts. August, 1984. September 17, 2001. And in the wake of the dot-com bust. They are intended to spur inflation.

Related? Yes. Highly related. Both results of monetary policy.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Lucky... 0]

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STFU back

damn the "double STFU back" I stand correcteed and will now.........STFU

Me too

I'm about sick of the sarcasm from you two, both of you STFU!!! It's inapropriate

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to STFU and go to the gym

[Lucky... 0]

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So, I thought posting one of the reasons why made sense.

Anybody seen this on the big 4?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article3346386.ece

It certainly seems that Iraq is back to normal.

Year US Deaths
2003 486
2004 849
2005 846
2006 822
2007 901

Hey sir,

when you get a war where spit wads and nerf balls are the ammo you will have a point!!

Kallend was simply stating that the war shouldn't have fallen out of topic since deaths are still high, he wasn't talking means of fighting, as you are attemptng to morph.

It is all about context. More died in training camps for WW2. Death count is a pointless meaningless emotional statement. Quite simple really

Tht should sooth all who lost family and friends..... see the remark to Neal

[rushmc 23]

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So, I thought posting one of the reasons why made sense.

Anybody seen this on the big 4?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article3346386.ece

It certainly seems that Iraq is back to normal.

Year US Deaths
2003 486
2004 849
2005 846
2006 822
2007 901

Hey sir,

when you get a war where spit wads and nerf balls are the ammo you will have a point!!

Kallend was simply stating that the war shouldn't have fallen out of topic since deaths are still high, he wasn't talking means of fighting, as you are attemptng to morph.

It is all about context. More died in training camps for WW2. Death count is a pointless meaningless emotional statement. Quite simple really

Tht should sooth all who lost family and friends..... see the remark to Neal

aaahhhhhhhh WHAT?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,150]

It's pretty clear that you just don't understand how insulting you are to our troops in Iraq.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Royd 0]

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How bout you understand that I don't do that. I was in the military for 1 term and think the troops are great, just the politicians that absolute idiot garbage elects are the problem.

So now you
're taking shots at everyone who doesn't think exactly like you. No partisanship in that mind of yours, is there?

[Royd 0]

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No, they are 901 DEAD AMERICANS in 2007, not propaganda. Propaganda is the White House saying for the umpteenth time that we have turned the corner.

How many died turning the corner in the European theatre in WW2 in one battle?

What a waste of blood and treasure.

[rushmc 23]

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It's pretty clear that you just don't understand how insulting you are to our troops in Iraq.

No one here has more respect pride and admiration for those in our military. You got your bull shit comment thrown back in your face and you . like Harry Reid, are trying to turn it so you dont look so stupid. Keep trying

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Royd 0]

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president who was voted in by the most moronic POS Americans. The troops who get injured, die or just serve in this war are NO DIFFERENT than WWII troops, revolutionary war troops, etc.... The sacrifice is the sacrifice, even if enough idiots elect a criminal to lead us into a POS war, it's all the same to the troops. Find where I've stated otherwise.

Unless, of course, some of those same warriors helped to get him elected. Right?

[akarunway 1]

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So, I thought posting one of the reasons why made sense.

Anybody seen this on the big 4?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article3346386.ece

Documents like the Niger yellowcake maybe. Prolly more US propaganda. Them fuckers ain't gonna give in.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[akarunway 1]

"No soldiers ever dies in vain in combat"------------------------------------------------------------------------------That is the biggest lie I have ever heard spewed on this website. They (the military or whomever) sure as fuck have indocrinated you well sir. Sad

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[rushmc 23]

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"No soldiers ever dies in vain in combat"------------------------------------------------------------------------------That is the biggest lie I have ever heard spewed on this website. They (the military or whomever) sure as fuck have indocrinated you well sir. Sad

HE is indocrinated???

Oh shit thanks for that one

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Lucky... 0]

>>>>>>>>>>>>Another strategy by Bush and the Republicans to draw voter attention away from Iraq. Those evil dogs.

That would infer that Bush has some control, which we know is not true. The economy is fucked due to gross mismanagement, simply as a byproduct.

>>>>>>>>>>>>Indeed, and it sucks to know that somewhere, somebody may actually be happy. Such people clearly don't care about anything other than themselves, and must be made to join the society of equal misery among all.

But enough about elitist lawyers who hate the thought of poor people with healthcare. Nice to see you defending your party tho

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Actually, I think you've hit it right on the head! "Appal-ogizing." HA! It IS appaling.

And so I typo, I'[ve gone thru [ages of your typing errors and said nothing - are you out of things to remark about? Pathetic after reading your typos.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>There are a few million pages that have been written about the topic.

Yea, the context was about the desensitization of US deaths, but you, Mr typo error who corrects everyone for typos, doesn't even keep it in context or, "..." Wait, I'm dealing with an attny, why am I surprised at idiotic, abstract logic?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Yes. The times were so bad that Nixon was viewed as a "unifying force." And, your hero McGovern was put out there - too bad the population hated him. The guy only won Massachussetts and DC - the worst showing up till Mondale.


Nice to see you continue to defend your party (Nixon) and smal mine (McGovern). Some things never change . Let's talk about Nixon / Agnew. Agnew had just resigned for tax evasion and Nixon was square in the middle of Watergate, yet the idiot American voters reelected him.


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gonna "analize" them? Wow! Talk about getting it up the wazoo!!! You are on FIRE!!


The word, "analyze" would have the unofficial root word, "anal" even if I spelled it with the y rather than the i. I would think a lawyer like you who constantly misspells words would refrain from correcting other's misspellings. You know when a poster is out of gas when they resort to spelling and punctuation; what's next, syntax?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>1) Iraq - yeah. He should have never gone in.
2) Iran potential - not gonna happen till we get out of Iraq.
3) Recession - There is concern, but the dominant thought among those in the know is it probably won't happen.
4) Doubled house prices and mortgage melddown - Bush had as much to do with that as Clinton did with the dot-com bust. Very, very little.
5) tripled gas prices - I seems to recall paying 2.39 per gallon once in 1996. Are we paying $7.00/gallon now?
6) 3.9 trillion in debt increase - okay. No arguing about that. By the way, how has the Dem Congress done at reeling it in?
7) Loss of Constitutional protections / wiretapping / Habeus Corpus / etc - thank goodness those Reagan and Bush appointees in the courts are ruling against the Admin left and right.
8) Am I forgetting a few? - Probably hundreds.



4) Bush's tactic of lowering taxes and his giveaway in the midst of his war hobby was part of it. Altho you like it, but the lowering taxes for corps is largely what caused it, had to lower the int rate to keep the economy half-ass stimulated, that gave sellers license to raise house prices as the payment would be the same, thn started the pyramid scheme type efect.

5) I don't think so, as for the gas prices of 2.39 in 96. Can you support that? Furthermore, gas was 1.20 at the highest, more like about a buck when your pres took office and you know it.

6) The Dem congress has shoved bills in front of Mr no veto, then he found his pen. When the dems get in, they'll lose their pen and + things will get done.

7) Lawrocket wrote: thank goodness those Reagan and Bush appointees in the courts are ruling against the Admin left and right.

Hardly, they rubberstamp many things. But again, you have to support your party.

>>>>>>>>>>>>We've been that way since, oh, the late 70's. You don't know where I grew up, boy. Nobody ave a shit what was goign on in my neighborhood.

Nor do I care where u grew up. If I were a lawyer w/o an argument I would make a comment on the misisng letter and the misspelling, now I just realize it's just what happens on posting boards.

[akarunway 1]

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"No soldiers ever dies in vain in combat"------------------------------------------------------------------------------That is the biggest lie I have ever heard spewed on this website. They (the military or whomever) sure as fuck have indocrinated you well sir. Sad

HE is indocrinated???

Oh shit thanks for that one

I don't know. I spent my time in. They TRIED to indoctrinate me. I told them to get fucked after a short while. I was smart enough to have and OUT. Them stupid fucks wanted to put me in Nuke school and cut my nuts off. NOT. I think for myself unlike most the sheep out there.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[Lucky... 0]

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No, they are 901 DEAD AMERICANS in 2007, not propaganda. Propaganda is the White House saying for the umpteenth time that we have turned the corner.

I must agree with kallend. Those are our men and women dying in that place. 900 of them last year. And they are dying at the same - or greater - pace as any other time during this conflict.

I do not disagree that even one death is significant and tragic. But the bs twist he aimed back had nothing of any significance to even think of replying to. One of his typical fish bait tosses

You asked why the lack of Bush-bashing threads, he replied that the war is still killing many good kids, hence there's plenty to be bashing about. Tell me, how is it that he was out of line, off topic or otherwise twisting anything?

[Lucky... 0]

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he (alone or via his administration) played a significant role in creating the problem

Then would you say that Clinton's administration pleayed a significant role in the creating of the dot-com bust? After all, Enron was named by Forbes as America's Most Innovative Company for six years running! Was it not during Clinton's watch that the sham accounting and investing was being done?

Indeed, was not the economic climate for these fraudulent accounting practices displayed throughout the 1990's? The collapse happened just before 9/11. And the dot-com bubble started bursting in 2000 - leading to three non-consecutive uarters of negative growth between summer 2000 and fall, 2001.

The interest rates were low. Unemployment low. Tax revenues peaked. Was Clinton responsible?

I established, as well as jcd11235 did so independantly that Bush's constant lowering of the int rate thru Greenspan was what caused house prices to soar. So how is that connected to the DOT.COM bust? Diff deal, dif era, alltogether different.

[Lucky... 0]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>Looks like during the clinton Presidency, Clinton took the interest rates from 8.12 to 9.33 and down to 6.9. You can see it fell further under Bush.

And, as I'm sure you know, Alan Greenspan was the Chairman of the fed from 1987-2006 - whihc spanned this period you discussed.


The pres can fire theChair of the fed, he had no issue with the lowering of the rate. What happen as that Bush gave away the 236B Clinton left, lowered int taxes and then the economy stagnated. The fed then lwered the rate to keep the economy struggling. Sorry, but your pres fucked it up. BTW, you misspelled aword, if I were you I would make fun, as it is I realize that happens in long posts.

[Lucky... 0]

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How bout you understand that I don't do that. I was in the military for 1 term and think the troops are great, just the politicians that absolute idiot garbage elects are the problem.

So now you
're taking shots at everyone who doesn't think exactly like you. No partisanship in that mind of yours, is there?

No, the ______ said that I was talking shit about the troops, I asked his to show me where I've ever done that. Then reminded him that I was once a GI enlisted. Explin your false statement for me.

[Royd 0]

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If I were a lawyer w/o an argument I would make a comment on the misisng letter and the misspelling, now I just realize it's just what happens on posting boards.

Not if you were taught to proofread your own material before turning it in for a grade.

[warpedskydiver 0]

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"No soldiers ever dies in vain in combat"------------------------------------------------------------------------------That is the biggest lie I have ever heard spewed on this website. They (the military or whomever) sure as fuck have indocrinated you well sir. Sad

What exactly qualifies you to speak on the subject, and what qualifies you to say Dan is wrong?

[jcd11235 0]

First, your link is completely irrelevant. The consumers who obtained fixed rate mortgages are not the ones in trouble. They may be living in houses that are mortgaged for more than they're currently worth, but so long as their housing budget doesn't decrease, they should be okay. They just don't have the option of selling their homes without losing money. That's a good thing in the big picture, because it helps keep supply down in a slow housing market. The people who took out ARMs that they didn't realize they couldn't afford from lenders who didn't care because they know the mortgages would be sold off prior to any problems are the consumers that are in trouble, the ones that are facing foreclosures and undermining the mortgage backed securities market.

The 1990s were a period of great economic growth, and the technology market offered plenty of opportunity for innovation and improved efficiency. Unfortunately, we also saw tech stocks overvalued. Larger companies often paid too much to buy start-ups that were little more than partially developed ideas. There was a lot of speculation, and poor business decisions. The tech market was largely a new one, and it's future was unclear, without much history to analyze to make predictions.

Mortgages, on the other hand, have been around for a long time. It is pretty well known how the housing markets reacts from different stimuli. There was much criticism to the continued lowering of the interest rates. The housing bubble was foreseen. Even Greenspan saw it. He even goes so far as to say the "political establishment" would not have found higher interest rates acceptable. (He also argues that raising the interest rates higher or faster would not have helped, that the housing bubble was inevitable, but many of his critics disagree.)

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[kelpdiver 2]

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I established, as well as jcd11235 did so independantly that Bush's constant lowering of the int rate thru Greenspan was what caused house prices to soar. So how is that connected to the DOT.COM bust? Diff deal, dif era, alltogether different.

You must also consider the impact of the 1997 change to the capital gains allowance for real estate sales. Moving from a one time 125k exemption to a 250/500k every two years exemption certainly contributed to some of the runup, and laid the grounds for casual flippers to speculate. The easy money of this decade was the fuel to that engine.

[GQ_jumper 4]

"No soldiers ever dies in vain in combat"------------------------------------------------------------------------------That is the biggest lie I have ever heard spewed on this website. They (the military or whomever) sure as fuck have indocrinated you well sir. Sad

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Knock me all you want but do't you dare knock those who continue to lay it all on the line for you. Just because you chose to talk a different path in life makes you no smarter or better than any of us and th fact that you think it does is a true sign of ignorance. I say that no soldier dies for nothing because regardless of why we are there or whose policies we are fighting for we're there with our teammates so we have something worth fighting for despite how meaningless the war itself is. If you can't understand that than I'm glad you got out, trust me, it was no loss to us.

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower

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[lawrocket 3]

The lowering of interest rates through Greenspan under Clinton caused tech stock prices to soar due to the venture capital being invested. Then, the market corrected itself - to the tune of 5.1 trillion dollars.

The point - either Clinton and Bush had a lot to do with the growing and bursting of their respective bubbles
OR
They both had little to do with them.

I do not believe that one had effect and the other did not.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[kelpdiver 2]

the linkage between interest rates and the real estate market is more direct.

The dot com boom was not about cheap money, but the notion that things were different. Eyeballs were more important than profits. Adding dotcom to your name tripled your value. This wasn't because of cheap money (which was still very expensive by the standards of this decade).